Vinland, the Land of Wealth and Ambition
- Status
Because like I said, I pushed in and did things with a mix of too fast and too slow (the latter was trying to compensate for being too fast on some things).
Although now that I think of it, I probably won't be restarting the TL and if I did I would keep it in a separate thread and also update this one every once in a While but because of many original Ideas of mine I plan to use in this thread and copying them in another seems bland
So like I said, still able to type but keyboard is going whacky so while I can still type it is much harder so it will take longer to get new update sorry.
The everyday lad wouldn't be worth his weight to be sent across the sea but a handful of Nobles and their servants who couldn't find any place in the rest of Europe to take them in could find their way there
The everyday lad wouldn't be worth his weight to be sent across the sea but a handful of Nobles and their servants who couldn't find any place in the rest of Europe to take them in could find their way there
Uff Da the optimist
Donor
Who in Scandinavia, if any, has the "best" claim to rule over Vinland?
Just wondering in case Norwegian and Danish kings start warring over the rights to Vinland when they realize it's size, population and untapped resources.
They didn't have bureucrats back then, but surely someone soon returning to the courts of Europe must go "so, there are leagues upon leagues of awesome land filled to the brim with fish and grazing grounds for livestock. Did I mention the trees are killer for ship-building? Oh, and any resisting natives are few in number and have inferior weaponry"
Just wondering in case Norwegian and Danish kings start warring over the rights to Vinland when they realize it's size, population and untapped resources.
They didn't have bureucrats back then, but surely someone soon returning to the courts of Europe must go "so, there are leagues upon leagues of awesome land filled to the brim with fish and grazing grounds for livestock. Did I mention the trees are killer for ship-building? Oh, and any resisting natives are few in number and have inferior weaponry"
Well given how well equipped the armies the Vinnish are able to raise and due to them being physically larger due to a higher protein diet and the fact they would be fighting on home turf would mean men from across the sea couldn't conquer it by conventional means, and given around this point the population of Leifrvalde is around 38,000 they could raise a pretty substantial force.
However who knows what could happen if trickery is thrown in the mix
Just found this today, and love it so far. Keep it up! Subbed!
good, I should be releasing a new piece soon and I just got the keyboard fixed so should be easier to pump it out
Whats the biggest city in the new world at this time and what is it's population?
Also, is the population in the new world sustained by natural growth or immigration?
Also, is the population in the new world sustained by natural growth or immigration?
Well the average couple would have around seven children and they would have the first nearly at the beginning of marriage and given how it's been a better part of a century that the colonies have been around most population increase is natural at this point but there are increases with immigration and imports of slaves.
Okay so I'll give a short list of the size of all the towns/settlements
Thorkelsborg: 7,500 or so, surrounding area about 5,000 or more
Nawahlid: 6,000 or so, surrounding area 4,000 or more (due to rich farmland)
Leifsbudir: 3,000 or so, surrounding area 5,000 or more
Karlsfjord: 2,500 or so, surrounding area around 600
Bjarnystad: 2,000 or so (seerly limited population due to island having limited freshwater) surrounding area 0 (it's ocean lol)
Snorrisborg: 1,800 or so, surrounding area 2,000 or more
Leifsfjord: 850 or so, surrounding area 1,000 or so
Gudridsfjord: 700 or so, surrounding area 1,000 or so
Olafstad: 500 or so, surrounding area 1,000 or so
Other small towns, villages and settlements not included.
Total population: Approximately 50,700
Last edited:
19
Been awhile since the last update but hope you people enjoy it.
It's almost time for the time OTL the viking age was coming to an end, will it survive or will it end the same way? Work your brains because it's going to get heated and with the death of the leader of Leifrvalde (Name for the "allthing" and government of all the land colonized, named after his death).
1060-1065
Harald Sigurdsson also known as Harald Hardrada, was attempting to receive as much funds possible to employ the armies needed to keep Sweden and Denmark under pacification. He was having trouble holding his empire together and his ambitions of launching a large scale invasion of the Norman territories seemed far fetched. He had desperately looked for a means of large capital and was able to gain some funds from the church and had raised a large Army with the funds, but it was not enough to take on the Normans or Harthacnut. However the recent colds to the North had weakened Iceland and had demanded tribute from the Icelandic Allthing where the Allthing had blatantly refused and according to the Norwegians gave the messenger a Blood Eagle, however modern historians generally agree this was probably perpetrated by the Norwegian crown to justify an invasion of Iceland.
With the harvest gathered in England Harald Hardrada had sent thirty-one ships with around a thousand and a half warriors to Iceland to enforce the tribute and offer 'protection' to the Allthing. When the Norwegian ships were fired upon by arrows Harald Hardrada had decided to take the Allthing under his control. Many of the wealthy who had taken a rise in land ownership due to large amounts of the populace migrating to Vinland had led to a unofficial 'noble' class rising in Iceland ever since Leifrvalde became popular with the growth increasing dramatically since the horrid winters that left the North bare, Harald had gotten some of them to join his cause and willingly become his vassals.
With the support of many of the wealthy houses he was able to conquer Iceland barely needing to fight given most land was owned by the wealthy and had belonged to them and their servants. While the free Icelandic Identity was in decline, it was not entirely wiped clean. The Free men of Iceland, led by Ulf Rolfsson had led around one thousand poorly equipped and had used hit and run tactics against the Norwegian army but chased into a valley where half the force was divided as half was able to escape but the other half had faced the Norwegian army head on. Ulf Rolfsson himself led the battle against the Norwegians, the battle surprisingly waged on for five hours before the Norwegians killed every man in the battle including Ulf Rolfsson. His son Arne Ulfsson had led the women and children of the soldiers and the half that had retreated onto the collective boats they had and believing the war lost had led the civilians out of Iceland to Greenland where some immigrated south to Vinland; However many had stayed in Greenland and rebuilt the old settlements there. The co-Paramount Chiefs of Leifrvalde had welcomed the immigration and made Arne Ulfsson Chieftain of Greenland as there hadn't been a paramount chieftain of Greenland in decades and was left primarily to self rule.
The Norwegian king was surprisingly pleased with the result given how he would have either killed or exiled the families of the men who fought against him anyways. He was however worried about the exiles in Greenland attacking Iceland again, given how his attention was needed in England and Scandinavia he could not risk attacking Greenland and possibly get into a fight with the remaining forces there and the large possibility of them being supported by the large and well equipped army of Leifrvalde. With his army sent back to Norway, Harald had gotten his Icelandic supporters to root out any discontent and exile them to Greenland. He had also bestowed upon the wealthy who had supported him Nobility ranks equal to those in Scandinavia and had local men be used for the local garrisons.
The colonies of Greenland had been nearly abandoned but with the refugee influx it had sprung back to life with many of the abandoned settlements being reestablished. It was around this time that the first Skraelings had made landing in Greenland, oddly enough they were well aware of the existence of the Norse and had several Iron and Wool Items on them. They had come because they wanted to reach land that they believed the Norse were coming from due to famine in their homes in the Hellulands. They lived peacefully with the Norse and Greenland begun to grow back into a major Economic center with exporting many Ivory and Furs to Iceland, the rest of the Leifrvalde, and to some extent Europe.
The opinions of Leifrvalde and the Paramount Chiefs among the former Icelanders were indifferent with a slight amount of distrust and bother due to the Allthing of Leifrvalde being much like the Icelandic Allthing for the most part but the Paramount Chief(s) could overrule any decision if they pleased. While they did not revolt openly they had desired to be independent but due to much of the men being killed in Iceland they did not have the numbers let alone large amounts of fighting age males in said population. Gudbrand and Birger Bjarnysson knew this and considered allowing them independence because while Greenland was making an economical comeback it was nothing compared to the Hustle and Bustle of Saeturland, Frelsiland, Hnetaland, and Vinland.
In Nawahlid the City walls were being expanded and had now used a primitive type of Cement that was made from Lime, crushed stone, and sand. It was built very roughly and simply, using wooden frames it was poured with large amounts of stones and filling the gaps for each level of stones making up only around fifteen percent of the Walls mass. It took many years to do this and at this point in time was still going on. The defenses of Nawahlid was the best in Leifrvalde and given it's importance as a center of trade it was starting to become one of the wealthiest towns only second to Thorkellsborg. Due to the usage of Lime products in the town it was called ' The City of lime ' by the Merchants. Attempts were made to build bridges across the river but they had failed.
In Grunnland colonists had settled on an Island and butchered all the natives on it, they founded Bjartestad (otl Matinicus Island). There were ten other Islands in the archipelago that they colonized to some extant, they had mostly let loose sheep and goats on the grassy crag Islands like many other places in the Nyrfold as to mark Norse presence. The colony had thrived with trade and was growing Large amounts of grain but had to defend the coastline against some Skraeling attacks but otherwise had little other problems.
In Iberia the Norse who had helped the "Emperor" of Spain, Ferdinand the first who had recently gained the title from the papacy; had settled in conquered territory. The Emperor had gotten many Norse to fight under his banner as with the Christianization of Scandinavia was leading to less raids on Christian targets and given the distance of non-Christians (Baltic's are an Exception) this led traditional viking raids mostly absent but with the Emperor of Spain offering employment many had gone the distance to live in more fertile lands and raid large amounts of treasure. With Norse Pirates being the spearhead force Lisbona was attacked and it's walls breached followed by the main Spanish force who then completely took the city and the surrounding county. The Emperor had no vassals who he wanted to govern the new Province but the leader of the Norse force was named Rollo Olafsson, the name Rollo historically is known for the first duke of Normandy and was a Norseman.
Thinking it was a wise choice as Rollo Olafsson was very hungry for the spoils of war and given how the new province was on the edge of Christian lands such qualities were favored and he was skilled at warfare along with being a devout convert. Ferdinand had allowed him the title of count and gifted him half the spoils of the conquest personally and had the rest of the spoils given to his men with the exception of half the looted food stores which were needed to feed the Spanish army. As a first order, Rollo had purged all Muslims but allowed some mercy to the small population of Druze and Jews in the area. With large swathes of Muslims killed and large amounts of land up for settlement many of the Norse fighters had gotten their families to cultivate the abandoned farms. Rollo had also sent his men to constantly harass the already unstable and failing Taifas, his goal was to secure the Strait of Gibraltar and to gain the Enormous wealth that came from such. While he was a typical viking that enjoyed war and battle but he also took interest in the stone masonry of the Spanish and the Taifas, he had taken interest and copied Norman Motte and Bailey forts but using rudimentary stone working and used it to establish rule over inland territories.
The Spanish along the coast had gotten very good relation with Norse trade partners who had traded looted items and the ones who had colonized the Islands to the west had brought in large amounts of fish and bought mainly salt. Sometimes items from a Land even further west than the Islands had made their way to their markets, but going from the Hietteyjar to Leifrvalde was a very hard journey and only those experienced in the journey had any hope of jumping across the Atlantic. However the Great ships built from the enormous trees of Saeturland were being used to traverse the deeper waters of the Mid-Atlantic and only those large ships were capable of storing enough cargo and food supplies to make it across the Atlantic and profitable let alone actually surviving the trip. The Norse who lived in the area had adopted Basque and Arab ship techniques and they were more suitable for Atlantic crossings and after a period of years it slowly spread to Leifrvalde but not so much to Scandinavia given the inefficiency the additions would bring in Northern waters.
In The Taifas fear was rampant in the nobility, many were trying to secure safe havens to the south and west because sooner or later they believed the Spanish would take them; The new wave of Brutality of the Norse did not ease their minds either. While they had been warring with each other trying to reunite the great Al-Andalus that had fallen decades before they had now stopped in an uneasy cease-fire. They had allied with other Taifas but they never allied as a whole, even if they did the Emperor Ferdinand could convince the Frankish or the Pope for assistance if they were to cause a notable threat. Even if that were not true the manner of warfare and psychological warfare the Norse introduced that the Spanish were picking up on had been very detrimental to the troops; raise an army in seven villages to attack, instead of defending the enemy avoids most engagements and attack civilians directly. The Spanish had done this but the Norse were known to attack the specific places the nearest army's home and even demand tribute for the captured civilian's lives who were often times family of the soldiers. However many times the Norse did not find it practical to do such and saw it better to Pillage and Burn leaving only ashed in their wake. This of course led the course of battle to be mostly on the defensive for the Arabs, they had requested support from the south but other than meager grain supplies and weapons there was no help at this point in time.
Saeturland was thriving at this point in time, food was abundant and buisness was booming with the finest ship building in the Norse world. The copper miners went deeper and deeper inland to get their hands on copper, with this copper it became the center for minting most coins. Coins as currency were becoming more common as they were being minted more and more often, they were beginning to become accepted in Iceland and large Merchants in Norway. Other than ship building and coinage, there was another economic boom Saeturland had that is the reason for it's name: Maple syrup. Maple Syrup and Sugar of Saeturland were the only source of it and attempting it with maples in Europe were inefficient and very bitter but were mixed with the imported sugar and syrup to overcome the problem of bitterness. It was primarily eaten by Nobles and wealthy on Holidays and days of celebration, other than that it was too expensive to ship oversea for most people.
Salt was something the people of Leifrvalde did not have much of, they mostly went without and got it from Animal tissue or imported it. However on the North side of the Bjarnystad Islands salt was discovered, demand was high for salt and instantly the trade that was already existent in Bjarnystad skyrocketed and salt mining opened, however given it was an Island it took massive work to maintain the small mines which increased the price. Eventually it began to flood and while it was fought off there was always water and men would have to dive with a tool to get chunks of rock salt and bring it out, many men's eyes were heavily damaged after being induced to the heavy amounts of salt in the water induced to their eyes when going underwater.
In England Harthacnut died in his sleep and it was later theorized it was poison, to support this theory Thorfinn Sigurdsson begun his march just after a few hours he had gotten sick and died. With no heirs the forces under Harthacnut surrendered to Thorfinn Sigurdsson but some defected to William of Normandy or Harald Hardrada. With this the Scottish crown was at it's most powerful point in history yet, with more fertile lands to cultivate the crown could support a larger army.
It's almost time for the time OTL the viking age was coming to an end, will it survive or will it end the same way? Work your brains because it's going to get heated and with the death of the leader of Leifrvalde (Name for the "allthing" and government of all the land colonized, named after his death).
1060-1065
Harald Sigurdsson also known as Harald Hardrada, was attempting to receive as much funds possible to employ the armies needed to keep Sweden and Denmark under pacification. He was having trouble holding his empire together and his ambitions of launching a large scale invasion of the Norman territories seemed far fetched. He had desperately looked for a means of large capital and was able to gain some funds from the church and had raised a large Army with the funds, but it was not enough to take on the Normans or Harthacnut. However the recent colds to the North had weakened Iceland and had demanded tribute from the Icelandic Allthing where the Allthing had blatantly refused and according to the Norwegians gave the messenger a Blood Eagle, however modern historians generally agree this was probably perpetrated by the Norwegian crown to justify an invasion of Iceland.
With the harvest gathered in England Harald Hardrada had sent thirty-one ships with around a thousand and a half warriors to Iceland to enforce the tribute and offer 'protection' to the Allthing. When the Norwegian ships were fired upon by arrows Harald Hardrada had decided to take the Allthing under his control. Many of the wealthy who had taken a rise in land ownership due to large amounts of the populace migrating to Vinland had led to a unofficial 'noble' class rising in Iceland ever since Leifrvalde became popular with the growth increasing dramatically since the horrid winters that left the North bare, Harald had gotten some of them to join his cause and willingly become his vassals.
With the support of many of the wealthy houses he was able to conquer Iceland barely needing to fight given most land was owned by the wealthy and had belonged to them and their servants. While the free Icelandic Identity was in decline, it was not entirely wiped clean. The Free men of Iceland, led by Ulf Rolfsson had led around one thousand poorly equipped and had used hit and run tactics against the Norwegian army but chased into a valley where half the force was divided as half was able to escape but the other half had faced the Norwegian army head on. Ulf Rolfsson himself led the battle against the Norwegians, the battle surprisingly waged on for five hours before the Norwegians killed every man in the battle including Ulf Rolfsson. His son Arne Ulfsson had led the women and children of the soldiers and the half that had retreated onto the collective boats they had and believing the war lost had led the civilians out of Iceland to Greenland where some immigrated south to Vinland; However many had stayed in Greenland and rebuilt the old settlements there. The co-Paramount Chiefs of Leifrvalde had welcomed the immigration and made Arne Ulfsson Chieftain of Greenland as there hadn't been a paramount chieftain of Greenland in decades and was left primarily to self rule.
The Norwegian king was surprisingly pleased with the result given how he would have either killed or exiled the families of the men who fought against him anyways. He was however worried about the exiles in Greenland attacking Iceland again, given how his attention was needed in England and Scandinavia he could not risk attacking Greenland and possibly get into a fight with the remaining forces there and the large possibility of them being supported by the large and well equipped army of Leifrvalde. With his army sent back to Norway, Harald had gotten his Icelandic supporters to root out any discontent and exile them to Greenland. He had also bestowed upon the wealthy who had supported him Nobility ranks equal to those in Scandinavia and had local men be used for the local garrisons.
The colonies of Greenland had been nearly abandoned but with the refugee influx it had sprung back to life with many of the abandoned settlements being reestablished. It was around this time that the first Skraelings had made landing in Greenland, oddly enough they were well aware of the existence of the Norse and had several Iron and Wool Items on them. They had come because they wanted to reach land that they believed the Norse were coming from due to famine in their homes in the Hellulands. They lived peacefully with the Norse and Greenland begun to grow back into a major Economic center with exporting many Ivory and Furs to Iceland, the rest of the Leifrvalde, and to some extent Europe.
The opinions of Leifrvalde and the Paramount Chiefs among the former Icelanders were indifferent with a slight amount of distrust and bother due to the Allthing of Leifrvalde being much like the Icelandic Allthing for the most part but the Paramount Chief(s) could overrule any decision if they pleased. While they did not revolt openly they had desired to be independent but due to much of the men being killed in Iceland they did not have the numbers let alone large amounts of fighting age males in said population. Gudbrand and Birger Bjarnysson knew this and considered allowing them independence because while Greenland was making an economical comeback it was nothing compared to the Hustle and Bustle of Saeturland, Frelsiland, Hnetaland, and Vinland.
In Nawahlid the City walls were being expanded and had now used a primitive type of Cement that was made from Lime, crushed stone, and sand. It was built very roughly and simply, using wooden frames it was poured with large amounts of stones and filling the gaps for each level of stones making up only around fifteen percent of the Walls mass. It took many years to do this and at this point in time was still going on. The defenses of Nawahlid was the best in Leifrvalde and given it's importance as a center of trade it was starting to become one of the wealthiest towns only second to Thorkellsborg. Due to the usage of Lime products in the town it was called ' The City of lime ' by the Merchants. Attempts were made to build bridges across the river but they had failed.
In Grunnland colonists had settled on an Island and butchered all the natives on it, they founded Bjartestad (otl Matinicus Island). There were ten other Islands in the archipelago that they colonized to some extant, they had mostly let loose sheep and goats on the grassy crag Islands like many other places in the Nyrfold as to mark Norse presence. The colony had thrived with trade and was growing Large amounts of grain but had to defend the coastline against some Skraeling attacks but otherwise had little other problems.
In Iberia the Norse who had helped the "Emperor" of Spain, Ferdinand the first who had recently gained the title from the papacy; had settled in conquered territory. The Emperor had gotten many Norse to fight under his banner as with the Christianization of Scandinavia was leading to less raids on Christian targets and given the distance of non-Christians (Baltic's are an Exception) this led traditional viking raids mostly absent but with the Emperor of Spain offering employment many had gone the distance to live in more fertile lands and raid large amounts of treasure. With Norse Pirates being the spearhead force Lisbona was attacked and it's walls breached followed by the main Spanish force who then completely took the city and the surrounding county. The Emperor had no vassals who he wanted to govern the new Province but the leader of the Norse force was named Rollo Olafsson, the name Rollo historically is known for the first duke of Normandy and was a Norseman.
Thinking it was a wise choice as Rollo Olafsson was very hungry for the spoils of war and given how the new province was on the edge of Christian lands such qualities were favored and he was skilled at warfare along with being a devout convert. Ferdinand had allowed him the title of count and gifted him half the spoils of the conquest personally and had the rest of the spoils given to his men with the exception of half the looted food stores which were needed to feed the Spanish army. As a first order, Rollo had purged all Muslims but allowed some mercy to the small population of Druze and Jews in the area. With large swathes of Muslims killed and large amounts of land up for settlement many of the Norse fighters had gotten their families to cultivate the abandoned farms. Rollo had also sent his men to constantly harass the already unstable and failing Taifas, his goal was to secure the Strait of Gibraltar and to gain the Enormous wealth that came from such. While he was a typical viking that enjoyed war and battle but he also took interest in the stone masonry of the Spanish and the Taifas, he had taken interest and copied Norman Motte and Bailey forts but using rudimentary stone working and used it to establish rule over inland territories.
The Spanish along the coast had gotten very good relation with Norse trade partners who had traded looted items and the ones who had colonized the Islands to the west had brought in large amounts of fish and bought mainly salt. Sometimes items from a Land even further west than the Islands had made their way to their markets, but going from the Hietteyjar to Leifrvalde was a very hard journey and only those experienced in the journey had any hope of jumping across the Atlantic. However the Great ships built from the enormous trees of Saeturland were being used to traverse the deeper waters of the Mid-Atlantic and only those large ships were capable of storing enough cargo and food supplies to make it across the Atlantic and profitable let alone actually surviving the trip. The Norse who lived in the area had adopted Basque and Arab ship techniques and they were more suitable for Atlantic crossings and after a period of years it slowly spread to Leifrvalde but not so much to Scandinavia given the inefficiency the additions would bring in Northern waters.
In The Taifas fear was rampant in the nobility, many were trying to secure safe havens to the south and west because sooner or later they believed the Spanish would take them; The new wave of Brutality of the Norse did not ease their minds either. While they had been warring with each other trying to reunite the great Al-Andalus that had fallen decades before they had now stopped in an uneasy cease-fire. They had allied with other Taifas but they never allied as a whole, even if they did the Emperor Ferdinand could convince the Frankish or the Pope for assistance if they were to cause a notable threat. Even if that were not true the manner of warfare and psychological warfare the Norse introduced that the Spanish were picking up on had been very detrimental to the troops; raise an army in seven villages to attack, instead of defending the enemy avoids most engagements and attack civilians directly. The Spanish had done this but the Norse were known to attack the specific places the nearest army's home and even demand tribute for the captured civilian's lives who were often times family of the soldiers. However many times the Norse did not find it practical to do such and saw it better to Pillage and Burn leaving only ashed in their wake. This of course led the course of battle to be mostly on the defensive for the Arabs, they had requested support from the south but other than meager grain supplies and weapons there was no help at this point in time.
Saeturland was thriving at this point in time, food was abundant and buisness was booming with the finest ship building in the Norse world. The copper miners went deeper and deeper inland to get their hands on copper, with this copper it became the center for minting most coins. Coins as currency were becoming more common as they were being minted more and more often, they were beginning to become accepted in Iceland and large Merchants in Norway. Other than ship building and coinage, there was another economic boom Saeturland had that is the reason for it's name: Maple syrup. Maple Syrup and Sugar of Saeturland were the only source of it and attempting it with maples in Europe were inefficient and very bitter but were mixed with the imported sugar and syrup to overcome the problem of bitterness. It was primarily eaten by Nobles and wealthy on Holidays and days of celebration, other than that it was too expensive to ship oversea for most people.
Salt was something the people of Leifrvalde did not have much of, they mostly went without and got it from Animal tissue or imported it. However on the North side of the Bjarnystad Islands salt was discovered, demand was high for salt and instantly the trade that was already existent in Bjarnystad skyrocketed and salt mining opened, however given it was an Island it took massive work to maintain the small mines which increased the price. Eventually it began to flood and while it was fought off there was always water and men would have to dive with a tool to get chunks of rock salt and bring it out, many men's eyes were heavily damaged after being induced to the heavy amounts of salt in the water induced to their eyes when going underwater.
In England Harthacnut died in his sleep and it was later theorized it was poison, to support this theory Thorfinn Sigurdsson begun his march just after a few hours he had gotten sick and died. With no heirs the forces under Harthacnut surrendered to Thorfinn Sigurdsson but some defected to William of Normandy or Harald Hardrada. With this the Scottish crown was at it's most powerful point in history yet, with more fertile lands to cultivate the crown could support a larger army.
Last edited:
20
Ah, there is nothing like using coin flips to decide major results in a story. Adds to the randomness and unpredictability maybe. Also again please le tme know what you think and be sure to check out Bavarian Raven's Vinland TL I hear soon he's gonna have it up and running again.
Also I did not think at the start of this TL that I would be getting into Arab politics so not sure if people are a fan of that but whatever.
1066-1070
All over Harald Hardrada's empire he was employing men into his army, he had funded this by a large surge in his Treasury because he has installed taxes on wood exports to Iceland and had a monopoly on the exports of wood there. Along with deporting the poorer families to Iceland due to all the freed space with the large Migrations had allowed his own private lands and estates could make money. He had taken large amounts of men from Iceland to fight in his army and left a small amount in Iceland to keep the peace. Harald had also taken the Shetlands as it was a vital base for contact with Iceland and also a base for invading the Faroes and Scotland if he had wanted.
Harald had set his eyes not on Scotland though, fighting in the Highlands would mean certain defeat and it would take enormous strategy to take it; His eyes were on the rest of England. Harald Hardrada had taken Nine Thousand men and Marched into the land of William, count of Normandy but he had recently taken the title of King. Williams Army was much larger than Harald's, but Harald's army was different as most of the men in the ranks were native Anglo-Saxons and had made better use of the terrain. The Battle was a Norwegian success but the Normans had barely had any casualties, however the Norman armies Morale was lowered and the battles afterwards lowered their numbers to half it's original size.
The Norwegian King Harald Hardrada had been tormenting the Normans and beaten them back, the Normans had a technological advantage with some units utilizing the Crossbow. Harald had seen the potential these weapons had and had scavenged them and had some new ones produced by local smiths. Along with bows of Yew and Ash Harald had the advantage with ranged units and the Normans not being able to fight the Norwegian/English army King William had instead dissolved an Eighth of his army and used the funds that would otherwise have paid and fed said portion of the army and offered it to King Thorfinn of Scotland if he would attack Norwegian English territory. Thorfinn Sigurdsson had agreed and attacked but withdrew after taking enough treasure to satisfy him but it led to the Norwegians offering peace with the Normans with nearly a third of Norman England to now be under control of the Norwegian Crown. While many would have been outraged at this William only considered it a temporary setback and believed he would take all of England.
In Nawahlid, the farms inside it's walls was enough to feed itself and did not need to import food other than particular comfort foods. The walls were being built higher and higher and large swathes of forest were being cleared to expand it's farms and along the Nawa River's Tributaries near the city small settlements were being built to sustain the farms and due to the terrains features many knew one day the city would be able to become as large as Jorvik or even bigger. The former slaves from the Netherlands area had built levees to keep flooding out and many small drainage canals that had led into containment ponds or directly into the river. Around this time fired brick became popular, it was incredibly suited to both cool and hot weather as it sucked heat in the summer making it much cooler and kept heat in during winter it also was much cheaper than the amount of Lime plaster they were producing to stop fires. The first Towers were being built in the Nyrfold and Leifrvalde as temples to the Christian god were built out of brick and mortar. The Introduction of fired clay bricks allowed wall construction to be much faster and stronger and primitive rain aqueducts were being built to supply often used wells with more water supply.
In Thorkellsborg the people were thriving, they had more than enough to eat and indulged in many things commoners on the other side of the Atlantic would dream of; but the population was slowly declining. Many had sought out a better living in Nawahlid or to lands to the south and some who had worked in collection of Iron ore had moved to the many new iron mining based settlements only a couple miles from the town of Thorkellsborg resulting in a form of population balkanization with it becoming more and more spread out, here too Fired clay brick was becoming popular and roads were being built out of brick with no mortar used to connect the various farms and mines. However the town of Thorkellsborg was still an essential place for the fishing of the grand banks and was still one of the most prominent markets in Leifrvalde.
The two co-Paramount Chiefs ruled competently, they had made errors every once and a while and most were content with their rule; most but not all. Many of the immigrants from Iceland wished to rebuild their free democratic Icelandic identity in the new land. Knowing this Gudbrand Bjarnysson had came to the conclusion with his brother Birger that it would be wise to, and according to the sagas says "Blocking a river will only cause a large lake to form that will drown everything in it's built up fury, one must divert the flow to more favorable paths". The Paramount Chiefs of Leifrvalde tried to restore the democratic Allthing in Greenland but Arne Ulfsson did not wish to submit to a democratic Allthing, so instead they had given the declining colonies of Elgurland up and allowed it to be independent and run in a more democratic fashion like old Iceland. However the Men who wished for a more Icelandic democracy also wanted the rich fertile Lands of Leifrvalde, however this is where the cunning of Birger Bjarnysson showed; at refusing the offer the men had lost face and with using rights of discovery on the side of the Paramount Chieftains and with the spread of false rumors were able to arrest some of the "Freedom Seekers" as they called themselves. However they were not executed, they were force fed large amounts of wine and interrogated into releasing the identities of other Freedom Seekers, it was then announced publicly in all major towns the information of the men giving up their comrades and to further their guilt were given farms.
Not all Freedom Seekers were rooted out though, they existed underground and met up to discuss what they would do. They considered things such as assassination of the two Paramount Chiefs, bringing their families and finding an even more fertile land to the south was discussed, but one of the most radical was not to go to new places but to bring Iceland back under their control. The underground network was divided into three essential beliefs but worked together, one was to reclaim Iceland, another to relocate somewhere far to the south, and another was to fight and take the Paramount Chiefs' heads. Eventually they decided that relocation was the most likely to not fail as the other two would require large conflicts. According to the Sagas Eighty Seven families had traveled south along with some sheep and crop seed. They had repair tools on them and acted like a mobile village and settled on an Island many weeks travel south on a large Island and called the new village Hviturfjaran which translates to "White Beaches" (otl Abaco Islands). They settled down reportedly due to the nice weather. At that point in time it was the southernmost Norse community and for paltry Iron items they were able to get the natives to work their farms for them but obtained a large amount of food through fishing and trading but the new Thing had banned communication and trade with Leifrvalde to the North.
In Iberia, Rollo Olafsson, Count of Lisbona had been raiding and conquering which pleased his lord Ferdinand the First. While Rollo was considered a hero to the Christian Spanish he killed almost a million innocent Muslims, he invested large amounts of time and money to the religious genocide, he did however allow the Saqaliba who were former slaves from east Europe to Convert to Christianity and also allowed those who surrendered a chance to convert. The Taifas were begining to form an uneasy alliance, they requested support again and again from the south and east but to no avail. However a man known as Ibrahim ibn Tanja had rallied some capital from Algiers and was able to rally men from all over the land to him and managed to defeat Rollo Olafsson in battle and reclaimed two counties from him but was unable to pierce any further due to defensive positions; Ibrahim was hailed a hero in the Islamic Iberia and all the Taifas supported him and he had dreamed of not only reclaiming Iberia, but to lead a fight into the land of the Franks as well.
In Elgurland, new settlements were being built to facilitate the gold mining and cattle. The fur trade was prosperous as furs you could not get anywhere else were in Elgurland. The hunting industry was high and the Norse there barely ate grain as livestock was abundant and the meat that came along with the fur trade had fed the communities for the most part. The population was gradually making a rise again due to birth rates and with the influx of settlers looking for some of the Northern Gold legend, some of these people explored the Hellulands thoroughly looking for the gold and mapping out passages to go further and further west along the arctic sea. Some actually did find gold in the Hellulands and others had found skraelings who were willing to trade what sparse pieces of gold they had for simple metal or cloth trinkets or tools. However sightings of a new type of Skraeling in the Hellulands was beginning to appear, the translators did not even remotely know any of their language and their technology was different from the other arctic Skraelings, they had amounts of gold on them and the Norse knew they had came from the west and this had spurred the evolution of the "Northern Gold" legend into the "Northwestern Gold" Legend.
In Greenland, Skraelings had come and the Norse attempted to assimilate them. It was going well until in a community in the western settlement due to a misunderstanding had led the Skraelings to kill all the Norse in the community, the neighboring villages counter-attacked and were able to kill all the Skraeling warriors and forced the women and children into slavery. The new Greenlanders also had adopted massive seal and walrus hunts, the Ivory trade was becoming prominent again and the Greenish were producing Hnefatafl sets out of Ivory and other goods as well and exporting them both south and east.
Also I did not think at the start of this TL that I would be getting into Arab politics so not sure if people are a fan of that but whatever.
1066-1070
All over Harald Hardrada's empire he was employing men into his army, he had funded this by a large surge in his Treasury because he has installed taxes on wood exports to Iceland and had a monopoly on the exports of wood there. Along with deporting the poorer families to Iceland due to all the freed space with the large Migrations had allowed his own private lands and estates could make money. He had taken large amounts of men from Iceland to fight in his army and left a small amount in Iceland to keep the peace. Harald had also taken the Shetlands as it was a vital base for contact with Iceland and also a base for invading the Faroes and Scotland if he had wanted.
Harald had set his eyes not on Scotland though, fighting in the Highlands would mean certain defeat and it would take enormous strategy to take it; His eyes were on the rest of England. Harald Hardrada had taken Nine Thousand men and Marched into the land of William, count of Normandy but he had recently taken the title of King. Williams Army was much larger than Harald's, but Harald's army was different as most of the men in the ranks were native Anglo-Saxons and had made better use of the terrain. The Battle was a Norwegian success but the Normans had barely had any casualties, however the Norman armies Morale was lowered and the battles afterwards lowered their numbers to half it's original size.
The Norwegian King Harald Hardrada had been tormenting the Normans and beaten them back, the Normans had a technological advantage with some units utilizing the Crossbow. Harald had seen the potential these weapons had and had scavenged them and had some new ones produced by local smiths. Along with bows of Yew and Ash Harald had the advantage with ranged units and the Normans not being able to fight the Norwegian/English army King William had instead dissolved an Eighth of his army and used the funds that would otherwise have paid and fed said portion of the army and offered it to King Thorfinn of Scotland if he would attack Norwegian English territory. Thorfinn Sigurdsson had agreed and attacked but withdrew after taking enough treasure to satisfy him but it led to the Norwegians offering peace with the Normans with nearly a third of Norman England to now be under control of the Norwegian Crown. While many would have been outraged at this William only considered it a temporary setback and believed he would take all of England.
In Nawahlid, the farms inside it's walls was enough to feed itself and did not need to import food other than particular comfort foods. The walls were being built higher and higher and large swathes of forest were being cleared to expand it's farms and along the Nawa River's Tributaries near the city small settlements were being built to sustain the farms and due to the terrains features many knew one day the city would be able to become as large as Jorvik or even bigger. The former slaves from the Netherlands area had built levees to keep flooding out and many small drainage canals that had led into containment ponds or directly into the river. Around this time fired brick became popular, it was incredibly suited to both cool and hot weather as it sucked heat in the summer making it much cooler and kept heat in during winter it also was much cheaper than the amount of Lime plaster they were producing to stop fires. The first Towers were being built in the Nyrfold and Leifrvalde as temples to the Christian god were built out of brick and mortar. The Introduction of fired clay bricks allowed wall construction to be much faster and stronger and primitive rain aqueducts were being built to supply often used wells with more water supply.
In Thorkellsborg the people were thriving, they had more than enough to eat and indulged in many things commoners on the other side of the Atlantic would dream of; but the population was slowly declining. Many had sought out a better living in Nawahlid or to lands to the south and some who had worked in collection of Iron ore had moved to the many new iron mining based settlements only a couple miles from the town of Thorkellsborg resulting in a form of population balkanization with it becoming more and more spread out, here too Fired clay brick was becoming popular and roads were being built out of brick with no mortar used to connect the various farms and mines. However the town of Thorkellsborg was still an essential place for the fishing of the grand banks and was still one of the most prominent markets in Leifrvalde.
The two co-Paramount Chiefs ruled competently, they had made errors every once and a while and most were content with their rule; most but not all. Many of the immigrants from Iceland wished to rebuild their free democratic Icelandic identity in the new land. Knowing this Gudbrand Bjarnysson had came to the conclusion with his brother Birger that it would be wise to, and according to the sagas says "Blocking a river will only cause a large lake to form that will drown everything in it's built up fury, one must divert the flow to more favorable paths". The Paramount Chiefs of Leifrvalde tried to restore the democratic Allthing in Greenland but Arne Ulfsson did not wish to submit to a democratic Allthing, so instead they had given the declining colonies of Elgurland up and allowed it to be independent and run in a more democratic fashion like old Iceland. However the Men who wished for a more Icelandic democracy also wanted the rich fertile Lands of Leifrvalde, however this is where the cunning of Birger Bjarnysson showed; at refusing the offer the men had lost face and with using rights of discovery on the side of the Paramount Chieftains and with the spread of false rumors were able to arrest some of the "Freedom Seekers" as they called themselves. However they were not executed, they were force fed large amounts of wine and interrogated into releasing the identities of other Freedom Seekers, it was then announced publicly in all major towns the information of the men giving up their comrades and to further their guilt were given farms.
Not all Freedom Seekers were rooted out though, they existed underground and met up to discuss what they would do. They considered things such as assassination of the two Paramount Chiefs, bringing their families and finding an even more fertile land to the south was discussed, but one of the most radical was not to go to new places but to bring Iceland back under their control. The underground network was divided into three essential beliefs but worked together, one was to reclaim Iceland, another to relocate somewhere far to the south, and another was to fight and take the Paramount Chiefs' heads. Eventually they decided that relocation was the most likely to not fail as the other two would require large conflicts. According to the Sagas Eighty Seven families had traveled south along with some sheep and crop seed. They had repair tools on them and acted like a mobile village and settled on an Island many weeks travel south on a large Island and called the new village Hviturfjaran which translates to "White Beaches" (otl Abaco Islands). They settled down reportedly due to the nice weather. At that point in time it was the southernmost Norse community and for paltry Iron items they were able to get the natives to work their farms for them but obtained a large amount of food through fishing and trading but the new Thing had banned communication and trade with Leifrvalde to the North.
In Iberia, Rollo Olafsson, Count of Lisbona had been raiding and conquering which pleased his lord Ferdinand the First. While Rollo was considered a hero to the Christian Spanish he killed almost a million innocent Muslims, he invested large amounts of time and money to the religious genocide, he did however allow the Saqaliba who were former slaves from east Europe to Convert to Christianity and also allowed those who surrendered a chance to convert. The Taifas were begining to form an uneasy alliance, they requested support again and again from the south and east but to no avail. However a man known as Ibrahim ibn Tanja had rallied some capital from Algiers and was able to rally men from all over the land to him and managed to defeat Rollo Olafsson in battle and reclaimed two counties from him but was unable to pierce any further due to defensive positions; Ibrahim was hailed a hero in the Islamic Iberia and all the Taifas supported him and he had dreamed of not only reclaiming Iberia, but to lead a fight into the land of the Franks as well.
In Elgurland, new settlements were being built to facilitate the gold mining and cattle. The fur trade was prosperous as furs you could not get anywhere else were in Elgurland. The hunting industry was high and the Norse there barely ate grain as livestock was abundant and the meat that came along with the fur trade had fed the communities for the most part. The population was gradually making a rise again due to birth rates and with the influx of settlers looking for some of the Northern Gold legend, some of these people explored the Hellulands thoroughly looking for the gold and mapping out passages to go further and further west along the arctic sea. Some actually did find gold in the Hellulands and others had found skraelings who were willing to trade what sparse pieces of gold they had for simple metal or cloth trinkets or tools. However sightings of a new type of Skraeling in the Hellulands was beginning to appear, the translators did not even remotely know any of their language and their technology was different from the other arctic Skraelings, they had amounts of gold on them and the Norse knew they had came from the west and this had spurred the evolution of the "Northern Gold" legend into the "Northwestern Gold" Legend.
In Greenland, Skraelings had come and the Norse attempted to assimilate them. It was going well until in a community in the western settlement due to a misunderstanding had led the Skraelings to kill all the Norse in the community, the neighboring villages counter-attacked and were able to kill all the Skraeling warriors and forced the women and children into slavery. The new Greenlanders also had adopted massive seal and walrus hunts, the Ivory trade was becoming prominent again and the Greenish were producing Hnefatafl sets out of Ivory and other goods as well and exporting them both south and east.
Last edited:
Oh yeah also, going to be travelling tomorrow so it will take a bit more to write. Also seems I've run into the problem of no one reading but there are probably some lurkers.
Spanish Emperor with Norse warlords? Norsemen ruling the north of England after a 10 year early Norman Conquest?
Even though the bulk of the timeline is concerned with the new settlements, the butterfly effects in Europe make for interesting reading in and of themselves.
Even though the bulk of the timeline is concerned with the new settlements, the butterfly effects in Europe make for interesting reading in and of themselves.
21
A shorter update, more of an update on a few things I hadn't picked up on in a while but it is preceding some big events. So yeah, very soon a new larger update should come unless some real life things go down which due to things might have a chance of happening.
1071-1075
Nawahlid was growing from being a town to a city, it had five churches, two Hofs, and one Synagogue as a small amount of Jewish money lenders migrated there due to the Norse being slightly more religiously tolerant than Europe was and wanting to get away from the poverty in Europe. The local Church authorities were not pleased with heathen temples being in the same city with Churches, however some priests found it advantageous to share the city as the low unimpressive Hofs were trash compared to the multiple story churches and had gained converts through it. The city walls that were built out of brick and mortar had living quarters inside and up against the inner side of the wall, at first as barracks but then civilians. The Allthing had mostly been in Thorkellsborg or Bjarnystad, but now there was serious talk about moving it to Nawahlid and in 1073 it did.
The defenses of Nawahlid were undoubtedly the best in the Norse world with the exception of English defenses. The first bridge across the River Nawa, built out of wood and supports using the force of the river to reinforce the structure, basing off that model two other bridges were built. The city was growing and growing but the demand for Lime was also growing but using wood for burning Limestone was inefficient and while wood was initially abundant and clearing left farmland most of the wood available was cut and wood was being imported to Nawahlid from up the river. Peat was soon incorporated as a fuel but did not get the desired amount, in eastern Hnetaland the coal there was used for smithing but was too far away to import; Lime production was then forcibly limited to two months out of a year by the Allthing (surprisingly not by the Paramount Chiefs).
In Leifsbudir most had moved away, it's main export used to be sheep products but now the production of Wine was what was important. Vinnish Grapes are not like a European grape but was a berry from Vinland that the discoverers who had mostly only seen barren Greenland and Iceland had never seen real grapes before and assumed, a once wild berry vine was now being cultivated and something about the temperature and soil made it restricted to the Leifsbudir area. The grapes were sometimes fed to the sheep in order to make a sweeter meat, the grapes also had a use in creating a dye for clothing.
In Storfoss the population has been slowly growing, some people willing to explore the lakes had come through but most interest was down the coastline but even that was in decline as interest in exploration had died down for the masses. For plentiful harvests you could go anywhere but only in Storfss did Gulurskera (Corn/maize) grow in large quantities, over the decades the size of the grains grew bigger and the yield was greater than wheat. The people there even shipped it North along the river Nawa to Nawahlid and the various portage settlements. Sometimes wealthy people had visited it to view the large waterfall it was based on, however it's level of development wasn't as large as the cities to the east.
In England the Norwegians and the Normans had a truce and were still reeling from their losses in the war, it was this time that the Normans annexed what little left of Wales had resisted them. The Scottish under Thorfinn Sigurdsson had been amassing a fleet and two hundred and fifty men set out to attempt to take Norwegian ruled Iceland, however a storm had forced the fleet to return and the Norwegians took notice of this and had troops deployed to Iceland so the Scots had been forced to stay put.
In Leifrvalde, one of the two paramount chiefs Gudbrand Bjarnysson took an arrow to the throat after a conflict with Skraelings. His brother Birger Bjarnysson decided to call in for reinforcements and completely purge the area of all skraeling life. But Birger was growing old and he had only daughters, it was severely hinted at this time he was suffering from erectile dysfunction or the like that prevented him from producing more children. At thirty-two years old and his three daughters not being wed yet it was high time he found an heir, for his sixteen year old daughter he had a man known as Bjorn Thordsson who was twenty seven years old who he had chosen as his designated successor. Bjorn was pagan and had been baptized just before the wedding. Bjorn had been in many battles against Skraelings and was an expert seamen, however only two weeks after the marriage and he had caught a sickness and died.
1071-1075
Nawahlid was growing from being a town to a city, it had five churches, two Hofs, and one Synagogue as a small amount of Jewish money lenders migrated there due to the Norse being slightly more religiously tolerant than Europe was and wanting to get away from the poverty in Europe. The local Church authorities were not pleased with heathen temples being in the same city with Churches, however some priests found it advantageous to share the city as the low unimpressive Hofs were trash compared to the multiple story churches and had gained converts through it. The city walls that were built out of brick and mortar had living quarters inside and up against the inner side of the wall, at first as barracks but then civilians. The Allthing had mostly been in Thorkellsborg or Bjarnystad, but now there was serious talk about moving it to Nawahlid and in 1073 it did.
The defenses of Nawahlid were undoubtedly the best in the Norse world with the exception of English defenses. The first bridge across the River Nawa, built out of wood and supports using the force of the river to reinforce the structure, basing off that model two other bridges were built. The city was growing and growing but the demand for Lime was also growing but using wood for burning Limestone was inefficient and while wood was initially abundant and clearing left farmland most of the wood available was cut and wood was being imported to Nawahlid from up the river. Peat was soon incorporated as a fuel but did not get the desired amount, in eastern Hnetaland the coal there was used for smithing but was too far away to import; Lime production was then forcibly limited to two months out of a year by the Allthing (surprisingly not by the Paramount Chiefs).
In Leifsbudir most had moved away, it's main export used to be sheep products but now the production of Wine was what was important. Vinnish Grapes are not like a European grape but was a berry from Vinland that the discoverers who had mostly only seen barren Greenland and Iceland had never seen real grapes before and assumed, a once wild berry vine was now being cultivated and something about the temperature and soil made it restricted to the Leifsbudir area. The grapes were sometimes fed to the sheep in order to make a sweeter meat, the grapes also had a use in creating a dye for clothing.
In Storfoss the population has been slowly growing, some people willing to explore the lakes had come through but most interest was down the coastline but even that was in decline as interest in exploration had died down for the masses. For plentiful harvests you could go anywhere but only in Storfss did Gulurskera (Corn/maize) grow in large quantities, over the decades the size of the grains grew bigger and the yield was greater than wheat. The people there even shipped it North along the river Nawa to Nawahlid and the various portage settlements. Sometimes wealthy people had visited it to view the large waterfall it was based on, however it's level of development wasn't as large as the cities to the east.
In England the Norwegians and the Normans had a truce and were still reeling from their losses in the war, it was this time that the Normans annexed what little left of Wales had resisted them. The Scottish under Thorfinn Sigurdsson had been amassing a fleet and two hundred and fifty men set out to attempt to take Norwegian ruled Iceland, however a storm had forced the fleet to return and the Norwegians took notice of this and had troops deployed to Iceland so the Scots had been forced to stay put.
In Leifrvalde, one of the two paramount chiefs Gudbrand Bjarnysson took an arrow to the throat after a conflict with Skraelings. His brother Birger Bjarnysson decided to call in for reinforcements and completely purge the area of all skraeling life. But Birger was growing old and he had only daughters, it was severely hinted at this time he was suffering from erectile dysfunction or the like that prevented him from producing more children. At thirty-two years old and his three daughters not being wed yet it was high time he found an heir, for his sixteen year old daughter he had a man known as Bjorn Thordsson who was twenty seven years old who he had chosen as his designated successor. Bjorn was pagan and had been baptized just before the wedding. Bjorn had been in many battles against Skraelings and was an expert seamen, however only two weeks after the marriage and he had caught a sickness and died.
Last edited:
Uff Da the optimist
Donor
Still very cool!
What is this berry their talking about?
If there are any afficionados of map-making out there, a map of Vinland now would be very much welcomed!
It's interesting you have hofs, churches and synagogues next to each other. Religious toleration was never great anywhere at anytime, so it might just come crashing down across the pond as well.
Keep up the very good work!
What is this berry their talking about?
If there are any afficionados of map-making out there, a map of Vinland now would be very much welcomed!
It's interesting you have hofs, churches and synagogues next to each other. Religious toleration was never great anywhere at anytime, so it might just come crashing down across the pond as well.
Keep up the very good work!
The berry is a local berry to Northern VInland, I'm going off the sagas and given how not many OTL berries can correlate to "Grapes" found there by the norse OTL I'm just going to say it's a mutant/hybrid of known berries.
As for a map I suppose I could get to it but don't really have experience in the thing.
And the churches and Hofs aren't literally next to each other, the Norse in vinland are a little bit more religiously tolerant because they lived with a Pagan population with them for as long as they can remember, albeit for something like jews they might walk on different sides of the street but they aren't going to kill them all.
- Status