Taking the Cross: A Crusader ATL

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I'm sneaking on this TL, and I wonder about the languages spoken in the area in your scenario.

Well at the moment there's no massively significant departure from OTL, with Old French being the language spoken among the majority of the Latins, whilst Latin itself is used by the Church and in most of the writing. The Muslims speak Arabic and many of the more savvy merchants and nobles in the Crusader States (especially Antioch and Cyprus) speak Greek, as do the Greeks living in many of the coastal cities of course. In Egypt, as the Latin invasion is recent, the Latins aren't really properly establish yet, whilst Coptic is flourishing during this time, especially now that the Muslims have been expelled from the Lower Egypt, and it is experiencing a resurgence. Hope that helps give a rough idea of the situation in the ATL :D I'm planning on doing a more cultural post soon anyway! Thanks for reading
 
Do you have a quick list of cities/regions that have changed hands? I'll go through your updates again and take note of which ones did, but if you have a list of them, along with various other boundaries, (such as how far south Lower Egypt extends) that'll help. I can try and throw something simple together.
 
I'm afraid I don't have a list as such, but I'll do my best to give you a summary :eek: And thanks for the help :D In Egypt, Alexandria and the surrounding area is held by the Byzantines, with other cities (Cairo, al-Arish, Damietta, Pelusium, Bilbeis, Minya) in Latin hands. Tanis probably should be in Latin hands too tbh, I don't see how they could have held out with the rest of Lower Egypt collapsing, I'll have to fix that. Latin control extends up the Nile as far as Minya, but not really any further. In the Levant, the old Emirate of Damasuc is now largely the Principality of Damascus, although some of the southern cities (Bostra, Assalt) have been absorbed directly into the Kingdom of Jerusalem. Aleppo and Hierapolis (Manbij) are in Christian hands and are technically part of the Principality of Antioch as the County of Aleppo, but retain plenty of autonomy. The County of Edesssa is mostly in Latin hands, with the capital still held, but Harran (only a short distance from Edessa) and pretty much everything east of the capital has fallen to Mosul. The Principality of Cyprus is basically independent, but the Byzantines have suzerainty over it.

Saladin rules over the Emirate of Mosul and has pushed west into Edessa (although he has failed to take the capital), east far enough to capture Baghdad, northwest into Anatolia (subjugating most of the Turks there) and north into Armenia. The cities east of Aleppo and Hierapolis that used to be part of Aleppo have also been added to his domains. Byzantium (on top of having taken Alexandria and having lordship over Cyprus) have pushed east far enough to take Iconium and drive back the Turks, although the further east you go the less they have any real power in Anatolia.

Hope this helps :D
 
Hey guys, for the next post I'm doing a bit on Baldwin IV's sisters, among other things. However, I', struggling a little with all the intrigue and marriages during this period :eek: I think I'm going to have Isabella still marry Humphrey of Toron (simply for the King to keep her out of Ibelin hands, rather than any debt of honour) but for Sibylla I'm not sure who she could of married. I'm thinking her fater would have had her married off in the last couple years of his reign ITTL, but to who? Would it still be plausible for her to marry William of Monferrat? And after his death who next? With Amalric's wife Maria I think she'll still marry into the Ibelins. Also for Godfrey would Raymond III of Tripoli be a plausible guardian? I can't imagine Baldwin IV allowing his heir to remain in his mother's (i.e. Ibelin) hands, so I was thinking he would remove him from their care and place him with someone else. Any help on all this would be greatly appreciated! As a quick afterthought, any suitable Byzantine Princes at this time for either of them to marry? Hope this isn't asking too much of you guys, but I'm rather in over my head with the dynastic side of TTL :eek: Thanks in advance and hope you guys enjoy the timeline! :)
 
Map - The Levant 1180s
Hey there Dieu. This is what I have so far. I haven't drawn any of the advances save for the Byzantine, just what I imagined the borders might be. I'm certain there are some south of Trebizond. A few questions on the disputed territories, and if they are disputed.

I wasn't sure about the cities to the east of Aleppo, so I gave everything north of the Euphrates to Edessa. Partly of my sense of pretty borders, and partly due to Edessa being more convenient for administration than Damascus. It won't be much of a problem to change. I'm certain there are a few things that I have missed. I'll go through the updates the next time I have the spare time to make sure I didn't miss anything.

Edit: New Pic Added Edit: And a second

Second Crusade 1179.png
 
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Have the Kingdom of Jerusalem and the Byzantines initiated diplomatic relations with the Nubian kingdom of Makuria? They were allied to the Fatimid Caliphate but with the success of the Latins in subjugating Lower Egypt, an opportunity would present itself to Makuria's ruler to move against the Fatimid remnants holding up in Upper Egypt. Expect some degree of tension between the royal courts of Dongola and Jerusalem regarding the latter's vassal lords in Lower Egypt.
 
Is that pink territory the assasins wouldn't anyone try to conquer it?

That's another question I've had, but I haven't had the time to look through to check.

Edit: Ok, now that I have reviewed, there are a few questions.

Do the Assassins still exist? Almaric made noises about conquering them, but it never says outright.
Corfu and the Archipelago were conquered on the way towards Cyprus. The latter was let go, but what happened to Corfu?
How far east does Byzantine nominal control extend? Does it go all the way to the Euphrates, or is the border west of it?
Does the County of Damietta control? Is it analogous to the modern Governate of Damietta, or does it extend farther south/east?

And also:
What is the status of Georgia? Is it still united, split between Abkhazia/Kartli, or is it different? Also, is it a vassal to anyone?
What is the extent of Byzantine Alexandria? (the extent of hinterland from the city.)
Status of the Sinai peninsula and Eastern Egypt, away from the Nile.
Arabia in general.
 
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Luminous the map's awesome!! :D :D Thanks for doing it! Its amazing :eek:
In answer to your questions, Id say the Byzantine border in Anatolia definitely isn't at the Euphrates, not their effective control anyway, its further west than that. The north-eastern part of the principality of Damascus and the other state (couldn't work out what that is... I really need to get clearer in my own writing haha :eek: ) you've put east of Aleppo are under Muslim control too. The Assassins still exist, but lost Khawabi and al-Kahf (their south-western fortresses) to Amalric during his attempt to subdue them. Corfu and the Archipelago were taken by the crusaders, but on behalf of Roger II of Sicily. He went on to basically get as much loot as possible before the Byzantines drove him out. He captured them in OTL too I think, but the same happened. ITTL he just loses less men taking them thanks to the crusaders and so is able to penetrate deeper into Byzantium before they manage to get rid of him. So they're back as Imperial territories now. The County of Damietta is a little larger than the modern government, extending further east along the coast and including the city of Tanis. The border for Alexandria is probably about right, I don't see the Byzantines having much besides the city. Georgia is independent. The Sinai away from the northern coast and eastern Egypt are claimed by Jerusalem since its conquest of the nearby areas, but it has yet to actually extend its control over them, so they're still in Muslim hands, the same as Upper Egypt. The rest of Arabia I'm still figuring out myself :p Hope this answers all you're questions!! You definitely deserve it after the map :D

Is that pink territory the assasins wouldn't anyone try to conquer it?

Amalric tried, but abandoned the campaign after some small successes because it was costing far too much. They're called the Assassins for a reason after all :p

Have the Kingdom of Jerusalem and the Byzantines initiated diplomatic relations with the Nubian kingdom of Makuria?

They certainly know each other, but formal relations haven't been established yet. The Latins have been too busy fighting in Lower Egypt and Upper Egypt is still controlled by Muslims (although Makuria is expanding in that direction at their expense). Expect them to show up soon ;)

Hope everyone's enjoying the TL :) If you have any suggestions for revisions or for upcoming stuff, let me know. Thanks for reading :D
 
Luminous the map's awesome!! :D :D Thanks for doing it! Its amazing :eek:
In answer to your questions, Id say the Byzantine border in Anatolia definitely isn't at the Euphrates, not their effective control anyway, its further west than that. The north-eastern part of the principality of Damascus and the other state (couldn't work out what that is... I really need to get clearer in my own writing haha :eek: ) you've put east of Aleppo are under Muslim control too. The Assassins still exist, but lost Khawabi and al-Kahf (their south-western fortresses) to Amalric during his attempt to subdue them. Corfu and the Archipelago were taken by the crusaders, but on behalf of Roger II of Sicily. He went on to basically get as much loot as possible before the Byzantines drove him out. He captured them in OTL too I think, but the same happened. ITTL he just loses less men taking them thanks to the crusaders and so is able to penetrate deeper into Byzantium before they manage to get rid of him. So they're back as Imperial territories now. The County of Damietta is a little larger than the modern government, extending further east along the coast and including the city of Tanis. The border for Alexandria is probably about right, I don't see the Byzantines having much besides the city. Georgia is independent. The Sinai away from the northern coast and eastern Egypt are claimed by Jerusalem since its conquest of the nearby areas, but it has yet to actually extend its control over them, so they're still in Muslim hands, the same as Upper Egypt. The rest of Arabia I'm still figuring out myself :p Hope this answers all you're questions!! You definitely deserve it after the map :D

Thanks for that. That will help a lot.

I imagine that the new border will "effectively" be at the Halys river, down through Lake Tuz and then south to Armenia. Everything else to the east would be under nominal control for now. I think the de facto political boundary will be all the way to the east, just so they can claim Anatolia.

Edessa is the northern yellow nation, with Antioch in orange. The darker colors are Aleppo and Harran, respectively. You did say that Aleppo was given to Antioch, but I didn't know what to do with Harran. Hence, every part of Damascus north of the Euphrates I gave to Edessa as an autonomous district, same as Aleppo for Antioch. Did you plan for that, or did you have the entirety of north Damascus go to Antioch/the east remain with Damascus?

As for the conquered land, that's the darker purple shades. Should they not have penetrated as deeply in the south, and/or should they have conquered more of the north? Or did they manage to conquer Damascus in the south?

Will correct the Assassins when I update the map. Shall I add that part of them to Tripoli?

Just checking on Corfu. I thought they were given back, but the Principality of Cyprus and Corfu really amused me when I thought it in my head.

Will correct Damietta and Alexandria a bit tomorrow. I shan't make the latter much smaller, but for just the city it was a bit generous.

Good on Georgia. Now we need an independent Carolina about 600 years from now. :D

I'll leave the disputed areas for now then. And good luck with Arabia.

I am enjoying this one quite a bit. I'll hold my tongue for now on where I expect stuff to go from here, but there are some things that are very intriguing. The corrections should be up sometime tomorrow. Probably with a key. There's a big purple blob I can put it smack dab on.
 
I agree with you on the eastern border of Byzantium, I confused myself for a sec there :D

With Harran, it was just incorporated directly into the County of Edessa (that's what was confusing me) but they never did manage to get the lands east of it.

The Muslims are also a little further into Damascus on its northeastern border.

Yeah, adding the Assassin territory to Tripoli would be great :)

You're right! Cyprus and Corfu would have been awesome. Missed opportunity right there :D

Sorry I've been confusing in my explanations, I've re-read some of the TL and there was some stuff I'd actually forgotten about :eek: I need to tidy up my writing a bit I think, it gets very messy

Hope I won't disappoint!
 
Chapter IX - The Leper King
Here's a new chapter to say thanks for reading :D and especially to say thanks to Luminous for his map

@Cuāuhtemōc
I read your excellent ATL on Cortes a while back, it was superb! And thanks for reminding me that the Nubian Christians exist :D I'd planned to do something with them, but forgotten about it by the time I actually got here :rolleyes:

I'm not tremendously happy with some parts of this chapter, the dynastic bit in particular (I would have written more if i hadn't gotten a bit lost in it all), so if you have any revisions to suggest go ahead :p

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Chapter Nine
The Leper King


Baldwin IV became King of Jerusalem in 1179 with the death of his father, despite the misgivings of many of within the Kingdom. Concerns were raised because of Baldwin’s unfortunate condition of being a leper, ruling out the possibility of him producing any heirs and making it unlikely that he would be long for this world. The new King was also only 18 years old when crowned, but luckily for him the Kingdom faced no immediate wars or invasions as had so often happened in the past with the death of a monarch. In Egypt the Moslems were disorganised and weak, having splintered into different factions following the Latin and Byzantine conquest of Lower Egypt, their territory limited to Upper Egypt and the western fringes of the country where the Latins had so far been unable to penetrate, limited as they were by long supply lines and a shortage of manpower. Although the wholesale recruitment and acceptance of the Copts into the Latin system would have solved this, the remained a marginalised group, although they held far greater rights than the Moslems. Steps in the right direction had been taken by the raising of Coptic contingents for fighting in Latin wars, which necessitated rewarding them, often with money or positions of power, but for the time being they were kept from climbing any higher than the lowest positions of nobility. Because of this, the Coptic people remained largely cool to the Latin occupation, but the numbers of those who were sympathetic or even supportive to the new government was slowly growing. During this period, the Copts also experienced a cultural flourishing as they began to re-emerge as a major force, blending with imported Latin culture as the lords with more sense (often Latins who had grown up in Outremer) encouraged their new subjects as fellow Christians. Others were less politically astute and were oppressive in their enforcement of the Latin religion and ideas as the new system, these lords generally being newly arrived crusaders who were not used to compromise with infidels and heretics.

The Kingdom of Jerusalem under Baldwin IV also had another major advantage which had been denied the earlier Kings, much to the detriment to the strength of the state, a relatively secure land passage across Anatolia to the west. Following the fall of Iconium to the Byzantines in 1159 it had become possible to travel from Western Europe to Outremer without having to battle your way through the armies of the Turks, only the occasional raids menacing the area and even these were declining in frequency as the Byzantines re-established their authority in the region. This allowed crusaders and hopeful migrants to travel to the Levant, seeking the opportunities provided by the expansion of the Christian territories or to make the pilgrimage to and perhaps settle in the Holy Land. With this new ease of access and encouraged by the success of the Second Crusade and the Latin conquests since then, many hopefuls flocked to the region, resulting in Baldwin having a greater number of crusaders in the armies he raised throughout his reign than any King before him who had not been the beneficiary of a crusade. Although not all of these new arrivals decided to stay, they provided some relief to the manpower problem that had plagued the crusaders states since their inception.

Before the birth of Baldwin’s younger brother Godfrey only shortly before the death of Amalric, it had been presumed that the Crown would pass to one of his sisters and as such finding them suitable husbands had been of great importance. As such, Sibylla had been married William of Montferrat in 1176 and had provided him with a son named Baldwin the following year. However, since the succession had been secured, their marriages became less important to the welfare of the Kingdom and in 1180 Isabella, the King’s other sister, was betrothed to a member of the Ibelin family. However, Baldwin refused to accept the betrothal and demanded that she find another suitor, choosing Humphrey IV of Toron in 1181, resulting in their marriage in 1183. This disagreement was the start of the Ibelin hatred for the King but only a small setback in their quest for power, Balian of Ibelin marrying Maria, Baldwin’s stepmother, in 1181. It was at this time, however, that Baldwin removed his brother Godfrey from the care of Maria and the Ibelins, deeming it too great a risk. To prevent the Ibelins from climbing any higher, in 1184 the King had Sibylla, who’s first husband had died in 1177, married to Alexios Komnenos, third son of the second son of Emperor John II and so nephew of Manuel I. The King was growing increasingly fearful of the power of the great noble families within the crusader states, seeking to limit them as best he could whilst rewarding those loyal to him. But this situation was nothing new, Jerusalem having been troubled by the feudal system since its creation, with the nobles displaying a large amount of power and influence even for the time, causing instability within the Kingdom and undermining the strength of the Latins in Outremer. It was a problem that would continue to plague Jerusalem for some time, even as other European states became increasingly centralised.

Despite these troubles, in the second year of Baldwin’s reign great excitement was causing throughout the Kingdom, after envoys from up the Nile arrived in Egypt, from where they were brought to Jerusalem to see the King. They spoke of a Christian Kingdom to the south that was at war with the Moslems and wished to find out who had conquered Lower Egypt. Both sides were happy to find fellow Christians, the Makurian delegation being hailed as representatives of Prester John much to their confusion, but there was plenty of celebration in anticipation for what could only be the start of a profitable alliance. When the ambassadors finally set off to return, they were laden with gifts and given an escort as far as the borders of the Principality of Egypt. Regretfully, they never made it back to their homes, attacked by either some Moslem warlord or bandits both of which had become endemic to Upper Egypt. The remains of the Fatimid Empire that the Latins had not conquered had descended into anarchy since the fall of Lower Egypt as power struggles became the norm throughout the region. The area along the Arabia coast in which Mecca was situated had escaped the worst of this, remaining relatively stable compared to the Sinai and the remains of Egypt, but was too weak to attempt to wage war on the Latins alone. Due to the dangerous nature of travel in these areas and the desire of many Moslems to prevent the Latins and the Makurians from joining together, there were obvious problems with communications for the Christians. However, in 1183 Baldwin decided that it was necessary to send out a party to ascertain the fate of the ambassadors and to renew contact with the Makurians. A heavily armed convoy consisting of Latin knights and Coptic serjeants rode out on the King’s orders, carrying further gifts and a request for an alliance.
 
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Chapter X - The Regency Begins
Another chapter for you :D Just to be clear, Baldwin dislikes the Ibelins more ITTL because they went ahead and had his step-sister betrothed to one of them and Balian managed to marry Maria. So he dislikes them as a family, but doesn't hold it against them when other do business with them.

Enjoy! :p

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Chapter Ten
The Regency Begins


Baldwin only participated in one campaign during his rule, when in 1183 Saladin began menacing the northern borders, raiding into Latin territory. Joscelin III was able to combat many of the attacks, but when Saladin launched a full invasion later that year, he quickly dispatched messages to request help from the other crusader states. Unable to face Saladin’s numerically superior force in the field, Joscelin retreated to Edessa and prepared for a siege, relying on his allies to come to his aid. An army was gathered comprising of troops from Antioch, Aleppo and Damascus to repel this threat, marching to the relief of Edessa. However, the leadership was divided and they often argued over what actions the army should take as each of the nobles attempted to assert their authority. This was to prove disastrous when Gauthier III, Prince of Damascus, demanded attack on a group of Saracens who had been harassing their advance. William of Aleppo and Bohemond of Antioch refused to participate, arguing that it was likely an ambush and giving chase would divide their forces. Outraged that they would not listen to him, Gauthier turned back with his men, leaving the Latin army significantly weakened. Pressing on, William and Bohemond were able to keep their army together despite repeated Moslem harassment and attempts to divide their forces. When they reached the Euphrates, they camped on the western bank of the river in preparation for the crossing. They were not expecting Saladin anywhere in the vicinity as they believed him to still be besieging Edessa, but the camp was somewhat prepared for a possible attack thanks to Moslem raiding parties they had tangled with during their approach. However, a night attack on their camp, thought at first to be another Moslem raid, turned out to be a full attack by Saladin’s army which had crept up on them during the night after a fast march from Edessa once it became know that the Latin army was advancing, although the Saracen infantry had yet to join battle. The Latins succeeded in rallying their troops during the attack, preventing the initial cavalry charges aimed at them from overrunning the camp and allowing them to survive until morning, whereupon Saladin’s infantry arrived. During this phase of the battle Bohemond and his guard played an instrumental part in rallying the Latins and forcing back the Saracens, fighting where the battle was thickest and preventing a group of Saracens from fording the river for some time. In the night attack the Latins had lost most of their horses and as such had been stripped of much of their army’s mobility, leaving them open to the Moslem cavalry and only the tenacious defence of the camp perimiter had kept them alive so far. Effectively besieged in their camp, the Latins attempted to attack the Moslem infantry as it crossed the river, but they were driven back by the enemy cavalry and by midday they had been overrun and forced to surrender. Bohemond was among those killed in the Battle of the Euphrates, whilst William was taken into captivity. The battle was a tremendous blow to the northern states, who lost much of their fighting strength.

After the great loss during this battle, Baldwin began collecting troops from across his domain to march north. Gathering men as fast as possible, the King rode north to prevent Saladin from striking at the now relatively defenceless northern states, meeting him in battle just north of Hierapolis. Although he was outnumbered, Baldwin’s troops were better supplied than Saladin’s, who had made a drive to capture as much territory before the Latins arrived. As such, Saladin’s large army was running low on water and there were serious shortages, weakening his men. The exhausted Saracens were cut through with relative ease by the heavily armoured knights whose charges shattered their lines and caused Saladin’s army to rout, inflicting great casualties on the fleeing enemy. It was to be the worst defeat of Saladin’s career, forcing him to abandon his campaign in Syria and fall back to his own territory. Baldwin was able to relieve Edessa, which had been in negotiations for surrender with the Saracens left behind to continue to siege when the Latins arrived, as well as regain the eastern territories in Edessa and Damascus lost to Saladin during the reign of Amalric.

The war was over and the eastern territories secured, but Baldwin himself was becoming seriously weaker. He had been blind and unable to walk since 1182 and participated in the campaign simply to bolster the fighting spirit of his men, playing little role in the planning. Godfrey had been crowned as co-ruler in 1183 to ensure his position after Baldwin’s death, but was still only a boy and as such the King had been relying heavily on Raymond III of Tripoli and Joscelin III for many important matters. Just prior to his passing Baldwin ordered Balian of Ibelin, Count of Damietta, to subjugate the Sinai in an attempt to remove him from the political scene long enough for others to secure Godfrey’s place as King at the suggestion of Joscelin. Baldwin had decided upon a council to rule as a regency for his brother until Godfrey came of age, but the different factions soon began fighting. The Ibelin faction was much weakened during the initial round of political fighting, as Raymond of Tripoli had been assassinated in the same year as the King passed (allowing Joscelin to convince the King to send Balian away) and Bohemond of Antioch had been killed in battle with Saladin, removing two of their strongest allies. Humphrey IV of Toron, Prince of Egypt, Gauthier III and Joscelin III were able to seize the regency and assemble an army in time to meet the return of Balian. They commended him on the fine work he had done in pacifying the Sinai (a job left completely unfinished as he had quickly returned as soon as new of Baldwin’s death had arrived) and asked that he return to his fiefs. With most of the powerful figures of the Ibelin faction out of the picture, Balian was forced to accept the new regency in what was basically a coup. And so it was that Godfrey became King in 1184. Had Raymond not been assassinated, it is highly likely that the Ibelins would have come out on top as Raymond had had the ear of the King (who kept him as a favourite despite his alliance with the Ibelins) for some time during the last days of his reign.

Raymond IV of Tripoli was relatively new to the political scene, having some experience ruling Antioch in his father Bohemond’s name, but now he suddenly found himself one of the most powerful men in Outremer, as in short order he had inherited Antioch after his father’s death and then Tripoli with the death of Raymond III, his godfather, without heirs. With the creation of the new regency, Raymond decided it was expedient to abandon his predecessor’s alliance with the Ibelins and join with the current rulers. Journeying to Jerusalem to pay homage to the new King, he made it clear he was loyal to the new government, much to their delight, although he did not cut all his ties with the Ibelins.
 
Thank you. I'm glad someone still remembers that timeline I did way back when in the good old days of AH.com. :D

Christianity is still going strong in Makuria though at this time period, it was sort of waning with the tide of Arab tribes migrating to the north, occupying land once held by Makuria and intermarrying with the native Nubians. This was partially attributed to the Ayyubids being so aggressive and pushing tribes like the Banu Kanz southward. ITTL the Ayyubids do not seize control of Egypt from the decaying Fatimids leaving room for the Crusaders and the Christian kingdoms of Nubia like Makuria and Alodia to mingle with each other and become allies against the Muslim powers. In due time, we can have King Godfrey learning about the Ethiopian Empire, ruled by King Lalibela who is said to have had crazy visions of Jerusalem when it was captured by Saladin.
 
The next chapter has a bit on Makuria that hopefully you'll like. It's basically done but I'll leave it to tomorrow to put it up because there's one more bit I want to put in :p
 
Looks nice! Will the Prince of Damascus get his comeuppance? Will Raymond IV find a balance between the factions, or will he slip and fall upon that fence he walks? Will Tripolitantioch become a recognized power on the Mediterranean? Next time on Taking the Cross!
 
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