A Glorious Union or America: the New Sparta

An exceptional post KI. I could feel the weight upon Lincoln's shoulders. Heavier than the war I feel.

I am curious as to how you are going to get around 'An Act of Attainder' here. Should be interesting just how much the Constitution can be bent.

Isn't the theory that the individual rebel not the state has divested himself voluntarily of his citizenship. The fact the country he has subsequently declared himself a citizen of doesn't exist anymore is the individuals problem.

Nonetheless you can expect a case like Ex Parte Garland to come up before the Supremes.

Permanently barring "foreigners" or denying entry to stateless persons must be legal surely? Confiscating assets used to support an insurgency against the territorial integrity of the US (supporting terror in modern parlance) also seems justifiable.

Perhaps these are early Patriot Acts! God help the US.

The Supreme Court will certainly be busy. The irony of course is that the incoming Congress would far prefer to hang half the rebels and imprison the other half indefinitely. We will see a 14th Amendment drafted to give effect to the idea a citizen can expressly or by their actions surrender their citizenship...

I'm personally interested in the Confiscation Act (particularly the state one already passed in Kentucky). Specifically, who gets the confiscated lands? The notion that the federal government has a higher claim on them than the states runs counter to precedent in this era - and, attainder or not, the chance of beating the Proclamation of Abandonment in the current political climate is zero, so opponents of the regime and rebel apologists will be focusing their efforts first on watering down or beating Confiscation. Since the new state governments will be initially pro-administration, the administration probably won't fight that too hard - and centralizing Southern state governments could come back to haunt them after Reconstruction. Just musing.

You continue to delight, KI.

I am myself wondering about the fight in Congress about the fate of confiscated land - between selling off the land to pay down the Government debt, endowing it to states to use to fund projects (see the Land Grant Universities like Cornell), allocation to Southern Unionists, veterans, freedmen, or its sale at an undervalue to the ner do well younger brothers and cousins of Republican party machine members...We'll have to see.

How would those removed of US citizenship be found? Those that don't declare for the Union? Any confederate official?

More than a few are Prisoners of War. The OMI can probaby produce a long list from captured records in Richmond and elsewhere.

I wonder if those goin into voluntary exile will have their property confiscated too?

General Stone and the OMI will certainly have a role to play is preparing the "List of Proscribed Persons"...

I'm guessing that anyone taking up arms against the US would be deemed to have de facto renounced their citizenship. You could then set up conditions under which citizenship could be regained, which could include a blanket amnesty for certain categories.

Which ought to be dealt with in detail by the revised Naturalization Act.

You did not have to be a citizen to live in America at the time.
Many people who fought for both sides were not US citizens.

The only significant foreigners who jump to mind (as in foreign citizens not just foreign born) are Major General Polignac of France, Colonel George St Leger Grenfell of Britain and that mad Prussian Major who rode with Stuart. They're all deportation jobs at least.

I think this is a fair bet. Unless they were involved in egregious war crimes, in order to avoid international difficulties they will be shipped home. Luckily General Leventhorpe, formerly of Her Majesty's Royal Army, is a naturalized citizen...well lucky for everyone except for him.
 
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The only significant foreigners who jump to mind (as in foreign citizens not just foreign born) are Major General Polignac of France, Colonel George St Leger Grenfell of Britain and that mad Prussian Major who rode with Stuart. They're all deportation jobs at least.

Foreign enlistment in the American Civil War


Confederate enlistment

While less successful in attracting foreign recruits to the rebel cause, thousands of immigrants and mercenaries served in the Confederate Army with its own Irish Brigade and Polish Legion as well as several German and Mexican divisions. The most notable volunteer division was formed from various European countries in Louisiana under the command of French Major General Count Camille Armand Jules Marie, Prince de Polignac. Other prominent volunteers included Scottish born blockade runner Captain William Watson.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_enlistment_in_the_American_Civil_War
 
Isnt Leventhorpe getting a raw deal here. Didnt everyone open fire on riotious assemblies in this era. The Draft Riots? Etc.

I know "i was only following orders" doesnt good (especially from an upper crust English stereptypical Hollywood villian) but it does seem harsh.
 
Isnt Leventhorpe getting a raw deal here. Didnt everyone open fire on riotious assemblies in this era. The Draft Riots? Etc.

I know "i was only following orders" doesnt good (especially from an upper crust English stereptypical Hollywood villian) but it does seem harsh.

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Yeah poor Collet Leventhorpe is about to join what in OTL is a long and lusterous tradition...
 
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Thus we reach the end of 1864 subject to a brief update on world events before we launch into the first quarter of 1865 (which I have briefly touched on in describing the surrender of the Confederacy in Texas and Kearny's occupation plans and illness).

I must pick up the pace! I am only managing two and a half TTL years per OTL year!!!!:eek:

Comments, thoughts, propositions and questions for 1865 gratefully received...

Indeed I'd hope we could both get to 1900, and do so before 2028. But hopefully now the first and foundational war is concluded you'll be able to.
 
The Supreme Court will certainly be busy. The irony of course is that the incoming Congress would far prefer to hang half the rebels and imprison the other half indefinitely. We will see a 14th Amendment drafted to give effect to the idea a citizen can expressly or by their actions surrender their citizenship...
I don't want to see how this affects anarchists or the modern Sovereign Citizen movement.
 
I don't want to see how this affects anarchists or the modern Sovereign Citizen movement.

Great comment - looking at them has oddly led me to the discovery of the Titles of Nobility Amendment which would have been the 13th Amendment. It seems that an earlier Congress was stumbling around the idea of Abandonment of Citizenship - in that instance by the citizen accepting a foreign title. Passed by the House and the Senate it was never ratified (but technically still could be).
 
Great comment - looking at them has oddly led me to the discovery of the Titles of Nobility Amendment which would have been the 13th Amendment. It seems that an earlier Congress was stumbling around the idea of Abandonment of Citizenship - in that instance by the citizen accepting a foreign title. Passed by the House and the Senate it was never ratified (but technically still could be).

What has been will be again. What has been done will be done again. There is nothing new under the sun.
 
Great comment - looking at them has oddly led me to the discovery of the Titles of Nobility Amendment which would have been the 13th Amendment. It seems that an earlier Congress was stumbling around the idea of Abandonment of Citizenship - in that instance by the citizen accepting a foreign title. Passed by the House and the Senate it was never ratified (but technically still could be).

Have you found any reference to the debates in Congress? They might prove very enlightening about earlier attitudes to stripping citizens of their citizenship. Accepting a foreign title to me is less compelling a reason than bearing arms against your nation and democratically elected government never mind a renunciation of your citizenship (which i suppose any oath as a Confederate citizen effectively was).

But the earlier Congress i suppose still had Britain, her nobles and titles in their rearview mirror. Speaking of which what was the citizenship status of unrepentant loyalists post-constitution?
 
Have you found any reference to the debates in Congress? They might prove very enlightening about earlier attitudes to stripping citizens of their citizenship. Accepting a foreign title to me is less compelling a reason than bearing arms against your nation and democratically elected government never mind a renunciation of your citizenship (which i suppose any oath as a Confederate citizen effectively was).

But the earlier Congress i suppose still had Britain, her nobles and titles in their rearview mirror. Speaking of which what was the citizenship status of unrepentant loyalists post-constitution?

Not yet - working on it. Concept is very similar and thus very interesting. In the meantime the 1865 world update will follow in the next few days (work allowing).
 
Not yet - working on it. Concept is very similar and thus very interesting. In the meantime the 1865 world update will follow in the next few days (work allowing).

Instead of working on this I have gotten carried away and created a Hall of Fame for all the Presidents through to the present day.:eek:. On a more realistic level I have a great Part II drafted for The Lame Duck Congress.

But back to world history for 1864...:(
 
Chapter One Hundred and Thirty Four 1864 – A Year In Events
Chapter One Hundred and Thirty Four

1864 – A Year In Events

United States:

• The Coinage Act is passed under the guidance of Secretary Chase allowing the phrase “In God We Trust” to be inscribed on US coinage;
Montana Territory is organized;
• Union Mills National Cemetery is dedicated in Maryland;
• President Lincoln abolishes the commutation fee that could be paid to avoid subscription at General Kearny’s request; and
• Nevada is admitted as the 36th US state.

Internationally

• The Second Schleswig War between Denmark and an alliance of Austria and Prussia. After a Danish victory at sea and several allied victories on land Denmark sues for peace. In the Treaty of Vienna Denmark surrenders Schleswig and Lauenburg to Prussia and Holstein to Austria;
• The Second Maori War erupts in New Zealand;
• Choe Je-u, founder of the Donghak movement, is executed in Korea;
• War erupts between Uruguay and the Empire of Brazil. Before the end of the year Paraguay will join the anti-Brazil faction in Uruguay
• Alexander II of Russia introduces judicial reforms; and
• There are significant developments in both Mexico and China…

From “An Empire of Hubris – China and the Great Powers: 1793-1885” by Prof. Edgar McCartney
Oxford University Press 1982


“The death of Li-Hung-chang or of Charles Gordon was perhaps inevitable after the incident at Soochow. Certainly the deliberate attempts by Henry Burgevine, and the accidental attempts of Halliday Macartney, to escalate the situation made a confrontation inevitable…

Gordon suspected Li and his guards had come to arrest him on that February morning. Gordon’s tension was almost certainly reflected in the Filipinos and Europeans who made up his personal guard in the EVA. It was an explosive mixture…

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Wreathed in scandal but with the support of the British commander in China, Gordon must revert to an officer of engineers

In the ensuing fracas Li and several of his guards were killed. The death of Li, the Emperor’s most talented servant in the South threw the Anwhei Army into chaos…

It is largely believed that Gordon considered taking the EVA over to the Taipings. There is no evidence to support that conclusion. Had he done so, it is inconceivable he could have remained a British officer…

In the end he followed General Brown’s advice and resigned his Chinese position. Brown, under advice from the old China hand, Harry Parkes, quickly sent Gordon off to New Zealand and out of the way…

On the other hand it is likely that Gordon at least turned a blind eye to the defection of Henry Burgevine to the Taipings with upwards of 300 Europeans, an unspecified number of Chinese EVA veterans and a large supply of arms and ammunition …

By the end of 1863 the Taiping army had been evicted from the vast region within 50 miles of Nanking. It appeared Nanking would come under direct assault early in 1864...

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The Third Battle of Nanking. Gordon's actions, as well as Burgevine's, seem to buy the Taiping time

The news of the death of Li-Hung-chang was a god-send to the Taiping. The collapse of the Anwhei army and the uncertain surrounding the loyalty of the remaining EVA meant that troops were withdrawn from the Imperial Army eastwards. These included the handful of troops trained and armed with, almost, modern firearms…

Hung Hsiu-chuan’s declaration that God would defend the city seemed prophetic when the news arrived of Li’s death and Gordon’s resignation. Hung Hsiu-chuan declared Gordon the “prodigal son” come to God’s understanding at last. This renewed faith and the removal of the Imperial’s riflemen, coupled with the European mercenaries who were assisting the Taiping doomed the Imperial army…

Li Hsiu-ch’eng, the Loyal King, led the final great attack on the Imperials on August 1st. He had sent 10,000 Taiping dressed as peasants and Imperials to infiltrate the Imperial camp. Bedlam ensued. 60,000 Imperials died. Over a 100,000 surrendered many of whom would be later executed. The Loyal King brought 3 shackled Imperial Generals before the Heavenly King. Mercy was not forthcoming…

At the same time an Imperial admiral tried to take Zhōngguāncūn as a diversion but failed. By the end of the year the Taiping had once again driven the Imperials north of the Yangtze. The success of the Taiping Army was partially due to the advanced weaponry adopted, namely, the firearms brought by Burgevine and others. It was also due to the failure of the Imperials to make most use of their own indigenously built bolt-action single-shot rifle. The third battle of Nanking had been a testing ground for the first modern firearms used in Chinese battles and the Imperials had, at least in this round of fighting, been found wanting..."

From "The Mexican Adventure through American Eyes" by David Hofstedder
LUS 1996


“The French, under Marshal Bazaine, occupied Guadalajara in early January 1864, and troops under General Douay occupied Zacatecas in February. Further decisive French victories continued with the fall of Acapulco in May, occupation of Durango in June, and the defeat of republicans in the states of Sinaloa and Jalisco in October. The internecine warfare between Juarez and Vidaurri the previous year had fundamentally weakened Republican forces in the north…

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French victories abounded in 1864

The only major repulse experienced by French arms was in late March 1864, as men from the French man-of-war Cordelière tried to take Mazatlán. They were repelled by Mexicans commanded by Colonel Gaspar Sánchez Ochoa…

Maximilian formally accepted the crown on 17 April, signing the Treaty of Miramar, and landed at Veracruz on 29 May 1864 in the SMS Novara. He was enthroned as Maximilian, Emperor of Mexico…

Maximilian was very much the product of the progressive ideas in vogue in Europe at the time. He favored the establishment of a limited monarchy sharing powers with a democratically-elected congress and inspired laws that abolished child labor, limited working hours, and abolished a system of land tenancy that virtually amounted to serfdom among the Indians. This was too liberal to please large sections of Mexico's conservatives, while the liberals refused to accept a monarch. This left Maximilian in a weak position. He had to rely on the French but he understood their support was unreliable in the long term. The Emperor realized he would have to work hard to establish his own support base in the country...

Not only did the Emperor extend an invitation to like-minded Europeans, which netted him Austrians, Hungarians, French and Belgian supporters but he also offered employment and asylum to many Confederate officers, troops and civilians. By the end of the year the numbers of Confederate refugees coming across the border was beginning to alarm the Juaristas. Matters became more serious when it became clear that Governor Viduarri, currently in exile in Texas, had been suborned by the Imperialists and was reorganizing his gubernational army. Vidaurri had French money, Confederate arms and some Confederate manpower…

Maximilian harbored dreams that the Confederates, mostly “conservative democrats” in Maximilian’s own words, might form the basis of his own mix of constitutional monarchy and democracy…

The end of the year was crowned by the victory of combined forces against Mazatlán. On Wednesday, 23 November 1864, four French men-of-war shelled Mazatlán as a prelude to an attack by Imperial Mexican forces under Manuel Lozada, who forced an entrance into the city that night. The next day the city fathers surrendered the city to the Emperor…”

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General Jo Shelby is presented, with the first Confederate exiles, to the Imperial Court
 
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That what people always used to say in Northern Ireland.
always remember the dead need to vote too.

If you can get Phil Kearny into second place in the Character poll I will update the Second Part of the Lame Duck Congress tomorrow!!!

Vote early! Vote often! And vote for all your dead or otherwise absent friends, relatives and slight acquaintances!

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