"Axis of Time" Trilogy by John Birmingham

Dammit. Well, I guess if I want to look forward to more new cultural clash cross-time fiction, there's only the Grantville franchise, then. At least that's going strong.

We need more time travel fiction, blast it.
 
My thoughts?
Book 3, however, is a throwaway. It killed one of the most important characters (Dan Black, the best 'temp vision) off screen in order to throw Julia's "troubles" into the light, it completely skips the Battle of Hawaii, and sees the Soviet Hordes build from nothing to a super-power in complete secret from a single captured ship. It tosses the plot thread of the Rusian Special Forces soldier instigating a rebellion from the officers in the Soviet camps, and completely trashes the Soviet Union. Stalin goes from mysterious and strong with a secret daughter in book 2 to being batshit insane and hosting drunken, vomit-filled orgies in which his ministers are forced to soil themselves in front of foreign diplomats.

Ah, yes, Josef Stalin and the Soviet Union. That, too, took me by surprise.

The only thing I can figure is, that with a couple years of being left alone — combined with a disregard for human rights (i.e. massive slave labor) — it was enough for the Stalin and the SU to even the scales (moreso, if you count the SU's successful nuclear weapons program). All that in two years, though? It does boggle the mind ...

One thing I found nice is that Birmingham gave a clue real early in "Final Impact" that the SU did have the Vanguard. There's a line where Khruschev is being led off to his execution, and he sees another prisoner being hauled off to points unknown — a badly beaten woman wearing a British naval uniform. That's all the reader gets until much farther in the book as to the official whereabouts of the missing Vanguard. Devious, Birmingham, devious, I tell you!

RealityBYTES
 
I say they need a total rewrite of the 3rd novel that doesn't have Dan black dying, or the Soviet Union going all crazy and shows the retake of hawaii
 
I do realize that McCarthy and Hoover were ass holes. And what reputation do i have? I guess i get some of my impressions of Hoover from my step dad. His father was friends with him and he often saw him.
 
Not that kind. What he really remembers is when his brother went missing in the woods near his uncles farm his father called Hoover and he showed up with some agents and they combed the woods.
 
Why was Hoover an arsehole now again?

Some points:

*Manual transmission was just an example, of course. It could be any number of other things; how would these future crackpots survive without checking the Wikipedia for everything?;) Thing is, they have suddenly lost most of the technology that's been making their lives lazy and comfortable for the last decades. They should be, like, 19th century aristocrats thrown back to the Dark Ages. They'll survive, but they won't thrive.

*And the physical perfectness of the Kohlhammer-ers: women civilians (in a dangerous profession, I'll give) are apparently stronger and faster than trained '40s Marines. OK, in very exceptional cases that might even be true, but I refuse to think that would be the norm. Not with anything short of genetic tampering, but they aren't that Draka yet, right?

*The murderous (or rather, robotic-killing impassionate) attitude of the various Kohlhammer-ers disturbs me less than the destruction of the '40s culture. This is nothing but a blatant attempt by a liberal author to slight the War on Terror, and can be disregarded as such. (So should the cultural subversion be a political statement, I guess, but since it's much more detailed and personal, it irritates me all the more...)
 
No one said Hoover was an arsehole, did they? IIRC he was a very good engineer and administrator who got politically castrated by the Great Depression and so didn't really get credit for any steps he did take to relieve it.

McCarthy was a total arsehole though.

Electric Monk said:
He has a reputation?

He's 13 and espouses what he thinks is Conservatism in a fit of teenage rebelliousness.
 
Book 2 is also where we see 21C personnel shoot Japanese captives by the thousands from behind with pistols, which is said to take days to complete.

I'm not sure about the days part, but the captives were actually Chinese POWs used as 'meat shields' onboard the Japanese decoy boats. In that sense, its even worse than shooting Japanese POWs.

EDIT: Ah hell, I think I know what you mean.

*prepares to get whupped hard in the ass*
 
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*And the physical perfectness of the Kohlhammer-ers: women civilians (in a dangerous profession, I'll give) are apparently stronger and faster than trained '40s Marines. OK, in very exceptional cases that might even be true, but I refuse to think that would be the norm. Not with anything short of genetic tampering, but they aren't that Draka yet, right?
Not really. Julia is a special case among special cases. She's a combat embed who has been cleared (read: trained) to 21C tactics, and knows martial arts that they really don't teach in 41. She wears commercial armor that is even better than the standard 21C. And like the other 21C soldiers, she has the inserts that chemically let her ignore fatigue, sleep deprivation, or even being shot.

And she's the only one like that.

Her coworker who gets killed in Hawaii is clearly not such, hence why she never does it if she can. A disparaging one-liner in the first book mentions that most the other reporters on the Clinton don't do what she does.

After that, the only "civilian" women who approach your are in fact retired soldiers or sailors, not all of whom are even implied to fit your expression. The ones who do, like Slim Jim's advisor/attorney, do so because they are trained marines. IE, they know how to fight so they won't be overpowered. I can't recall once that it was shown that the women of 21C routinely phisicaly overpowered men; in fact in the third book it's noted that women have a harder time flying the older planes because of the lack of very good hydrolic systems.

*The murderous (or rather, robotic-killing impassionate) attitude of the various Kohlhammer-ers disturbs me less than the destruction of the '40s culture. This is nothing but a blatant attempt by a liberal author to slight the War on Terror, and can be disregarded as such. (So should the cultural subversion be a political statement, I guess, but since it's much more detailed and personal, it irritates me all the more...)
No, it's proof that he knew what he was trying to do: to scare you from assuming that Kolhammer's ways were naturally good. It's a clearly intended societal clash point, and one that comes up again and again in the second and third books.

The author presents a picture of what could happen if things go bad. He doesn't say that they are good or will solve the problems; the 21C were still fighting the "C" word despite over a decade of their RoE, and all the power at their fingertips wasn't good for building things, just blowing them up. When they mention campaigns such as Lebanon or Iran, they comment on how onesided it was and how it was so violent and destructive. What they never say or imply, however, is that these fights ever made anything better. The closest thing is when they comment on how liberating NK was like seeing Stockholm Syndrome writ large, but that's about it.

Saying that the author advocates this mentality, which is shown to have been merely vengefully satisfying rather than effective on the root of the problem, is nearly as absurd as accusing Stirling of wishing for a Draka reality because he had the Draka win.
 
I'm not sure about the days part, but the captives were actually Chinese POWs used as 'meat shields' onboard the Japanese decoy boats. In that sense, its even worse than shooting Japanese POWs.

EDIT: Ah hell, I think I know what you mean.

*prepares to get whupped hard in the ass*

Incorrect, I'm afraid. Kolhammer's troops in Australia "sanctioned" combatants, who were all Japanese. There was no mention what so ever of Japan employing the Chinese soldiers in Australia in any capacity, or of any being sanctioned. (If I'm wrong, you'll have to quote the chapter and verse.)

The Chinese troop barges were solely a diversion to sop up 21C weapons. The Chinese in there were captives, not conscripts or enlistees (such as when the guards open fire on that one escapee attempt). They were never used in combat or occupation capacity, and no reference is ever made to them being sanctioned.

What you're thinking of is the even where Kennedy is sent to pick up some surviving Chinese after sinking one such ship, and when the Chinese threaten to overwhelm the boat a 21C officer takes a submachine gun and proceeds to shoot the ones threatening to capsize the boat.
 
Ah, that certainly did freshen up my mind a bit. Been quite a while since I read the books proper, hence that little misunderstanding. I'm thinking that the shooting of Chinese captives was just as bad as the sanctioning of the Japanese POWs, if not worse because the Chinese just happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

Incorrect, I'm afraid. Kolhammer's troops in Australia "sanctioned" combatants, who were all Japanese. There was no mention what so ever of Japan employing the Chinese soldiers in Australia in any capacity, or of any being sanctioned. (If I'm wrong, you'll have to quote the chapter and verse.)

The Chinese troop barges were solely a diversion to sop up 21C weapons. The Chinese in there were captives, not conscripts or enlistees (such as when the guards open fire on that one escapee attempt). They were never used in combat or occupation capacity, and no reference is ever made to them being sanctioned.

What you're thinking of is the even where Kennedy is sent to pick up some surviving Chinese after sinking one such ship, and when the Chinese threaten to overwhelm the boat a 21C officer takes a submachine gun and proceeds to shoot the ones threatening to capsize the boat.
 
Ah, that certainly did freshen up my mind a bit. Been quite a while since I read the books proper, hence that little misunderstanding. I'm thinking that the shooting of Chinese captives was just as bad as the sanctioning of the Japanese POWs, if not worse because the Chinese just happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.
It was a Devil's Delimma. Japanese forces were on their way, and there were so many Chinese that were they to try and rescue them all, the boat would sink. And were they to have let the Chinese keep climing on, the boat would sink. And were they to be too nice about it, the boat would sink once japanese ships came by.

It's a rather telling difference that while the 21C soldiers ruthlessly cut down the survivors threatening their escape, they were surprised that Kennedy attempted to steer between the swimmers rather than making a B-line out of there.
 
It was a Devil's Delimma. Japanese forces were on their way, and there were so many Chinese that were they to try and rescue them all, the boat would sink. And were they to have let the Chinese keep climing on, the boat would sink. And were they to be too nice about it, the boat would sink once japanese ships came by.

They could have just fired several rounds into the air to scare 'em off and knocked those attempting to board back into the water before zipping off instead of killing the swimming captives with random spraying to make a point.

It's a rather telling difference that while the 21C soldiers ruthlessly cut down the survivors threatening their escape, they were surprised that Kennedy attempted to steer between the swimmers rather than making a B-line out of there.

That part really showed me that the 21Cs were not above the 'barbarisms' of the 'temps, and while the latter had their own failings, they weren't all that bad either.
 
*The murderous (or rather said:
Wow, having no idea whatsoever what Birmingham's own politics are, I would never have considered him a "liberal" author, or the books a secret liberal/antiwar manifesto Maybe it's an age thing (I'm almost 60), but with the exception of the explicit racism and homophobia of the 40's people (which I think he got quite correct), I felt much more comfortable with them that Krauthammer's people, who were depicted as virutally alien (the Race, but much more efficient). To my recollection, the 20 year war on terror was never presented in an anti-western light - only the justifiable reaction of the west to global terrorism.
 
Saying that the author advocates this mentality, which is shown to have been merely vengefully satisfying rather than effective on the root of the problem, is nearly as absurd as accusing Stirling of wishing for a Draka reality because he had the Draka win.

Why, that's never happened. NEVER, I tell you! ;)

RealityBYTES
 
Why, that's never happened. NEVER, I tell you! ;)

RealityBYTES

It's tough, sometimes, to tell the difference. Here, as with the Draka series, however, it's fairly clear. Still... it'd be nice to have the author there, reading behind your shoulder and picking out all of the details and what he was thinking as he wrote it, kind of like the audio commentary on a DVD.
 
It's tough, sometimes, to tell the difference. Here, as with the Draka series, however, it's fairly clear. Still... it'd be nice to have the author there, reading behind your shoulder and picking out all of the details and what he was thinking as he wrote it, kind of like the audio commentary on a DVD.

Yes, it would be. Hmm. Perhaps the next best thing, though, is having the author as a forum member. I know Stirling once posted here, until Ian banned him. But what about Birmingham? Does he hang around AH on occasion?

RealityBYTES
 
Yes, it would be. Hmm. Perhaps the next best thing, though, is having the author as a forum member. I know Stirling once posted here, until Ian banned him. But what about Birmingham? Does he hang around AH on occasion?

RealityBYTES

I think he totally forgot about this place. It's been a while since he visited here.
 
Yes, it would be. Hmm. Perhaps the next best thing, though, is having the author as a forum member. I know Stirling once posted here, until Ian banned him. But what about Birmingham? Does he hang around AH on occasion?

RealityBYTES

Why was he banned? I enjoyed the posts of his that I saw.


As for Birmingham, you can get some information from his blog, birmo.journalspace.com

Stirling posts there sometimes, too.
 
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