A Glorious Union or America: the New Sparta

In TTL Mexico will always be more interesting!

I also agree that GUA postwar Mexico will be very interesting; I think it could easily be spun off into its own timeline. What do all of you think?

Completely agreed on both counts :D

A rise (and more than likely eventual fall) of the Second Mexican Empire is always interesting. I've been doing quite a bit of reading about it recently so its apparent survival here has really caught my attention. There's so much potential for it in this story, especially as the second empire in the Americas :)
 
Great chapter KI! I just can't wait for the moment Agnes Kearny snaps and tells her hubby "You will take an actual vacation while you are on vacation OR ELSE!!!":mad:

BTW do you have the party's schedule worked up? How many countries will the party visit on tour?

I also agree that GUA postwar Mexico will be very interesting; I think it could easily be spun off into its own timeline. What do all of you think?

That will happen! We have Spain, Italy, Austria, Bavaria, Prussia, Baden, Belgium and France again.Its a six month tour.

One world building exercise at a time!!
 
Just finished 'Kearny The Magnificant' by Werstein. Kearny's life is an AH masterpiece. I'd believe just about anything now. Are you going to use the New York river pirate story at all?
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Werstein's book is a fun read;

Just finished 'Kearny The Magnificant' by Werstein. Kearny's life is an AH masterpiece. I'd believe just about anything now. Are you going to use the New York river pirate story at all?

Werstein's book is a fun read; definitely more a popular than scholarly biography, and certainly a product of its time, but nicely written.

An AH counterpart (Irma) shows up in BROS.

Best,
 
Chapter One Hundred and Forty Six The Kearny Mission - The American Crown Prince Part II
Chapter One Hundred and Forty Six

The Kearny Mission - The American Crown Prince

Part II

From "The Mexican Adventure through American Eyes" by David Hofstedder
LUS 1996


“The unspoken obsession of the Imperial Court was the campaign in Mexico and American attitudes toward it. Publicly Secretary of State Seward continued to invoke the Monroe Doctrine and threaten dire consequences. In private President Lincoln had quietly vetoed any immediate military involvement in Mexico. The radicals in Congress, fearing the administration would be “distracted from the subjugation of the slaveholding South and true emancipation of the slave” (Benjamin Wade), had made their opposition to an American adventure south of the Rio Grande clear. All this however was unknown in the French Court…

None the less Napoleon tasked his Court with obtaining the views of the Kearny party on the intervention in Mexico. Of the party only Senator Hale succeeded in maintaining the official position of the US government, at least if French records are to be believed. Invoking the Monroe Doctrine Hale indicated the French presence in Mexico would not long be tolerated once America had resolved her present difficulties. General Stevens on the other hand caught French officers off-guard by suggesting America would not have to interfere in Mexico as the French would soon evacuate Mexico on their own. Stevens firmly believed Mexico was a political and military quagmire in which no victory could long be maintained. That being so he believed the French were themselves beginning to realize the trouble they had volunteered for in invading the country…

Philip Kearny’s view that Mexico would benefit from a constitutional monarchy in the European model were hinted at in French government papers. Kearny was more forthcoming about his views on Mexican culture, literacy, religion, superstitions etc. All of which led the French Court to conclude that Kearny was sympathetic, if not to the French intervention itself, then at least to the attempt to establish a European-style Constitutional Monarchy in Mexico…

Kearny’s views were maintained and supported by John Watts de Peyster. De Peyster’s later writings from his time in office would indicate that he believed a French presence in Mexico would be beneficial to the United States. He held the belief that the existential threat of a Habsburg Empire in Mexico would be enough to justify an enlarged United States military long beyond the Reconstruction of the southern states (in a way that British North America could never be). “Just as the threat of French Canada served to unite Britain and her American colonies, so too would the threat of a stable catholic Mexican Monarchy provide the mortar uniting our diverse continental regions”…”

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“The journey through Spain was less eventful. The party stayed in Madrid briefly before moving on to Barcelona. Again General Kearny was accorded full military and civic honors. He has met by the alcalde (the mayor) of Madrid and a military parade was hastily arranged. However relations between the United States and Spain remained poor. Although the US government was happy for exiled rebels to reside in Spanish Cuba, there was still a lingering resentment of the Spanish tolerance of rebel activity within its borders during the war…

When Kearny was invited for an audience with the Queen he declined due to a relapse of his illness. Some suspected that Senator Hale had encouraged a political illness in Kearny. Then again given Kearny’s constant activity during his weeks in France it can be believed that his barely recovered health may well have collapsed again…

…they travelled by sea to Genoa and thence to Turin. Although allowed to rest in Turin in peace for several days, the parties’ arrival in the temporary seat of government, Florence, saw a repeat of their treatment in Paris. General Kearny was feted as a hero of the Risorgimento. Giuseppe Garibaldi was present in Florence at that time. With a band of his veterans he met Kearny’s carriage. The former redshirts detached the horses and proceed to drag the carriage through the streets of Florence to much cheering and celebration. At the temporary parliament building Kearny was met by the Prime Minister, General Alfonso Ferrero, Cavaliere La Màrmora…”

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Prime Minister, General Alfonso Ferrero, Cavaliere La Màrmora

From “Kearny the Magnificent” by Roger Galton
NorthWestern 2005


“How much these two men would have in common: a war hero who had risen to the highest political office in his nation and another on the same trajectory. During the six days Kearny spent in Florence he twice went riding for several hours with Marmora. Chauncey McKeever, who accompanied them on both occasions, confirmed their conversation was wide ranging: taking in military tactics and the latest innovations; memories of Solferino; foreign affairs and particularly the impending French evacuation of Rome. Of the impending alliance with Prussia though there appears no mention…

It was during this time that King Victor Emmanuel sought to honor Kearny for his involvement in the war against Austria. The King made it known he would induct Philip Kearny into the Order of Saints Maurice and Lazarus as a Cavaliere. Kearny initially sought to refuse the award as he felt that the Commanding General of the United States Army should not accept foreign awards or titles, as it was “against the spirit of the Constitution to accept” (McKeever recording Kearny’s views) even if it was not technically prohibited. Victor Emmanuel had a persuasive counter-argument “General Kearny my friend, one does not refuse a King…

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“Passing briefly through Venice which Regis de Trobriand and his wife knew well from their many years in residence, the party passed northwards into the Alps on the way to Vienna…

Although General Kearny was treated with courtesy and an old world chivalry that welcomed a brave former foe, it was not considered politic that Kearny or the members of his party be presented to the Emperor. Nonetheless Kearny was presented to Archduke Rainer Ferdinand, Minister President of Austria, and Foreign Minister Count Alexander von Mensdorff-Pouilly, Prince Dietrichstein von Nicholsburg…

The Americans were on safer ground in Vienna. Austria had taken little active part in the diplomatic attempts to intervene in the American War. A few Austrian rifles had found their way through third parties into the hands of both armies, to largely poor reviews. The Austrian army and government were still struggling to cope with the consequences of defeat in the Second Italian War, and those of victory in the Second Schleswig War. Tensions with Italy over Venetia continued unabated and now Prussian seemed intent on provoking Austria…

From all I have seen and heard the Austrian army is now in a worse condition than that which I faced in Lombardy seven years ago…” concluded Kearny in a letter to John F. Reynolds. John Watts de Peyster, always with an eye to learning lessons for the American military, asked more searching questions: “Huge numbers of conscripts remain on permanent leave from the army making the purpose of conscription, the training of a pool of reserves, unserved…Much is talked about the latest rifled artillery of which much is expected. However my enquiries have yet to find whether any pieces have actually been purchased for the army…the quality of the officers we have met is entirely mixed. Gallant young men of high birth they may be but I am not as yet impressed that there is much knowledge in their military duty. I would set the knowledge and experience of these young scoundrels of our staff against any Austrian officer, even those who have professed to have fought in Lombardy or the Danish Duchies…

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“Munich was much enjoyed by the ladies of the party. The Swan King, Ludwig II, matched the offer of Napoleon and ensured the honored party resided in the finest accommodation the Crown could arrange. Again another huge ball was thrown in General Kearny’s honor and for once Agnes did not complain. The young King had charmed Agnes at their presentation…

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King Ludwig II of Bavaria

To what extent Ludwig’s professions of friendship were a result of his genuine admiration and respect for Kearny and the United States is not clear. Certainly the Minister-President of Bavaria, Baron Karl Ludwig von der Pfordten, had an ulterior motive…

The Minister-President has again opportuned me on the subject of a federation of German States. He is most interested in the balance of Federal versus state power in our system…He seemed most surprised by the suggestion that the rebellion of the Southern States was in part a rejection of that mode of balance mandated by our Constitution…His object is clearly to unite the minor German states in a union of some type with the express purpose of excluding Prussia and Austria from mastery of German affairs…One must remember he has been a minister in the Saxon government before his return to Bavaria… He has, despite his optimism little support in the various Kingdoms, Grand Duchies, Duchies and Principalities. Yet I feel there is a natural undercurrent tending to a national feeling and toward a union of the Germans into one great nation, ruled by one common head as a national unit…” (John P. Hale to Secretary Seward)…”

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“Prussia was a veritable undiscovered country to the Kearny party. Britain, France, and Italy – all these were well known to members of the party. Even Spain did not seem so alien to men who had fought in Mexico. No it was their Prussian sojourn that was an adventure into the unknown…

The generals were familiar with ‘48ers who had stood foursquare with Lincoln and the Union. Many had fought in the Germanies but none on the Prussian side. The nearest to a Prussian veteran Kearny had served with was General von Steinwehr, veteran of the Brunswickian army which took its lead from its larger Prussian neighbor…

Prussia seemed to be a country on the move. After the glories of Frederick the Great, the Prussian light dimmed during the Napoleonic Wars where its defeats were its own and its victories shared. Now Prussia was ascending again with victory over Denmark and a policy independent and increasingly hostile to its rival in the Germanies, Austria. Many saw this revival of fortunes as the work of one man, Count Otto von Bismarck…

The impending visit by Phil Kearny had been anticipated in Berlin for several weeks. Furthermore it was strongly rumored that, upon the party’s return to France, the Emperor intended to honor Kearny with a huge military parade on the Champ de Mars. Not to be outdone King Wilhelm intended to stage a series of military exercises – Kriegsspiele – to which Kearny and his fellow generals would be invited. In this he had the support of Albrecht Graf von Roon, the War Minister, and his own War Cabinet. Only the Minister President, Bismarck, voiced a word of caution “You do not show a potential opponent how you intend to play the game except perhaps to convince him not to play against you at all”. However Bismarck did not labor his opposition and ultimately demurred “Let the Americans see then. We shall not find Prussia playing them in a hundred years”. He was to change his tune after he had met General Philip Kearny…”

From “Kearny the Magnificent” by Roger Galton
NorthWestern 2005


“An unseasonal cold snap and an unfortunate overnight stay in a sickly Dresden had left several members of the party in a delicate condition. Nonetheless after two days’ rest in Berlin, Phil Kearny, de Trobriand, Stevens, de Peyster, McKeever, Fitzgerald and the US Counsel to Berlin, Norman P Judd, set out to observe the Prussian exercises over the next three days. Kearny and de Peyster were reduced to riding in a coach but this still afforded them a good view of most of the exercises…

Unable to ride Kearny spent longer than he otherwise might in the relative comfort of the command headquarters of Corps Black, the formation under the command of Lieutenant General Edwin Freiherr von Manteuffel. It was during the second day that Kearny first met Otto von Bismarck…”

From “The Reluctant Professional – The Life and Letters of Chauncey McKeever” edited by Roger Galbraith
NorthWestern 2012


*Editors note: The text switches from McKeever quoting and commenting on Kearny to the editor Dr. Galbraith quoting and commenting on McKeever

The conversation was candid, at least on our side. Von Roon and the Prussian Generals of Schwarze Korps had exhausted General Kearny the day before with their questions about our late war…At first they seemed dismissive, but as the General spoke they became transfixed”. The General played the dashing cavalier who had suffered his Damascene conversion to a different form of war on the bloody fields of Virginia, Pennsylvania and Maryland…

War” he said “would be unrecognizable in 50 years from that fought 50 years earlier”. “With each passing campaign, war became less about courage, glory and honor and more about the industrial sinews of the nations who strove in it.” I heard General Kearny say to Manteuffel that he feared “men's lives were becoming the fuel of war…Its outcome decided by which nation could afford to keep the fires burning the brightest or longest”. The General seemed young and dashing in France and even indeed in Italy. We could all see the fine young officer of cavalry he had been. In Prussia he was a commander of great hosts. An old man certainly, but one wise in the vicissitudes of war. Von Molkte, who was acting as an umpire for the games, confided that he thought our General had developed “a very Prussian understanding of war”…

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L to R: On horseback - Chauncey McKeever, Isaac Stevens and Regis de Trobriand. In the carriage - John Watts de Peyster, Philip Kearny, Louis Fitzgerald (in his New York Fire Zouaves dress uniform) and Norman P Judd (US Consul in Berlin) . On foot - Otto von Bismarck

Bismarck though, he wished to know about the future on that second day. He fished for the General’s views on British North America and the French intervention in Mexico. Senator Hale tried to deliver the administration answer, but the General’s discomfort had made him impatient with that hypocrisy. “I wish the French and Maximilian well in Mexico. The Mexicans have had no success in giving themselves stability and good government, and my nation refuses to. It is right that we should let someone else try”. McKeever then sets out the bones of a conversation which has been reproduced in print and film many times…

Bismarck: “Surely General the President’s government would never tolerate another European power on its border, an empire, in breach of your much vaunted Monroe Doctrine? Your Secretary Seward repeats it so to every European he meets that I wonder he knows any other words”.

Kearny: “Why not sir? Our United States have nothing to fear from a stable Mexico or for that matter our friends in France. France, sir, is America’s first ally. Before we were a nation French blood, French arms and French specie sealed our friendship. We Americans will never forget the debt we owe the French people. Would that it were one we could repay in my lifetime.”

Bismarck: “Indeed General. America has very wisely eschewed our European troubles. An admirable pacific policy

Kearny: “Ha! Does any of us know what the future holds for our country? A change of policy is never but a pen stroke away?

From “Kearny the Magnificent” by Roger Galton
NorthWestern 2005


"Von Roon recorded a conversation with Bismarck on Kearny. Whether accurate or written with hindsight it is provoking in any event. Von Roon claims to have noted to Bismarck that the United States would be lucky to have such a man of destiny as Kearny as its President. If the recorded response is accurate it is perhaps the best example of Bismarck’s perspicacity: Philip Kearny was to his mind "the most dangerous man of influence I have yet met".

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“Agnes dug in her heels after Berlin. Both Philip and John de Peyster had been taken ill twice since landing in Europe. Old Uncle Lawrence too was visibly exhausted. He continued to labor under a cold caught in Dresden which got slowly worse. The invitations of Kings and Dukes were now as nothing to her demands – the party would have a real rest. The spa resort at Baden-Baden was their destination until Agnes was satisfied that all the party’s 'croakers' were rested. Taking the waters and walks in the Lichtentaler Allee were to be the height of excitement…

After Brussels the party returned to Paris. It was well Agnes had insisted on rest before the final leg of their tour for they return to Paris to a whirlwind of events. The Emperor had arranged a grand parade in honor of his American guests. In return Kearny had arranged himself to host a ball. Not in Paris but at Saumur. The jaded members of the Imperial Court perhaps thought it an odd choice and expected a modest affair. After all it was a private not a state affair. Yet officers of the army and the cavalry in particular vied for invitations. Those who had been at Saumur in 1840 recalled the ball Lieutenant Kearny had thrown in the Grand Hall of the Cavalry School. An unlimited budget had been placed at the disposal of the organizing committee; the supper was sent from Paris by one of that city’s most celebrated restaurateurs; every gentleman had received a morocco leather and silver cigar case and every lady a bouquet of flowers in an elegant silver holder.

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Ecole de cavalerie de Saumur

The ball in 1865 was, if possible on a grander scale. Important military and civil dignitaries crowded the hall. Ambassadors, princes, envoys, generals, businessmen and guests from a dozen countries were present. “I believe the General has invited everyone he has met on our travels in Europe” (McKeever). The first affair at Saumar had been heralded as the greatest in France between the Empires. The second affair was considered its superior in every respect. The ball confirmed Kearny as the foremost lion of French if not indeed all European society. Only de Peyster was unimpressed. “Another ball such as this and I will be the rich cousin…

The magnificent parade on the Champ de Mars was an unparallel sight: a magnificent array of uniforms of every hue; horseflesh of unequalled quality; martial music of the most stirring kind…

General Morris thought General Kearny seemed somber given the magnificent spectacle and sought to know the reason. “My friend the French army makes a magnificent spectacle. That is the army of Marengo and Austerlitz, of the Malakoff and Solferino: Victories past. From what I have seen and heard here in France and learned myself in service, unless this army is reformed that I fear is where its victories remain – the past.” McKeever records a different conversation between Kearny and de Trobriand “Our army must have something of the French vitality in battle: a thing that comes naturally to our volunteer soldier, but what we need more is something of that Prussian organization we saw at Bernau. A thing which does not come naturally to our American idea of war…

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The Grand Review on the Champ de Mars​

From “The Mission” by Evangeline Lawrence
Brogan Mills 1988


“For six months Philip Kearny and a half-dozen American generals and politicians had toured the capitols of Europe. They had made an impact well beyond their numbers. The American Civil War was now not some story on a page. The names now had faces. The heroes now had form. Who knows how the war might have been perceived without the Kearny mission…

In any event the name Philip Kearny was linked with the presidency of the United States in every court in Europe long before it reached such a status in the councils of America’s politicians…
 
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I will probably do "Brotherhood, Trauma and a Great Purpose - The Army and its Veterans" next: The immediate future of the post-war reconstructist army, army reform and also the veterans movement.

Still looking at potential alternatives to the GAR...
 
Really liked this bit:

The ball confirmed Kearny as the foremost lion of French if not indeed all European society. Only de Peyster was unimpressed. “Another ball such as this and I will be the rich cousin…”

Really didn't like being second fiddle did he? :D

Lots of interesting foreshadowing in that update. Looking forward to how the post-war reorganization of the army (and navy) goes. I'm assuming we shall see some variant of the "Grand Army of the Republic" in the aftermath.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
TKI - nicely done...

Very nicely done. I dunno about PK being that sanguine about a European prince imposed by French bayonets in Mexico; granted, he was a Francophile of the highest order, but he'd also fought there, knew the country, and presumably would not have been all that impressed by the Austrians (or, for that matter, after Puebla, the French expeditionary forces...)

But it's your take on him.

And a very minor thing - I believe you mean "martial" music.;)

Best,
 
Really liked this bit:

Really didn't like being second fiddle did he? :D

Lots of interesting foreshadowing in that update. Looking forward to how the post-war reorganization of the army (and navy) goes. I'm assuming we shall see some variant of the "Grand Army of the Republic" in the aftermath.

John Watts de Peyster is a fascinating character in his own right. Involved in the founding of the NYPD and NYFD; militia general; military historian - he was one of the first boosters of George Thomas and JNO Buford so he had a bloody good eye for military talent and innovation (on the down side he thought Sickles was right at Gettysburg); philanthropist. Only his apparent ill-health keep him from achieving greater things and it cannot have been that bad as he lived to be 86. No in TTL public office beckons...

Outstanding work KI! Interesting developments in this update.

Very nice, thanks for the update. :)

Thanks both.

Very nicely done. I dunno about PK being that sanguine about a European prince imposed by French bayonets in Mexico; granted, he was a Francophile of the highest order, but he'd also fought there, knew the country, and presumably would not have been all that impressed by the Austrians (or, for that matter, after Puebla, the French expeditionary forces...)

But it's your take on him.

And a very minor thing - I believe you mean "martial" music.;)

Best,

Well it is an extreme view and is certainly out of step with the establishment view on OTL. There are several factors which I feel have allowed me to build this world view for Kearny:

(1) Kearny was a Francophile of the highest order as you say;
(2) He was never afraid to say very controversial things loudly where they would cause the most offence (I love him being led away from McClellan by Hooker repeating coward/traitor loudly);
(3) Charmed as Kearny was by Mexico and its people (and which veterans from that war have you ever heard say bad things about the people?) he had an extremely poor view of their attempts at government;
(4) There are hints that he may have been an annexationist or at least someone who believed the US should do more to shepherd Mexico's path, but that involves a lot of reading between the lines. de Peyster was more obviously of the "Mexicans = catholics = peasants = not fit for democracy" school and I imagine he is one of the few trusted advisors Kearny listens to;
(5) He did seem to come to his conclusions via very unique reasoning. For example his views of slavery are formed, not by his exposure to American slaves or freedmen, but by the performance of North Africans on both sides of the war against the Rifs and his reading about the West Indian Regiments in the British Army (see his early comments in this TL which are genuine).
(6) My fatuous reason is that I like to say controversial things especially when I am bored and ill. Kearny has a ridiculous temper at the best of times (marginally better than Meade but more given to acts of violence - the occasional horsewhipping of river thugs etc). He is also a very cranky patient. The opportunity to wind someone like Bismarck while rotten with a cold up is too good a chance to cheer himself up to miss.

I can't believe no one has commented on the foreshadowing.

"Lafayette, we are here."

I suspect Congress would have an 'episode' and this is still the 1860s - in a European war how quickly could the US army or marines mobilize a force of any meaningful size and ship it to Europe? The Austro-Prussian war lasted for 2 months and 9 days; the Franco-Prussian War went from start to Sedan also in about two months...whatever Kearny's dreams and principles he still lives in his own time...still he is a believer in war in a way we have yet to explore so you can expect some more military excitement from him...

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I cannot believe this picture. It even looks like Kearny and Peyster and the others.

I was pleased to find it. It is supposed to be Napoleon III meeting Bismarck but in truth the carriage figure does look more like Kearny and the likenesses in uniform for Americans is good as are McKeever, de Peyster and Judd. I couldn't work out what to do about the young aide in the fancy uniform until I recalled Fitzgerald's commission before joining Kearny's staff was from the New York Fire Zouaves.
 
As things go, I still see the war of 1870 happening, but with French army being more influenced by American civil war lessons, at least on strategic level.
 
I was pleased to find it. It is supposed to be Napoleon III meeting Bismarck but in truth the carriage figure does look more like Kearny and the likenesses in uniform for Americans is good as are McKeever, de Peyster and Judd. I couldn't work out what to do about the young aide in the fancy uniform until I recalled Fitzgerald's commission before joining Kearny's staff was from the New York Fire Zouaves.

That is just what you call luck.
 
I suspect Congress would have an 'episode' and this is still the 1860s - in a European war how quickly could the US army or marines mobilize a force of any meaningful size and ship it to Europe? The Austro-Prussian war lasted for 2 months and 9 days; the Franco-Prussian War went from start to Sedan also in about two months...whatever Kearny's dreams and principles he still lives in his own time...still he is a believer in war in a way we have yet to explore so you can expect some more military excitement from him...

Quite so. Kearny may be in favor of supporting France during such a war (if it still happens) but just like Roosevelt during the lead up to WWII there is only so much a sitting President can do to get involved. And with such a short time span frankly there is nothing aside from maybe lending France diplomatic support in the peace deal. And the times being what they are...getting involved in a war in Europe not likely. If it were a longer war you might see the US offering to take some duties in Mexico off France's hands (if they are still there) to free up troops but that would be it.

On an aside the shortness of a lot of these wars from this period in Europe is why WWI was so traumatic. Everyone expected it to be short like these and as it drug on and the mechanical slaughter of it kept going on truly did traumatize Europe. It is nice to see Kearny and a few others predicting it yet do they truly grasp what it all means?
 
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