WI: The Pope supresses the Teutonic order in 14th century

Iserlohn

kasumigenx said:
In 1308 the Archbishop of Riga appealed to Pope Clement V, making serious charges
against the order, and endeavoring to prevail upon him to suppress it in the
same way as the Templars had lately been dealt with.



http://history-world.org/teutonic_knights.htm

What if the pope decided to suppress them.
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The Livonian Order remains indepedent and retains control over its territories / regains full control over them (excluding Estonia, which was added later). The rest goes to Poland, which then remains A LOT more powerful (unless internal problems arise).

Lithuania will certainly be interesting, since the Grand Duke only became Christian in 1386 IIRC and thus the Lithuanian nobility might convert to Orthodoxy unless Poland makes attempts to christianize the lands themselves.
 

abas

Iserlohn said:
The Livonian Order remains indepedent and retains control over its territories / regains full control over them (excluding Estonia, which was added later).
Click to expand...
You means Livonian branch of the Teutonic knights? It wasn't a separate order. I don't think that the archbishop would be satisfied with new order, they had similar issues with the sword brothers as well.

The rest goes to Poland, which then remains A LOT more powerful (unless internal problems arise).
Click to expand...
More likely the pope would take the former territory of the order under his direct control.

Lithuania will certainly be interesting, since the Grand Duke only became Christian in 1386 IIRC and thus the Lithuanian nobility might convert to Orthodoxy unless Poland makes attempts to christianize the lands themselves.
Click to expand...
The first candidate would be the archbishop of Riga. He was in good relations with Lithuania (actually they were allied against the Teutonic knights).
 
kasumigenx

kasumigenx

abas said:
You means Livonian branch of the Teutonic knights? It wasn't a separate order. I don't think that the archbishop would be satisfied with new order, they had similar issues with the sword brothers as well.

More likely the pope would take the former territory of the order under his direct control.

The first candidate would be the archbishop of Riga. He was in good relations with Lithuania (actually they were allied against the Teutonic knights).
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Could Prussia be given to Lithuania once they Christianize?
 

abas

kasumigenx said:
Could Prussia be given to Lithuania once they Christianize?
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Maybe. In 1358 Algirdas and Kęstutis claimed some Prussian territory, roughly Sambia, Nadruvia, Bartia, Galindia in that map
as well as all Baltic territories (left bank of Daugava river and Latgala on the right bank) in Livonia as a condition of their conversion.
 

Uruk

Actually it would mean that the real Prussians has a better chance of remaining Prussian
 
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