WI: Leanor of Austria and her daughter Maria of Viseu as the heirs of Juana I and Felipe

[Sevarics]

Basically as the tin says, what if Leanor’s brothers, Charles and Ferdinand, predecease Leanor without issue? IOTL she was wed to the King of Portugal, having Maria of Viseu as issue, and the King of France. Assuming she still wed the King of Portugal and only had Maria of Viseu as an heir, who would Maria wed potentially? Who ends up inheriting the Habsburg lands? Maria of Viseu was already quite wealthy so I’d imagine that with the Spanish thrones she would be even more so.

 

[Sevarics]

For context, this is Eleanore of Austria: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eleanor_of_Austria

 

[dragonstoned]

I think Maria's existance would depend on the exact dates of Charles and Ferdinand's demises. Now, if they both die in infancy and Eleanor immediately becomes Princess of Asturias and Girona as heiress to Castile and Aragon, she'll likely marry João III of Portugal, who was her stepson in OTL and Maria of Viseu's half-brother.

If Philip has no male heir by the time of his death the guardians of his daughters, possibly Margaret and Maximilian of Austria, could attempt to split the inheritance—Eleanor gets Spain and the Italian possessions and her younger sister Isabella gets Burgundy.

 

[HortenseMancini]

If Philip has no male heir by the time of his death the guardians of his daughters, possibly Margaret and Maximilian of Austria, could attempt to split the inheritance—Eleanor gets Spain and the Italian possessions and her younger sister Isabella gets Burgundy.

interesting...i wonder what would happen with austria in this scenario. obviously max will marry anna jagiellonica here but if she and max don't have any kids...

 

[HortenseMancini]

If the scenario goes like you posit, and charles and ferdinand both die after eleanor's marriage to manuel but before her marriage to françois i, then i think eleanor will have to remarry. unfortunately the best husbands for her at this point are both unsuitable - antoine of lorraine is married while joao iii is legally/canonically her son. young maria, if she remains her mother's only child, could very well marry antoine's son or her nephew/cousin, the son of joao iii and catherine of austria (since i see no reason why those two would not still marry). i would prefer the first scenario because it cuts down on the inbreeding but it might be a hard sell with the spanish cortes.

 

[Sevarics]

I think Maria's existance would depend on the exact dates of Charles and Ferdinand's demises. Now, if they both die in infancy and Eleanor immediately becomes Princess of Asturias and Girona as heiress to Castile and Aragon, she'll likely marry João III of Portugal, who was her stepson in OTL and Maria of Viseu's half-brother.

If Philip has no male heir by the time of his death the guardians of his daughters, possibly Margaret and Maximilian of Austria, could attempt to split the inheritance—Eleanor gets Spain and the Italian possessions and her younger sister Isabella gets Burgundy.

So we end up with an earlier Unified Iberia led by the House of Avis ?

 

[dragonstoned]

So we end up with an earlier Unified Iberia led by the House of Avis ?

Exactly. But only if Eleanor becomes heiress as a child. Though there will surely be plenty of other suitors for her hand, and both Fernando of Aragon and Maximilian of Austria will seek to marry her wherever their diverging interests are best served.

Fernando would back João and the Avis, but Maximilian could oppose.

 

[Sevarics]

Exactly. But only if Eleanor becomes heiress as a child. Though there will surely be plenty of other suitors for her hand, and both Fernando of Aragon and Maximilian of Austria will seek to marry her wherever their diverging interests are best served.

Fernando would back João and the Avis, but Maximilian could oppose.

Would Ferdinand ever consider his Trastamara cousins for his Granddaughter? Not the illegitimate ones in Naples but his father’s younger brothers had sons/grandsons.

 

[pandizzy]

Would Ferdinand ever consider his Trastamara cousins for his Granddaughter? Not the illegitimate ones in Naples but his father’s younger brothers had sons/grandsons.

I think they'd be too low for a girl such as eleanor

 

[Sevarics]

I think they'd be too low for a girl such as eleanor

I guess ! Just thought Ferdinand or even Juana might want to preserve the House of Trastamara

 

[pandizzy]

I guess ! Just thought Ferdinand or even Juana might want to preserve the House of Trastamara

Maximilian and Margaret might try and preserve the house of austria with a new marriage for the emperor

 

[Sevarics]

Maximilian and Margaret might try and preserve the house of austria with a new marriage for the emperor

Who inherits Austria if male line Habsburgs go extinct

 

[HortenseMancini]

Who inherits Austria if male line Habsburgs go extinct

If the house of Habsburg dies out in the male line it’s my understanding that the new holy Roman emperor can assign their lands to whoever (probably one of kunigunde’s sons?)

 

[isabella]

Who inherits Austria if male line Habsburgs go extinct

If the house of Habsburg dies out in the male line it’s my understanding that the new holy Roman emperor can assign their lands to whoever (probably one of kunigunde’s sons?)

As Hortense said Austria will become vacant and free to be assigned by the next Holy Roman Emperor. Pretty likely who ATL Max will try to get one of his Bavarian nephews elected as his successor

 

[Sevarics]

As Hortense said Austria will become vacant and free to be assigned by the next Holy Roman Emperor. Pretty likely who ATL Max will try to get one of his Bavarian nephews elected as his successor

So we might end up with a United Bavaria-Austria ? That’s interesting for potential German unification purposes later on

 

[Jan Olbracht]

If Charles and Ferdinand still exists, but just die young, then Habsburg inheritance would be divided. Mary of Austria was destined to marry Louis II of Bohemia and Hungary and Max declared Louis to be his adopted son and successor if his grandsons die childless. Louis was also heir of Albertine Habsburgs through grandmother, thus he and Mary would combine Albertine and Leopoldine claims to Austria. Louis was also one of Electors as King of Bohemia, so he'd be candidate for Emperor also, although it is open question who'd win (and thus-who'd get Austria, as if someone other than Louis wins he'd ignore Habsburg-Jagiellon treaties and would contest Louis' claim to Austria). Burgundian inheritance and Spain would be inherited by Eleanor meanwhile. Most logical choice would be to marry her to John III of Portugal as it would secure her claim to Castile and would allow Iberia to fully unite.

 

[isabella]

If Charles and Ferdinand still exists, but just die young, then Habsburg inheritance would be divided. Mary of Austria was destined to marry Louis II of Bohemia and Hungary and Max declared Louis to be his adopted son and successor if his grandsons die childless. Louis was also heir of Albertine Habsburgs through grandmother, thus he and Mary would combine Albertine and Leopoldine claims to Austria. Louis was also one of Electors as King of Bohemia, so he'd be candidate for Emperor also, although it is open question who'd win (and thus-who'd get Austria, as if someone other than Louis wins he'd ignore Habsburg-Jagiellon treaties and would contest Louis' claim to Austria). Burgundian inheritance and Spain would be inherited by Eleanor meanwhile. Most logical choice would be to marry her to John III of Portugal as it would secure her claim to Castile and would allow Iberia to fully unite.

Right, than can work. I had not thought to the treaty of mutual succession between Maximilian and Vladislaus. Still I think who Burgundy and Spain would be split with Eleanor inheriting only the Spanish realms and Isabella receiving Burgundy

 

[pandizzy]

If Charles and Ferdinand still exists, but just die young, then Habsburg inheritance would be divided. Mary of Austria was destined to marry Louis II of Bohemia and Hungary and Max declared Louis to be his adopted son and successor if his grandsons die childless. Louis was also heir of Albertine Habsburgs through grandmother, thus he and Mary would combine Albertine and Leopoldine claims to Austria. Louis was also one of Electors as King of Bohemia, so he'd be candidate for Emperor also, although it is open question who'd win (and thus-who'd get Austria, as if someone other than Louis wins he'd ignore Habsburg-Jagiellon treaties and would contest Louis' claim to Austria). Burgundian inheritance and Spain would be inherited by Eleanor meanwhile. Most logical choice would be to marry her to John III of Portugal as it would secure her claim to Castile and would allow Iberia to fully unite.

oh that makes sense

 

[kasumigenx]

Right, than can work. I had not thought to the treaty of mutual succession between Maximilian and Vladislaus. Still I think who Burgundy and Spain would be split with Eleanor inheriting only the Spanish realms and Isabella receiving Burgundy

Isabella could marry Louis to maintain union with Burgundy.

 

[isabella]

Isabella could marry Louis to maintain union with Burgundy.

No way. Louis was engaged to Mary (who was closer in age and already older than him) and Burgundy would be more favorable to end under Spanish control than being under rule of Austria-Bohemia-Hungary. Isabella will most likely marry Antoine of Lorraine here (as alternative Henry VIII of England is more likely than Francis of Angouleme)