What would Bonaparte's military career have looked like had the French Revolution been delayed or avoided?

[alexmilman]

Let's say Louis XVI is a more asserive and proactive monarch who clamps down on the excess privilege of the first two estates, all the while garnering a base of support by appealing to the salons as well as those who wish for a more Prussian style military structure. As a result, serious question over the status of the Bourbons remains unknown until the mid-nineteenth century when it has to face the industrialization efforts of the British and the Prussians. In the meantime, how does one Corsican soldier advance along an army rising in discipline and advanced military strategy?

Given Bonaparte will still have his ambition and his genius I can see him having a similar path as the Duke of Marlborough: fighting numerous campaigns on the European mainland, ecspecially across the German spheres of influence being contested between Austria and Prussia, while on the domestic front he becomes known for switching alliances based on what will gain him influence in the court and the Estates General as well as revolutionizing warfare away from Marlborough's fields of attacks towards styles that took in the increasing power of cannons.

Comparison with Marlborough is questionable. He was an aristocrat and Bonaparte was not, to put it mildly. In the late XVII - early XVIII there were never-ending European wars. With Louis XVI alive and everything else being the same, which wars with French participation are you talking about? Wars between Austria and Prussia were pretty much over and their best effort was pathetic “Potato war” in which France did not take a part.

Promotion in the French army of that time was, IIRC, mostly by a seniority and would be broken only to favor the aristocrats. So, unless you turn Louis XVI into somebody completely different and somehow fix the French finances, France is not going to fight any wars for a number of the decades to follow and the only chance for an ambitious officer with no social connections and money is to look for the employment elsewhere. And there were only two places with the realistic chances for the career: Ottoman Empire and Russian Empire. IIRC, Bonaparte was considering the 1st and he did try the 2nd but could not agree with a recruiting agent regarding the conditions (did not want to have his rank lowered and the agent did not have a crystal ball to see the future). Can’t tell about the OE but in Russia with its frequent wars a chance for the promotion definitely existed.

 

[alexmilman]

Napoleon did not have a powerful sponsor or family. His rise in OTL was due to being in the right place at the right time ( siege of Toulon ) and getting noticed. Without that, he just never gets to command a large force ( artillery officers, like engineers tended to be seen as support and kept in their specialty ). Likely if peace continues he is off to foreign service, but whilst he will rise higher, he is likely not to be given a major command anything like as quickly as OTL.
We also have the problem that a lot of his OTL tactics do not fit with possible employers. The French revolutionary army had a totally different mindset to the other armies of the time. Advocating say, living off the land, for instance, is not going to be a promotion winning position.

Revolutionary specifics aside, he still was a great tactician and very capable artilleryman so if he joins the Russian army, say, prior the 2nd Ottoman War, he can make a very good career fast enough. Especially, if he manages to kiss a couple of proper asses in a timely fashion. For example, during the siege of Ochakov Potemkin would just love to have somebody capable of helping with his lapses and not being as uncontrollable as Suvorov. Advancing to the very top could be difficult but not impossible: look at Barclay who, of course, was born Russian subject but was social nobody and dirt poor.

 

[AllthetTropesMan]

Can you imagine Napoleon entering british military service?

Depending on how high he rises, this could change the reputation of the British army into a proponent of total war several decades early.

 

[Aluma]

Comparison with Marlborough is questionable. He was an aristocrat and Bonaparte was not, to put it mildly. In the late XVII - early XVIII there were never-ending European wars. With Louis XVI alive and everything else being the same, which wars with French participation are you talking about? Wars between Austria and Prussia were pretty much over and their best effort was pathetic “Potato war” in which France did not take a part.

Promotion in the French army of that time was, IIRC, mostly by a seniority and would be broken only to favor the aristocrats. So, unless you turn Louis XVI into somebody completely different and somehow fix the French finances, France is not going to fight any wars for a number of the decades to follow and the only chance for an ambitious officer with no social connections and money is to look for the employment elsewhere.

How about Louis deciding to send Napoleon to the shadow realm by sending him as an officer(or really fodder soldier) to Louisiana?
Not sure if he could make any progress there but it'd be amusing nonethless

 

[isabella]

Comparison with Marlborough is questionable. He was an aristocrat and Bonaparte was not, to put it mildly. In the late XVII - early XVIII there were never-ending European wars. With Louis XVI alive and everything else being the same, which wars with French participation are you talking about? Wars between Austria and Prussia were pretty much over and their best effort was pathetic “Potato war” in which France did not take a part.

Promotion in the French army of that time was, IIRC, mostly by a seniority and would be broken only to favor the aristocrats. So, unless you turn Louis XVI into somebody completely different and somehow fix the French finances, France is not going to fight any wars for a number of the decades to follow and the only chance for an ambitious officer with no social connections and money is to look for the employment elsewhere. And there were only two places with the realistic chances for the career: Ottoman Empire and Russian Empire. IIRC, Bonaparte was considering the 1st and he did try the 2nd but could not agree with a recruiting agent regarding the conditions (did not want to have his rank lowered and the agent did not have a crystal ball to see the future). Can’t tell about the OE but in Russia with its frequent wars a chance for the promotion definitely existed.

Bonaparte was an aristocratic, albeit a minor one, and was recognized as such. If he had not been acknowledged as such he would never be admitted to the officer schools in which spent his youth. And considering his field and talent Napoleon could still make himself well know and find some protector

 

[UCB79]

he could always move to the americas

And meet Alexander Hamilton, who most definitely DID have some dreams of his own of martial glory. A Napoleon- Hamilton team-up then? At first sounds absurd- but think it over & the possibilities become more & more interesting…

 

[alexmilman]

Bonaparte was an aristocratic, albeit a minor one, and was recognized as such.

He was not “aristocratic”. He was “noble”. Aristocrats, in a sense I used the term (sorry, in English the difference is not too clear) were a top level of a nobility admitted at the court, etc. and he was an obscure moneyless provincial noble without a title.

If he had not been acknowledged as such he would never be admitted to the officer schools in which spent his youth.

See above.

And considering his field and talent Napoleon could still make himself well know and find some protector

He could find one but under the Old Regime and in an absence of the wars and in a presence of the promotion system by seniority his chance to raise to the general’s rank within few years would be zero. Probably by the end of his career, in an absence of the numerous wars, he could end up as a general.

 

[alexmilman]

Depending on how high he rises, this could change the reputation of the British army into a proponent of total war several decades early.

An obscure foreign noble (not a titled aristocrat) without money in an army where the officer’s patent is to be bought… What will be chance for him to raise to any prominence to start with?

 

[alexmilman]

How about Louis deciding to send Napoleon to the shadow realm by sending him as an officer(or really fodder soldier) to Louisiana?
Not sure if he could make any progress there but it'd be amusing nonethless

Would there be any serious war there?

OTOH, there is a book in which he is arrives to America with Lafayette and makes himself “noticeable”. Usually, all the good ideas already being used by somebody. 😢

 

[Aluma]

Would there be any serious war there?

Its America, if there isnt a good war they'll make one

OTOH, there is a book in which he is arrives to America with Lafayette and makes himself “noticeable”. Usually, all the good ideas already being used by somebody. 😢

;(

I've thought about a TL where he takes part in the American Revolution before returning to France(that one I joked about in l'Aigle Triomphant years ago) but I found out he was too young so I'd either have to give up on the idea or fabricate a character for his older brother who died as a baby IOTL and the later brought me into a rabbit hole over what I even wanted to do with his character in the first place

 

[alexmilman]

Its America, if there isnt a good war they'll make one

;(

I've thought about a TL where he takes part in the American Revolution before returning to France(that one I joked about in l'Aigle Triomphant years ago) but I found out he was too young so I'd either have to give up on the idea or fabricate a character for his older brother who died as a baby IOTL and the later brought me into a rabbit hole over what I even wanted to do with his character in the first place

The main problem with that line, tempting as it is, is that after returning to the Old Regime France he is still in a shadow of Marquise Lafayette who is also not such a big figure in an absence of the Revolution. Of course, the whole thing could help his career but within the “reasonable limits”, especially if France is at peace. In OTL he started service as a 2nd lieutenant in 1785 and in 1793 (with Revolution, etc.) still was only a captain. Not exactly a meteoritic raise, IMO. And in the Royal army there would not be a shortage of the officers.

 

[Aichi72]

He was not “aristocratic”. He was “noble”. Aristocrats, in a sense I used the term (sorry, in English the difference is not too clear) were a top level of a nobility admitted at the court, etc. and he was an obscure moneyless provincial noble without a title.

Interesting, in English, I believe the opposite is true. Nobility refers to the titled aristocrats who sat in the House of Lords (or used to prior to 1999), basically everyone of Baron rank and above. Aristocract is a broader term that also includes baronets, knights, and the landed gentry.

 

[alexmilman]

Interesting, in English, I believe the opposite is true. Nobility refers to the titled aristocrats who sat in the House of Lords (or used to prior to 1999), basically everyone of Baron rank and above. Aristocract is a broader term that also includes baronets, knights, and the landed gentry.

Yes, and the Brits are also driving on a wrong side but he was not British. 😂

But here is wiki’s cut on Nappy’s classification (OK, wiki is not an ultimate authority on anything): “Napoleon's family was of Italian origin. His paternal ancestors, the Buonapartes, descended from a minor Tuscan noble family that emigrated to Corsica in the 16th century and his maternal ancestors, the Ramolinos, descended from a noble family from Lombardy.” Not the titled people.