What If These Two Warships Met In Combat

Count of Crisco

Count of Crisco

Monk78 said:
Prinz Eugen vs Marat soviet battleship in 1941 ( before it was hit)
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On the one hand Prinz Eugen would likely have radar and a much higher rate of fire than the Soviet battleship. But conversely the Soviets have much bigger guns and armor on their side. Personally I would give the fight to the Prinz Eugen due to her higher speed and radar coupled with torpedoes, but then again I like the underdog in most scenario's.

Because I also like weird stuff
Danton vs Regina Elena semi-dreadnought battleships
 
Gillan1220

Gillan1220

Let's do China vs. Hong Kong 1984 based from Wargame: The Red Dragon.

Royal Navy Type 22 Frigate vs PLA-N Type 051 Destroyer (NATO: Luda II-class destroyer)
 
Gillan1220

Gillan1220

I lurk therefore I am said:
Is the Type 22 a Batch 1/2 or a Batch 3? (There is a big difference between them).
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As of 1984, it's mostly Batch 1. There's only two Batch 2s in deployment in 1984: HMS Boxer (F92) and HMS Beaver (F93), although the latter was later in that year in December. So that only leaves HMS Boxer as the sole Batch 2 of the Batch 1 fleet of Type 22 frigates if we were to assume that the Sino-British War over Hong Kong occurs in mid-1984.

Similar scenario where it almost happened:

In Perpetuity: The War for Hong Kong

4 December, 1984 “The Prime Minister today pulled British negotiators out of talks with China over the future of Hong Kong, labelling as ‘unacceptable’ the attitude of the Chinese government. Beijing has maintained its claimed right to impose China’s socialist system on Hong Kong, which has...
www.alternatehistory.com

Other China vs. UK over HK:

What if China invaded and reclaimed Hong Kong by force in the early 1980s?

Similar to Argentina's invasion of the Falklands, what if an increasingly nationalistic China decided to forcefully capture Hong Kong instead of waiting for the lease to expire at the end of the century? At that time, China was not as economically or militarily powerful as it is today. However...
www.alternatehistory.com

WI Chinese Invasion of Hong Kong during the Korean War

During the Korean War, Chinese forces came into conflict with UN forces during their intervention in the conflict. This included British soldiers who were part of the international force. Despite Chinese intervention the war stayed largely limited to the Korean Peninsula, but what if the PRC...
www.alternatehistory.com
 
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weasel_airlift

Captain Seafort said:
While the SD has the advantage, I wouldn't say it's as clear as you suggest - Tosa's belt's thinner, but it's well sloped while SD's is vertical, so effective thickness will be a lot closer than numbers suggest, and Tosa has a smigin of an advantage at long range with a slightly thicker deck. The extra two guns certainly help, and they're good hole-punchers, but US bursting charges tended to be a bit on the light side and their rate of fire on the slow side. I also think you're underestimating the effect of Tosa's speed advantage - it probably isn't enough to cross the T, but it's certainly enough to allow the Tosa to decide if and how to fight. On the whole, advantage South Dakota, but not by a sufficient margin to consider a Tosa victory to require unusual luck.
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The Tosa's speed should be enough to allow her to dictate range, but I don't think either ship has a range advantage, and trying to cross a T will be impossible without first damaging SDs rudder or propulsion. The 'if' I took as being irrelevant. There is no way a Japanese battleship captain backs down from a challenge where he isn't clearly outmatched.

That said, I can agree with you that it's a decently close match, but I still favor SD.
 

Machiavelli Jr

Count of Crisco said:
On the one hand Prinz Eugen would likely have radar and a much higher rate of fire than the Soviet battleship. But conversely the Soviets have much bigger guns and armor on their side. Personally I would give the fight to the Prinz Eugen due to her higher speed and radar coupled with torpedoes, but then again I like the underdog in most scenario's.

Because I also like weird stuff
Danton vs Regina Elena semi-dreadnought battleships
Click to expand...
Race between PE managing to mission-kill Marat before taking one 12" hit and having to leg it at high speed. I think my money would be on a tactical victory for PE - heavy damage to Marat but he can still steam and fight.

Danton has a lot more firepower than a Regina Elena, 4x12" and 12x 9.4" plays 2x12" and 12x8", but conversely is 3kt slower. Armour is much of a muchness and as built both ships had mid-1900s British fire control. So close enough it probably comes down to the quality of the gunnery, but all things being equal if the Italian has to fight I'd give it to the French.
 

Somedevil

Crowbar Six said:
A more realistic one would be USS Texas and Bismark. Apparently Texas was on a neutrality patrol in the Denmark strait about 12 hours before Hood and Prince of Wales had their fateful encounter. I could see a spooked Bismark opening fire on a "RN Battleship", how long would Texas last?
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Don't mess with Texas. her 14 inch guns would do some damage. But I said Washington or NC since they probably the closest to the Bismarck size wise etc and age. The Iowa's are over kill and so are the South Dakota's honestly.
 

naraic

Peg Leg Pom said:
How about a British Lord Nelson against a Japanese Satsuma. They are very similar ships, so who's better trained.


en.wikipedia.org

Lord Nelson-class battleship - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

en.wikipedia.org

Satsuma-class battleship - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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Probably whoever had the most recent fire control refit.

I'll give it to the Satsumas based on a British comment that they believed that 6 guns was the minimum for good rangefinding (when designing Renown and Repulse). As such the 6 10 inch gun broadside of the Satsumas is ahead of the 5 9.2 inch gun broadside of the Lord Nelsons.

The Ranger said:
The Potemkin vs the orginal Dreadnought (the battleship which other dreadnoughts got their title from.)
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I'd give it to Dreadnought in a 2v1 against 2 Potemkins.
 

I lurk therefore I am

Gillan1220 said:
As of 1984, it's mostly Batch 1. There's only two Batch 2s in deployment in 1984: HMS Boxer (F92) and HMS Beaver (F93), although the latter was later in that year in December. So that only leaves HMS Boxer as the sole Batch 2 of the Batch 1 fleet of Type 22 frigates if we were to assume that the Sino-British War over Hong Kong occurs in mid-1984.

Similar scenario where it almost happened:

In Perpetuity: The War for Hong Kong

4 December, 1984 “The Prime Minister today pulled British negotiators out of talks with China over the future of Hong Kong, labelling as ‘unacceptable’ the attitude of the Chinese government. Beijing has maintained its claimed right to impose China’s socialist system on Hong Kong, which has...
www.alternatehistory.com

Other China vs. UK over HK:

What if China invaded and reclaimed Hong Kong by force in the early 1980s?

Similar to Argentina's invasion of the Falklands, what if an increasingly nationalistic China decided to forcefully capture Hong Kong instead of waiting for the lease to expire at the end of the century? At that time, China was not as economically or militarily powerful as it is today. However...
www.alternatehistory.com

WI Chinese Invasion of Hong Kong during the Korean War

During the Korean War, Chinese forces came into conflict with UN forces during their intervention in the conflict. This included British soldiers who were part of the international force. Despite Chinese intervention the war stayed largely limited to the Korean Peninsula, but what if the PRC...
www.alternatehistory.com
Click to expand...

The Type 22 would likely win.

The ESM fit on the 22 is much more modern, and was designed for operating deep in the Atlantic, so it is very sensitive and will pick up radar transmissions from the 051 before the 051's radar spots the 22, and having one or two radar equipped Lynx helicopters on the back means that the 22 will most likely detect the Type 051 first (and be able to get some Sea Skua shots in first, where I would not fancy the 051's chances of stopping all of them).

The Type 051 is the original version from the 50s, not the later ones, so I would not fancy the radar picking up sea skimming Exocets, and the air defence carried at that time would not have much chance either.

The Seawolf carried by the Type 22 would be far more effective against Silkworm clones if the 051 managed to get some shots in.
 

Coulsdon Eagle

Monthly Donor
Count of Crisco said:
Because I also like weird stuff
Danton vs Regina Elena semi-dreadnought battleships
Click to expand...

Machiavelli Jr said:
Danton has a lot more firepower than a Regina Elena, 4x12" and 12x 9.4" plays 2x12" and 12x8", but conversely is 3kt slower. Armour is much of a muchness and as built both ships had mid-1900s British fire control. So close enough it probably comes down to the quality of the gunnery, but all things being equal if the Italian has to fight I'd give it to the French.
Click to expand...
I agree - the French shade it.
 
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