What Happens to Napoleon I if he's still alive when Napoleon III takes over?
- Thread starter Parmenion
- Start date
If he could have survived the voyage, Probally nothing more than make a few public appearances, wave at the crowd, and then die on some chattel in Southern France.
I wonder if III would let I keep his title, and just call himself regent until he dies.
Depending on then mental health of Napoleon (I), would he even tolerate having a regent? Dunno why but I doubt it, even if Napoleon was in his 80s.
Napolion gets to die a dignified death. Unless he decides to pull a trotsky and take up writing during his extended 3 decades or so of life to keep his mind active and gets a chance to publish them on his return that's probably all that is diffrent. With how long lived napolion is in this alt thier would be more room to make changes if Napoleon III takes power earlier, I heard he attempted a coup in 1836 which was the reasion for his exial so him pulling off the coup successfully might be a decent pod which gives about 15 years of wiggle room over his otl rise to power.
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I imagine that he would have to renounce his throne as a condition of his release. If there is any indication to the contrary, the British will not let him leave. They don't want to fight him again. After years in exile, he probably is willing to accept that, especially given that his family has retaken the throne. (He was willing to abdicate in favor of his son IOTL.)
to be honest, if Napoléon I is still alive in 1830, it's likely that they're agitating (as Joseph was OTL for l'Aiglon) for his return. It's easier for Louis Philippe to portray himself as the "defender" of the natural order, which means that Bonapartism might not get the boost of OTL's "retour des cendres" (which LP only did to boost his flagging popularity)
God 60 something napoleon would be fun, he'd probably have enough fight left in him to just go "I'll fuckin do it again" and try for a third time.
there is also the crazy idea that Napoléon had (on hearing of the duc de Bordeaux's birth) of returning to France, seizing power and becoming regent for the boy... maybe he decides to do this in 1830?
Looking for ways for him to live longer outside of obvious things like him living healthier throughout his life, if napolion stays as "emperor of Elba" and does not rock the boat by attempting to return like otl which ended in waterloo he will also likley live longer do to better living conditions and medical attention
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Principality of Elba - Wikipedia
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It is also a matter of sheer genetic luck.
- Carlo Buonaparte - died age 38 in 1785. Stomach cancer.
- Letizia Ramolino - died age 85 in 1836. Nearly blind by then.
- Giuseppe Buonaparte - died age 76 in 1844. (did not find comments on reasons).
- Napoleone Buonaparte - died age 51 in 1821. Stomach cancer like his father.
- Luciano Buonaparte - died age 65 in 1840. Stomach cancer.
- Maria Anna Buonaparte - died age 43 in 1820. "Fatal illness", did not find specifics.
- Luigi Buonaparte - died age 67 in 1846. (did not find specifics).
- Maria Paola Buonaparte - died age 44 in 1825. Stomach cancer.
- Carolina Buonaparte - died age 57 in 1839. (did not find specifics).
- Girolamo Buonaparte - died age 75 in 1860. (did not find specifics).
Sure, it's possible it developed later in life due to diffrent factors. Modern day we know poor lifestyle, diet, living conditions and stress can cause or excelerate cancer him living better throughout his life as a whole would help a lot with this but in particular the last decade of his life appers to be particularly danadging and reads like a checklist of steps to speed run declining health and cancer which likley either caused cancer he did not have before but was geneticly predisposed to develop easyer becuse of his genetics or excelerated his cancer.
Even if we assume him having cancer was unpreventable, if these underlining issues are addresed we know modern day cancers development can still be slowed considerably, either killing him later or prehapse not at all due to it developing slow enough that he would die of natural causes before the cancer has a chance to do it opening the door to the possibility that he could have lived a full life in any number of ways.
Think of this as the napolionic equivalent of hitler, lenin or teddy rosevelts natural life being cut short even outside living better through thier life where they also just like napolion have critical periods or events that contributed to degrading thoer health and likly shorting thier lives and ending in premature death (the most obvious being hitlers drug abuse and both Lenin and teddy rosevelt being shot) thier are plenty of threads on this board that point out these critical periods or events being avoided can in most cases add years if not decades back on to the clock with just these changes even before we start considering general life improvements.
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Somehow, I can picture Emperor Napoleon the first as Abe Simpson like figure. After his eventual return, because of his age and health, he would have been laughing stock of public. Not sure that Napoleon III would want to risk it.
Because laughing at old people is accetable. Especially if you are returning to politics after almost 40 years. Napoleon used to be idolised, so once people will se what he had become...
A laughing stock? If anything he'd be seen as a living legend with his military knowledge, political skills, and intellect being invaluable. You could make the case that he was a polymath. And despite his age and state of France back during the Hundred Days Campaign, the Six Days Campaign was one of Napoleon's most brilliant and innovative military feats which showed the shrewdness and military sense he had as a younger man was still present.
If anything he'd probably be seen in a similar vein as Suvorov who was leading men into battle as an old man.
If anything seeing the mediocrity of the Bourbons and the "Fat pear" Louis-Phlippe (he was mocked in a famous political cartoon), people would probably clamor for the glory days of the French Empire. When Napoleon died in otl, there were still large gatherings in his memory such that Napoleon III and his mother had to flee France when the Orleanist government chased them out after feeling threatened by this rising wave of Bonapartism.
Honestly I feel that the more tragic scenario would be Napoleon outliving his son. He deeply cared for his son, and to be unable to meet him for years would probably send him into a depression. Napoleon I living would probably change the dynamics of Napoleon II as Marie Louise can't necessarily get remarried as her husband was still alive.
With his father still alive Napoleon II might try more actively to pursue his father's legacy.
I doubt it would affect L'Aiglon's upbringing that much. Marie Louise didn't give a shit about him while his dad was alive anyway. Even Napoléon I knew this, and he remarked that "she cares for him no more than- bah!" and he changed the topic.
doubtful. Him going so hardcore into his dad was more like "teenage rebellion" and liking the band your parents hate/dating the girl they don't like/whatever. It bloomed again after 1830, meeting Marmont and de las Casas- the latter of whom he met for nearly fifteen interviews (chaperoned by his tutor, Dietrichstein, of course), and the feeling that his grandpa wasn't doing enough to get him a "position". This was also around the time that his uncles and cousins started getting letters to him. If his dad's alive, his leash is going to be even shorter. Likely he'll end as a Kaspar Hauser/Edward V type figure...gradually seen less and less until nobody - aside from the Bonaaprtists, remember he's there. And, since they're not really in power anywhere - and showed no interest in him until 1830 (why would they? Joseph's only interest in him OTL was because he'd be regent - then emperor if the boy died - Louis wasn't interested in much of anything, Lucien was permanently on the outs with his brother, Jerome only wanted money. Elisa's dead, Pauline's dead and Caroline sees him as an obstacle to Achille being emperor- she even tried to arrange Achille's marriage to Joseph's daughter to make it more "possible"). And until Napoléon I gets back to Europe,he's likewise in no position to do anything, by which point the "damage" might be done already and Napoléon will have to recognize his own words "I would rather see my son dead than a dyed in the wool Habsburg/in the hands of the Austrians"
Napolion at this point had become culturally cemented into the French national identity in a similer fashion to how George Washington is cemented in the amarican national identity and as a result the scale his achivments will likly outweigh his failures for most of the french. Even if he is as bad off as you describe, his achievements and what he represents to the french identity now make him larger then life, even in failure the landscape of Europe was permanently changed with the destruction of the ancient regimes.
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I don’t think he would do much as others said. He’d be old and tired and if his son is still dead then he’d likely be a sad depressed man as well. He’d probably make some appearances and do some speeches, as he’d be a legend by that point. But nothing crazy other than stir up lots of nostalgia and support for his nephew.
I do wonder two things: 1) how does Europe respond to this? Weather this is a TL where he never left Elba before or not does Europe feel any apprehension or try and do anything or is the threat of Napoleon too far gone and they just see an old man? 2) When N3 becomes emperor will anyone wonder if it was N1 pushing him to do so or will it just be seen as N3 being ambitious and his uncle sitting around being happy for him?
I do wonder two things: 1) how does Europe respond to this? Weather this is a TL where he never left Elba before or not does Europe feel any apprehension or try and do anything or is the threat of Napoleon too far gone and they just see an old man? 2) When N3 becomes emperor will anyone wonder if it was N1 pushing him to do so or will it just be seen as N3 being ambitious and his uncle sitting around being happy for him?
rooted, yes. Idolized, no. Even French liberals compared them unfavourably to one another.
My favourite from a contemporary: