Expensive with a ton of naval features the germans don't need or want.
West Germany Buys the F-16
- Thread starter Simon
- Start date
Couldn't they get a cheaper variant without the naval features? A West German tender could be a big enough deal for General Dynamics-Grumman and it is essentially a downgrade anyway as I understand, so no extensive R&D required.
It'd end up costing more. Its what you get when you ask to change features, you gotta pay for R&D even if its a simplification because guess what, it all requires tons of time and testing with more expensive non mainline production components that cost more even if they are simpler because of the low volume means less ovehead for the contractors producing them.
Its why there is no non carrier hornet variant for example, even if there are several nations who don't operate them on carriers.
When a customer asks you to change stuff its usually because they want a more capable platform because the baseline configuration does not fulfill requirements and they are willing to pay extra for it.
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It depends on the large numbers Germany and Italy would buy in a Cold War era buy, they would presumably be building them locally if using a lot of US parts, so significant modification might not cost a huge amount?
Date wise, what about an early strike eagle? It's far closer date wise and a ground aircraft already, even if it might be a more limited strike capability with say single seat and more focused on nuclear strike and not that far from the A/B?
It didn't with the F-16.
Also the F-14 would be a complete rebuild as it lacked a lot of features needed to fulfill specifications. First and foremostly a proper ground mapping radar and fitting for a lot of specialized munitions it was poorly suited to carry.
Strike eagle is the way to go.
Riain
Banned
I didn't say it was any good, only it was large as in not small like a Mirage III or F104 or big like an F111 and complex like a Tornado not simple like an F16.However, what's worse than lift-jets on a swing wing aircraft? Hidden lift-jets that swing out for take-off and landing, bloody hell!
I think that the Germans could have ended up using the F-16, but not as a Tornado replacement.
Slightly increase Northrup's pace of development/US political will for developing the F-5A/B Freedom Fighter, while at the same time reveal the Lockheed F-104 bribery before the sale is finalized; resulting in the West Germans refusing the F-104 and ending up buying the F-5.
With the F-5 being better than the F-104, the West Germans will be able to wait somewhat longer to replace them in the fighter role (especially if they retrofit some of their F-5As to be closer to the F-5E), speed F-16 development somewhat and they might end up choosing the Fighting Falcon instead of the Phantom II as a fighter, while still developing the Tornado for strike capabilities.
Slightly increase Northrup's pace of development/US political will for developing the F-5A/B Freedom Fighter, while at the same time reveal the Lockheed F-104 bribery before the sale is finalized; resulting in the West Germans refusing the F-104 and ending up buying the F-5.
With the F-5 being better than the F-104, the West Germans will be able to wait somewhat longer to replace them in the fighter role (especially if they retrofit some of their F-5As to be closer to the F-5E), speed F-16 development somewhat and they might end up choosing the Fighting Falcon instead of the Phantom II as a fighter, while still developing the Tornado for strike capabilities.
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Ramontxo
Donor
German rearming was a highly controversial issue both in side and outside.
For the inside question (that even today is still present)
For the inside question (that even today is still present)
Could Luftwaffe opt for just 50 or so RF-4 /F
and go for a more modern aircraft by mid 70s like Saab viggen or F-16 ADF like variant
And USAF /RAF can handle the more dangerous air to ground missions?
Riain
Banned
The US blocked exports of the Viggen, which was an attack aircraft in its initial version rather than a fighter.
What is a F16 ADF? When was it available?
Small fleets are a hassle, if you're going to set up a support system its best to get the most out of it with the biggest fleet practical.
I think NATO countries have all sorts of agreements and obligations regarding roles and responsibilities. I doubt Germany could just leave its strike obligations to others without major renegotiation, payments, transfers etc etc.
F-16 ADF was a variant of the F-16 with the software and pylon hardware to use AIM-7 Sparrow, but it was only done in the late 80s because the AMRAAM was severely delayed (original IOC meant to be 1986). Could have been done sooner but nobody asked for Sparrow-armed F-16s.
F-16C 32/42 was right around the corner anyway (also sparrow compatible)
Note that only the inner wing hardpoints of the F-16 is sparrow capable however.
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Basically, Sparrow loadout for the F-16 was limited to inner wing hardpoint in any case due to dimensional requirements (AMRAAM is a fair bit smaller than the sparrow and can fit on any of the outer 3 hardpoints including the wingtip). Sparrow was also obviously about to be obsolete anyway.