Unbuilt Canada

Ming777

Monthly Donor
@Bureaucromancer I've got alot of feedback, suggestions, and questions.

Initial questions:
How big is the Lougheed Station? Looks like 2-3 lines use it, assuming Millenium and the Lougheed/Evergreen Line share some tracks
I think putting the gondola at Lougheed might be a tad overkill and more of a construction challenge than from OTL Production Way University.

I kinda prefer the Evergreen/Hastings/Millennium line to take the UBC Route. Gives a smoother route from UBC to/from Burnaby and the Trip Cities

More TBC...
 
@Bureaucromancer I've got alot of feedback, suggestions, and questions.

Initial questions:
How big is the Lougheed Station? Looks like 2-3 lines use it, assuming Millenium and the Lougheed/Evergreen Line share some tracks
I think putting the gondola at Lougheed might be a tad overkill and more of a construction challenge than from OTL Production Way University.

I kinda prefer the Evergreen/Hastings/Millennium line to take the UBC Route. Gives a smoother route from UBC to/from Burnaby and the Trip Cities

More TBC...
When I pencil it out on service pattern there's really only two lines at Lougheeed, and I'm inclined to think not track sharing given the angles and configuration. OTOH Brentwood does seem kind of unreasonable, especially after a North Shore line:
1701476654977.png

Using anything BUT Lougheed for the gondola terminal is a pretty big compromise in connectivity terms without OTLs Expo extension back west to Production Way, but yeah, there are some good reasons it hasn't been chosen in the real world. It was at least considered though, so I can't think it's realistic from a technical standpoint

As far as the service pattern goes, I'm actually thinking that the areas with shared trackage would mostly balance out pretty cleanly (even if it includes North Shore) if Broadway services are operated with a reverse branching Evergreen line such that you could get those trains running out to both main western routes:
1701476919791.png

My main thought in terms of wanting to make Expo be the UBC line is that it feels like there's more potential through traffic from the central part of Expo out to UBC than from Hastings in isolation or deep Burnaby and Surrey. OTOH it does match surface routing. I think the AH cop out on this is to throw an amusing anecdote about Translink changing it's mind which way to handle this every few years.
A note about the Arbutus route while I'm at it:
1701477454254.png

I ended up redrawing with the OTL route, creating a ~1.5 km double back for airport trains. My original through was to run everything across Sea Island, but ended up thinking that the actual location of Bridgeport Station having all trains, regardless of branch, serve a bus terminal that avoids a river crossing is valuable enough to justify the slightly convoluted route.
 
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Ming777

Monthly Donor
For Lougheed, with development earlier than OTL, I'm guessing it's over where the old Sears Warehouse and that triangle south of Lougheed Mall is. So it may be slightly shifted east from the OTL Lougheed Town Centre or it is a much larger hub.

Brentwood could go either way, though Purple/Hastings line I assume will include stops at BCIT, maybe one more station, before terminating roughly at Metrotown.

For the Green line, East of Lougheed in Coquitlam, I can see the potential for Stations at Alderson, Brunette, and at Schoolhouse (where the ex Treo Building is). You might have one more station to service the industrial area around United Boulevard before the Bridge.

PS: I guess the main question is if the Yellow Line (Millennium?) Is part of the Expo or Green Line.

I figured the Green Line being the Analog to the OTL Millennium Line makes more sense to extend to UBC via Broadway. Commerical Broadway is pretty effective for transferring lines, especially since the OTL 99 B line (For many years THE Busiest Bus in North America) is what happens when a Bus line tries to cope with a MRTs level of passengers.
 
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PS: I guess the main question is if the Yellow Line (Millennium?) Is part of the Expo or Green Line.
Short answer is s (ever?)green line. I was thinking about just running it independently, but rethought that on the basis that branching evergreen trains between Cambie and Broadway would address that the line capacity in the east would otherwise be limited by the shared downtown tunnel with Expo.
I figured the Green Line being the Analog to the OTL Millennium Line makes more sense to extend to UBC via Broadway. Commerical Broadway is pretty effective for transferring lines, especially since the OTL 99 B line (For many years THE Busiest Bus in North America) is what happens when a Bus line tries to cope with a MRTs level of passengers.
As I sketched my timeline the actual Millenium analog in timing and political terms would have been a short(ish) PNE/Boundary Road - Brentwood extension to an earlier Hastings line and the construction of the UBC line as a branch from the Canada Line, operating as the western leg of a Hastings line that had opened around '95 but terminated at Waterfront. The Brentwood - Arbutus Broadway line is exactly that, a parallel to our Broadway extension pushed up to a 2019 opening, somewhat tied to the Port Mann Bridge Evergreen analog project(s).

Looking at the map I did is probably quicker than explaining the intricacies of the sequencing tbh.
 
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They might be able to get the Arbutus corridor done in 1988, but I'd wager it'd still be a fight. It's a quiet neighbourhood with plenty of money, so there's a good chance they have to go underground from 57th north. Though they'd be able to do "cut and cover" in TTL, I have a hard time seeing an elevated train getting through at that point.
 
So, we have here people using the ICTS technology for Hamilton, Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Detroit, where else in Canada could this have been used? Calgary and Edmonton have extensive LRT systems (and were pioneers in the technology in North America, plus both were building their systems before the ICTS was finished development) so they're out, but are there any other options?

Quebec City, perhaps? If they can make the ICTS go up the Escarpment the difference between old Quebec City and the new one would be doable as well.

The Buffalo idea is neat and very logical, though I'm not sure Buffalo has the transit ridership to justify it without expanding their bus network considerably. But if that can work it's a good idea. The LAX People Mover is also a similarly good idea.

Looking at the US, there are a few places where the dates and ridership line up to where an earlier (and thus less expensive) ICTS system might be possible. Sacramento, San Jose, Denver and Salt Lake City are possible converts from Light Rail-based systems and Miami is an easy one for its Metrorail system, particularly considering the cost of the Metrorail system and its mismanagement of it.
 

Ming777

Monthly Donor
I was thinking Seattle. I know it might be complicated for Downtown, but I feel like ICTS might have been a viable alternative instead of Link LRT.

If Halifax had a larger population, maybe it might have worked, although considering it doesn't even have LRT right now is a problem.

I know Honolulu was considering Innova (Skytrain technology), and the Bangkok Skytrain was named as such because ICTS was considered there as well.

Milan was another one. They had actually prepared trains for the Milan Metro, but after that was canned, the trainsets were sent to Vancouver. These are the Mark I trains that don't have a door at the ends of the trainset.
1280px-Mk_I_SkyTrain_at_22nd_Street_Station.jpg
 
So, we have here people using the ICTS technology for Hamilton, Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Detroit, where else in Canada could this have been used? Calgary and Edmonton have extensive LRT systems (and were pioneers in the technology in North America, plus both were building their systems before the ICTS was finished development) so they're out, but are there any other options?
Winnipeg is the big and obvious one. The southwest Transitway would have looked a lot like other ICTS proposals, and much of what would otherwise make sense there would work very well elevated.

Edmonton is really obvious (bear in mind that it was one of the few genuinely serious post-war proposals for a heavy rail system that didn't build anything), except for the big and dual problems of the project being almost a full decade too early for ICTS to be on the radar and closely tied to the 1978 Commonwealth Games.

Calgary WOULD make a lot of sense, but the whole ethos there seems to have been reproducing Edmonton on the cheap... and in AH terms I kind of hate to attack what really ought to be seen as the single best example of what modern LRT can be. IMO the only failure of Calgary that is really significant enough to be heavily noted in terms of other cities taking lessons is that the downtown tunnel should be DISCUSSED more than it is... even if it may still be genuinely reasonable to put it off another decade.

In short, I'll say that while I really do love light metro and think it's the closest thing we have to a single 'best' form of urban rapdid transit, good high floor light rail on mostly railway like right of ways (of the type Reece Martin would call a 'City Train') is a very a close second (and Australian style mainline compatible rail operating quasi metro services probably ranks next, albeit a good way down, but a bit above an actual metro line unless you're a genuine metropolis).
Quebec City, perhaps? If they can make the ICTS go up the Escarpment the difference between old Quebec City and the new one would be doable as well.
Yes, QC is very much a good candidate. Frankly I suspect that bringing CDPQ into their (current, OTL) tram planning will end with them dropping the east/west plan and turning the new tunnel into a REM line.
The Buffalo idea is neat and very logical, though I'm not sure Buffalo has the transit ridership to justify it without expanding their bus network considerably. But if that can work it's a good idea. The LAX People Mover is also a similarly good idea.
Buffalo actually has incredibly good ridership on a per mile basis, though how much that can be credited to it having a line that is really a a full metro in all but name is a fair question.

LAX aside, remember that LA had THE, singular, downtown peoplemover that was closest to construction without actually happening, and had committed to ICTS by cancellation. Good maps of the proposal are few and far between so I did one in Google:
1701582492660.png

I'd take particular note that this would have been a very nice terminal if the Blue Line changed modes, have genuinely functioned as well as a downtown distributor could be asked to, and would have been incredibly well positioned for a tunneled extension to Dodger Stadium.

I have to wonder whether a successful LA peoplemover might have been enough to get Jacksonville to go ICTS when they abandon VAL. For all the Skyway's faults ICTS would clearly have them on a better footing than they are now...
AFAIK Milan is the only other real project that was anything but an incredibly high level look by UTDC which would have used Mk Is, and is IMO interesting for that alone, even if we are mostly interested in NA.
Looking at the US, there are a few places where the dates and ridership line up to where an earlier (and thus less expensive) ICTS system might be possible. Sacramento, San Jose, Denver and Salt Lake City are possible converts from Light Rail-based systems and Miami is an easy one for its Metrorail system, particularly considering the cost of the Metrorail system and its mismanagement of it.
The Texan systems also come to mind, but truthfully I'd suggest that the North American light rail systems that wouldn't be better served by some form of light metro, ICTS or otherwise, are few and far between. And probably best represented by the likes of the genuinely successful streetcars (which means, imo, the surviving legacy systems, Portland, Oklahoma City and little else)... Even considering Denver though, the single most infuriatingly close system is Seattle, between geographical proximity to Vancouver and OTL's line being so close to full grade separation.
Baltimore IS also probably worthy of special consideration... as much as I love the concept of an AH that builds the subway out to BWI and eventually through routes the Baltimroe and Washington Metros, it's kind of silly (if exactly the kind of thing that might happen if the right set of politicians get excited by the aesthetics). Light Metro on the other hand is better suited to the demand levels on the existing subway, the distances involved in the existing light rail, while the red line is up there with Seattle and Ottawa in terms of lines that are annoyingly close to metro standards being turned into LRT. While I'm thinking of Maryland, as much as the Purple line is mostly street level it's clearly a line better suited to autpmation than trams, and in an environment that elevated guideways wouldn't be especially problematic for.

Looking for other potential projects in Canadian terms:
The south shore REM line was kicking around for a long time prior to CDPQ, and there were plenty of renders over the years with Mk IIs.

It's a bit of a stretch, but I really do like on a conceptual level what ION could have looked like if built with ICTS. Also maybe not completly unreasonable in a timeline premised on ICTS becoming something of a Canadian default.

Niagara Falls is probably one of those few things that really does work better as a streetcar, but ICTS is actually probably closer to what was in mind when the Parks Commission was looking at fixed guideway a decade or two ago. My take, albeit drawn for streetcars was:
1701582594329.png


Paging through cities (that didn't instantly come to mind otherwise) by population:
A north/south Oshawa corridor linking the GO/VIA station, mall and UOIT has a lot to be said for it, doubly so if ALRT is in place.

I've semi seriously toyed with what London's rapid transit plans would look like in light metro form, and ended up with something I quite like:
London.jpg

I grant that the elevated path through the core might be a bit of a stretch, but this is still pretty good if you assume it has to be tunneled all the way south to the train station.

There's never been any real talk of anything heavier than an LRT on the tram side of the spectrum for Victoria, but there's also nothing about the East/West corridor that makes ICTS especially difficult for it... and if one looks to the Saanich peninsula speed really is key to making transit attractive (although my quasi professional opinion is that the Saanich is unbelievably well suited to an Ottawa style BRT).
I've mused here in the past that the Saanich might be a place either... well suited, or particularly vulnerable to... gadbetbahn salesmen pitching the stability of monorails in terms of suitability for a pontoon crossing at the north end. A nonsensical concept OTL, but the possibilities in Victoria do start to get interesting in any TL that boosts the population significanlty (which imo isn't hugely difficult given the engineering realities of a fixed link to the Island somehwere north of Cambpell River).

To put a weirder idea of mine out there, as much as ICTS proper was meant as an urban system and it IS a ~150 km long, the Penticton - Kelowna - Vernon - Armstrong corridor has a lot to be said for it, and just enough obstacles to make mainline rail genuinely hard to do. It's probably best suited to a pretty traditional interurban, but not entirely something I'd discount (especially if ALRT is a thing) if Canada got really aggressive building out fixed guideway systems.
1701583305152.png


And of course there's always the really obvious suitability of Hurontario for light metro over LRT.

PS:
Even setting aside TV06 and it's potential to show up for day 0, Vancouver's early interest in a larger train had Mk II concepts kicking around from very early.
https://buzzer.translink.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Pamphlet-Diagram-640x497.jpg

In a timeline where Vancouver grew it's system aggressively from a very early stage it would definitely be aesthetically pleasing to have the Mk II show up early and in a form more clearly related to the Mk I.
 
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So, we have here people using the ICTS technology for Hamilton, Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Detroit, where else in Canada could this have been used? Calgary and Edmonton have extensive LRT systems (and were pioneers in the technology in North America, plus both were building their systems before the ICTS was finished development) so they're out, but are there any other options?

Quebec City, perhaps? If they can make the ICTS go up the Escarpment the difference between old Quebec City and the new one would be doable as well.

The Buffalo idea is neat and very logical, though I'm not sure Buffalo has the transit ridership to justify it without expanding their bus network considerably. But if that can work it's a good idea. The LAX People Mover is also a similarly good idea.

Looking at the US, there are a few places where the dates and ridership line up to where an earlier (and thus less expensive) ICTS system might be possible. Sacramento, San Jose, Denver and Salt Lake City are possible converts from Light Rail-based systems and Miami is an easy one for its Metrorail system, particularly considering the cost of the Metrorail system and its mismanagement of it.
Could the technology perhaps being spread elsewhere outside of North America (thanks perhaps due to a lower cost of the system)...I don't know much about elsewhere, but in Malaysia as mentioned before, there is the Kelana Jaya line(KJL) , which was build alongside the Ampang (AGL) line....both of those line using different types due to multiple factors (such as the fact that Mahathir flavour of neoliberalism meant both of those line are actually built and operated by different privately owned company (which eventually failed) instead of a one single goverment-linked company. The AGL have sections that basically reusing old railway lines. Meanwhile the KJL has tunnelled sections, hence the need for ICTS for this in particular.) I don't know if there could be any change here since the AGL eventually uses 6-car trains in 2014, while the longest Innovia metro train is 4 IIRC currently...

Perhaps ITTL, a Malaysia less affected by the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis...the Putrajaya Monorail (which was originally gonna be light rail before they decided to built a monorail instead, after they had built the bloody tunnels for it *facepalm*.) could be finished and using ICTS instead of monorail....
1701575627311.png

The aforementioned tunnels in Putrajaya , during a site visit to study whether it was still feasible for the long dormant project to continue...the goverment decided not to proceed with resumption of the construction.
 
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I was thinking Seattle. I know it might be complicated for Downtown, but I feel like ICTS might have been a viable alternative instead of Link LRT.
I agree with you on this one, though you'd have to then figure out how to get the trolleybus serves in Seattle to the stations on their own, as you can't really do that an ICTS system, though I agree that the ICTS system would be ideal for Seattle in other aspects - it would be ideal for the system's current spine from Seatac to Northgate through downtown - but I think you'd have to build the light rail system in any case. I see Seattle and Hamilton's transit situations being quite similar, particularly through the center of the city, and the terrain has many similarities as well. Sound Transit's plans are quite good, though I think they'll end up eventually being like Los Angeles (and probably the OTL Eglinton line in Toronto at some point) and seeing their plans overtaken by demand, forcing them to up their game.
If Halifax had a larger population, maybe it might have worked, although considering it doesn't even have LRT right now is a problem.
Halifax IMO should be thinking about light rail right now, particularly if they can get it across the Harbor in some form.
I know Honolulu was considering Innova (Skytrain technology), and the Bangkok Skytrain was named as such because ICTS was considered there as well.
Honolulu is a gimme if you ask me, but the question of timing would be a question there, namely because in the 1980s I'm not sure Honolulu had the population of the cityspace to make the project worthwhile. It does now, of course, so this could be a later project for the ICTS technology.
Winnipeg is the big and obvious one. The southwest Transitway would have looked a lot like other ICTS proposals, and much of what would otherwise make sense there would work very well elevated.
I agree here as well, but I also look at Winnipeg and see ALRT being the absolute ace in the hole for them, as Central Winnipeg is criss-crossed by rail lines that could be used as right of way for such a project. The Southwest Transitway is a good system, but the main issue I see there is a lack of ambition, particularly since there is probably a wider gap between the wealth and conditions in Winnipeg than in any other Canadian city - the transitway should make sure to go north into the much-poorer northern portions of Winnipeg. The current expansion plans go for that, but IMO if Winnipeg is to cut that gap down, they should be looking to build north as soon as possible.
 
Honolulu is a gimme if you ask me, but the question of timing would be a question there, namely because in the 1980s I'm not sure Honolulu had the population of the cityspace to make the project worthwhile.
They’ve been trying since like the 1960s. In 1976 the plan was for a 22 mile elevated rail from Pearl City to Hawaii Kai, with the initial section being 14 miles from Aloha Stadium to Kahala Mall.
IMG_2308.png

But then the Feds withdrew their 80% financing and Frank Fasi wasn’t mayor and HART lost a beat.
 
Swining back to the ALRT for a second, I imagine it would be possible to make it into something similar to the S-Bahn in Germany, built on the same track gauge as the freight railroads and thus capable of operating on the same tracks. I look at what @Bureaucromancer wrote above about the Penticton - Kelowna - Vernon - Armstrong in British Columbia and I think to myself "That's got ALRT written all over it". As he says there isn't always the proper right of way for it to be a heavy rail solution, but my thought on that front is to build an ALRT-style vehicle that can also run on streets and in LRT pathways where it makes sense to do so.

I'm thinking that this system acts partly as local transit using LRT-style pathways in built-up areas in Kelowna and Vernon but on its own pathways in more rural areas. I'm thinking that the trains for this are two sets of the three-car ALRT trains coupled back-to-back controlled from one operator, running more slowly in the city but able to up the pace all the way up to 100 km/h for rural areas, rather like a modern interurban. Likewise, I see those being a gimme for older interurban systems that could be upgraded for modern usage, like the (aforementioned) Toronto Eastern, the London and Port Stanley and the Grand River Railway, all of which would be IMO fairly obvious cases for the building of modern rail transit systems. Because this isn't meant to be a system that people board from street level you can go with high-floor vehicles, which is much better for engineering trains for the higher speeds of their rural routes. Imagine something like this:

Gold_Line_train_on_East_1st_Street,_July_2017.JPG

In use for the system, though perhaps in a longer train - the platforms should be built to whatever length is the most useful for the demand on the system.
 
They’ve been trying since like the 1960s. In 1976 the plan was for a 22 mile elevated rail from Pearl City to Hawaii Kai, with the initial section being 14 miles from Aloha Stadium to Kahala Mall.
View attachment 873459
But then the Feds withdrew their 80% financing and Frank Fasi wasn’t mayor and HART lost a beat.
I wasn't aware they had been thinking about it all the way back then. If this is proposed in 1976, I can see that being an ideal situation for ICTS, as by the time the route is fully planned out UTDC will be looking for customers for its new system, and it would fit absolutely perfectly for this. The Hawaiian RT, anyone? Or hell, remembering the word's origin, maybe this is the "Wiki-Wiki Line"? 😁
 
Swining back to the ALRT for a second, I imagine it would be possible to make it into something similar to the S-Bahn in Germany, built on the same track gauge as the freight railroads and thus capable of operating on the same tracks. I look at what @Bureaucromancer wrote above about the Penticton - Kelowna - Vernon - Armstrong in British Columbia and I think to myself "That's got ALRT written all over it". As he says there isn't always the proper right of way for it to be a heavy rail solution, but my thought on that front is to build an ALRT-style vehicle that can also run on streets and in LRT pathways where it makes sense to do so.

I'm thinking that this system acts partly as local transit using LRT-style pathways in built-up areas in Kelowna and Vernon but on its own pathways in more rural areas. I'm thinking that the trains for this are two sets of the three-car ALRT trains coupled back-to-back controlled from one operator, running more slowly in the city but able to up the pace all the way up to 100 km/h for rural areas, rather like a modern interurban. Likewise, I see those being a gimme for older interurban systems that could be upgraded for modern usage, like the (aforementioned) Toronto Eastern, the London and Port Stanley and the Grand River Railway, all of which would be IMO fairly obvious cases for the building of modern rail transit systems. Because this isn't meant to be a system that people board from street level you can go with high-floor vehicles, which is much better for engineering trains for the higher speeds of their rural routes. Imagine these:

7536847106_7514b40a71_b.jpg


Being sent to Canada, rebuilt and placed on the front of GO Transit commuter trains instead of diesels. These will easily outpace the older diesels (and likely the F59PHs GO bought in the 1990s as well), and the issues with top speed on the E60 (they were designed to be speed demons for Amtrak, but they had problems at speeds above 90 mph) wouldn't be an issue for GO as their service tops out at about 120 km/h (75 mph). 22 E60s made it to Mexico and operated, while eight never did (including those above), and by the time they would be getting rebuilds and entering GO service, Amtrak's E60s would be on their way out, so GO would be easily (and cheaply) enough able to acquire those as well. A fleet of, say, 50 of these would be able to handle GO's most heavily-used corridors (namely the Lakeshore, Kitchener and Richmond Hill routes) where overhead catenary could be put up without making too much trouble for the freight service on those lines.
 
I think you’re onto something with that concept of optionally crewed trains in a light metro type operation, and would add that DLR really does seem to have been onto something with using very much s-bahn like trains in full automation.

Things would look rather different if ICTS and the CLRV were a common platform wouldn’t they.
 
I think you’re onto something with that concept of optionally crewed trains in a light metro type operation, and would add that DLR really does seem to have been onto something with using very much s-bahn like trains in full automation.
I agree, and I think it would be very helpful in many areas if you can make systems like the ALRT and ICTS use a common platform that can then be quickly and easily adapted for different environments and different uses. I'm not sure a low-floor platform can be used for street-running streetcar services in the long term (especially once the requirements for accessibility factor into matters), but it can certainly be used for an ALRT platform or an ICTS one, and indeed it can be operated automatically as Vancouver does.
Things would look rather different if ICTS and the CLRV were a common platform wouldn’t they.
Yes, but I'm not sure you could make the CLRV/ALRV platform into an ICTS because of their designs, and more to the point why would you? The expensive of designing a vehicle is usually the mechanicals, and even if you go with ICTS-style vehicles using DC power and overhead catenary (and a similar track gauge - I've wondered if the "Ontario Gauge" idea could ever be a thing) like a streetcar does, you still will have different mechanical systems. (And that doesn't bring up the use of linear induction motors on the ICTS systems.) I've always felt the CLRV was a bit of a missed opportunity for Ontario, because when those were built there was a definite need for new light rail vehicles in a number of places, Boeing's attempt at an LRV was an absolute disaster whereas the CLRV proved very reliable in TTC service (and that of its sole American customer in Santa Clara Valley in California) and the TTC was developing the ALRV early on, which would have been ideal for San Francisco's Muni Metro and that of the high-floor light rail services in a variety of places.

But then again, I've also always felt that Canada had the ability to dominate the world of transit vehicles in general. Our success has been huge - Bombardier's commuter rail cars have been sold to a bunch of other cities (both ex-GO units and new ones) and Novabus and New Flyer hold a big section of the North American transit bus market, and Orion was doing well there even before the government of Ontario sold it to Western Star (which was subsequently absorbed into DaimlerChrysler). The ICTS succeeds in a big way, the ALRT works, the CLRV/ALRV twins see more sales, Bombardier and GM Canada are the go-to guys for commuter train rolling stock and Orion, Novabus and New Flyer dominate the bus market....between making a lot of things better and easier for Canadian communities, you make for a lucrative source of export revenue as well.
 
On the other ideas mentioned:

Oshawa is IMO a bit on the small side for light rail, but what makes this one a possibility IMO is General Motors' involvement. The Oshawa Railway operated until the early 2000s, and I see that one as being an absolute gimme for light rail service along the old Oshawa Railway route from Taunton/Simcoe as far as Highway 401 through the center of town, though if it was me I'd go with a high-floor design like the Los Angeles system above that can still be used in mixed traffic (they'll need it on the Bruce Street and Ritson Road sections), and as said you will want it to go west from Oshawa's downtown to the Oshawa Centre mall and to the Oshawa GO station. Combined with the aforementioned interurban proposal from above, maybe the Whitby to Bowmanville section of it is built, and as Oshawa swells in population and the need for passenger traffic outstrips the needs of freight customers (or GM moves more of the Autoplex away from the Ritson Road area), perhaps the city of Oshawa and the province rebuild the area after GM's plants north of the 401 clear out. You could easily build homes for 15,000+ in these areas, and the Oshawa LRT could be a perfect collaboration to it. You'll need to figure out how to get it to Durham College from Taunton/Simcoe, but that way you can maintain the one-way system in the city center and use the development to rebuild Oshawa's rather run-down center.

The London idea also strikes me an LRT idea, but if the province wants to cough up the money to go for a ICTS there London will enormously benefit later. Your route from downtown to Masonville via UWO and from downtown to the airport via Fanshawe College are a good ones and down to the 401 past White Oaks isn't a bad one, though I'm thinking better might be to figure out a way to save the London and Port Stanley and upgrade it into a proper transit service for the city and use that route, as its fairly close to your proposed southern route. That way, your ICTS line can meet the line (presumably this is a high-floor LRT, though the ALRT would be absolutely ideal for this route) and Via Rail Corridor service at London's passenger station. Having the GM London locomotive plant helps too, as if EMD loses its position in the locomotive market the province can go "Hey, if you are thinking of consolidating production there, we'll take the plant off your hands and make transit vehicles there...." and it would make perfect sense to have the maintenance yard for the services there. If UTDC is doing this, the province can then stretch GO service to London (they've tried to do this twice anyways so it's not a stretch) and pay for London's streetcar services to survive (or be revived later) as a testing ground for the developments at UTDC. Build the streetcars from London's central station west to Springbok Park and east along Hamilton Road and you have a VERY good transit system, and anytime one wants to see what UTDC can do, they pop in to London and see what's happening.

Niagara Falls would be ace for a fully-automatic Skytrain-style LRT both for the locals and the visitors, doubly so if you have regular GO service along the Niagara Peninsula. If you make GO's extension from Hamilton to Niagara Falls via St. Catharines work earlier and build a transit depot in the north side of Niagara Falls (there used to be a CN yard there, so room is not an issue) to allow GO train riders to go directly to the Skytrain. I absolutely loathe everything to do with Marineland so part of me doesn't want to extend service there, but on the other side I can see it's many bad decisions and problems leading to them being owned by much more responsible owners, and lots of day trips from Hamilton or Toronto via GO to add to the tourists....it would be a godsend for those visitors and make it imperative to build hotels by the stations.
 
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Obviously inspired by Unbuilt Britain, a thread for unbuilt "stuff" in Canada, post-1900.

To get things started:
The Georgian Bay Ship Canal would in essence have created a shipping route up the Ottawa Valley direct into the upper lakes.

There was actually another, smaller, Georgian Bay Ship Canal proposed to run between Toronto and Wasaga Beach (where I live) via the Nottawasaga and Humber Rivers. Had that been built, Toronto would have an awesome boating canal today and areas like Weston and Downsview would be very wealthy today.
 
There was actually another, smaller, Georgian Bay Ship Canal proposed to run between Toronto and Wasaga Beach (where I live) via the Nottawasaga and Humber Rivers. Had that been built, Toronto would have an awesome boating canal today and areas like Weston and Downsview would be very wealthy today.
The problem with the Georgian Bay Ship Canal is that you would need to have some huge cuts and lifts to make it work.
 
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