Tsarist Russia Challenge- " Russia, light of the free world"

[Wendell]

The Tsar needs to be toppled and replaced by his brother in such a scenario...

 

[Grey Wolf]

Getting back to the point of this discussion - Russia with Nicholas II as Tsar would be in no position to liberalise. He was a dunderhead and a ditherer just like most of his royal relatives and aristocratic contemporaries, both within Russia and all over Europe. Perhaps Michael would be a better bet but how do you get him to be Tsar?

1900 (I think) whilst at Livadia, and whilst Alexandra was pregnant with Anastasia, Nicholas II caught IIRC cholera and was near death's door/ There were emergency succession talks, because Alexandra claimed that being pregnant she should be regent for her unborn baby in tyhe hope that it be a boy. The Grand Dukes and generals opposed this and backed Michael as heir to become tsar as soon as Nicholas II died

Intriguingly this sounds obvious, but look at Spain and Alphonso XI for how it could have worked had not the Russian laws been gender-specific

Grey Wolf

 

[Midgard]

Getting back to the point of this discussion - Russia with Nicholas II as Tsar would be in no position to liberalise. He was a dunderhead and a ditherer just like most of his royal relatives and aristocratic contemporaries, both within Russia and all over Europe. Perhaps Michael would be a better bet but how do you get him to be Tsar?

I think the war is inevitable to pressure the Russians to undertake some mild democratic reforms. But they would be too little too late as in OTL.

Alexander II lives? Would he carry through with more reforms? This may be the best POD to have Russia reform and avoid revolution. Still WWI is still going to be tough for them.

How about Tsarevich Aleksey dying of haemophilia-related injury before 1916, and Rasputin never entering the picture in first place (maybe the former could be the result of the latter)? Say, Nikolai II goes into deep depression, and after some persuasion by his advisors (who happen to be a bit saner than those he had in OTL) decides to abdicate, and to dedicate himself to his grief - especially with the concern that he may not be able to produce another male heir due to his and his wife's advancing age, and both of them being sufficiently imbalanced to sign the abdication papers pressed upon them. In his stead, he appoints Mihail to rule as Mihail II, who does his best to withdraw from war - maybe by that time a major Entente offensive could coincide with this, and Russia would be able to withdraw from the war without a peace as disastrous as Brest-Litovsk.

Give Russia a few years to stabilize, more or less, become somewhat isolationist, and work on internal issues, and by about 1930 or so, with focus on economic development, Russia could be considerably better off - with post-war economic boom, and much of its industry rapidly modernizing, it could benefit from it much more than it did in OTL. As long as Mihail II stays out of the world conflicts, and concentrates on internal problems, by 1930 Russia might start resembling Britain to an extent, at least politically (even though the commoners would still get only limited power). However, it would be stable enough, and would have a generation of people who do know limited democracy to an extent - therefore, a step to true full-scale democracy would be easier, say, by 1960s, at which point it continues developing its resources and territory, becoming a true superpower by late XXth century via not entering major conflicts, and touting itself as a shining example of democratization done right.

 

[Wendell]

How about Tsarevich Aleksey dying of haemophilia-related injury before 1916, and Rasputin never entering the picture in first place (maybe the former could be the result of the latter)? Say, Nikolai II goes into deep depression, and after some persuasion by his advisors (who happen to be a bit saner than those he had in OTL) decides to abdicate, and to dedicate himself to his grief - especially with the concern that he may not be able to produce another male heir due to his and his wife's advancing age, and both of them being sufficiently imbalanced to sign the abdication papers pressed upon them. In his stead, he appoints Mihail to rule as Mihail II, who does his best to withdraw from war - maybe by that time a major Entente offensive could coincide with this, and Russia would be able to withdraw from the war without a peace as disastrous as Brest-Litovsk.

Give Russia a few years to stabilize, more or less, become somewhat isolationist, and work on internal issues, and by about 1930 or so, with focus on economic development, Russia could be considerably better off - with post-war economic boom, and much of its industry rapidly modernizing, it could benefit from it much more than it did in OTL. As long as Mihail II stays out of the world conflicts, and concentrates on internal problems, by 1930 Russia might start resembling Britain to an extent, at least politically (even though the commoners would still get only limited power). However, it would be stable enough, and would have a generation of people who do know limited democracy to an extent - therefore, a step to true full-scale democracy would be easier, say, by 1960s, at which point it continues developing its resources and territory, becoming a true superpower by late XXth century via not entering major conflicts, and touting itself as a shining example of democratization done right.

Might such a Russia politically reorganize itself, and maybe allign with/or fight Japan when tensions mount in East Asia. Actually, Mikhail gets to the throne soon enough, and the Russians are able to fight the war out, then Versailles may not be as harsh on Germany...

 

[Grey Wolf]

It strikes me as becoming more similar to Wilhelmine Germany in the short term, which with a CP victory or a negotiated peace would make perfect sense for Russia

Grey Wolf

 

[Wendell]

It strikes me as becoming more similar to Wilhelmine Germany in the short term, which with a CP victory or a negotiated peace would make perfect sense for Russia

Grey Wolf

I'm not familiar with Wilhelmine Germany, unless you are referring to the Kaiser government before 1919.

 

[Abdul Hadi Pasha]

I'm not familiar with Wilhelmine Germany, unless you are referring to the Kaiser government before 1919.

No, he means the Germany of during the period it was ruled by anorexic lesbian midgets, all named Wilhelmine.