TL-191: Freest country

TL-191: Freest country (right before the Great War)

  • Austria-Hungry

    Votes: 5 3.9%
  • C.S.A

    Votes: 11 8.5%
  • France

    Votes: 2 1.6%
  • Germany

    Votes: 10 7.8%
  • Great Britain

    Votes: 28 21.7%
  • Japan

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Russia

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Ottomans

    Votes: 2 1.6%
  • U.S.A

    Votes: 59 45.7%
  • Other/None/All the Same/Refuse to Answer

    Votes: 10 7.8%

  • Total voters
    129

Jasen777

Donor
Unless I am mistaken, there's a scene in one of the books a barely remember (during WW1) where Bartlett is talking to a British submarine office in a bar. Bartlett or his friend says something (about slavery perhaps) that causes the British officer to mutter something like, "Our allies, the Rebs and the Czar, God help a free country." Barlett naturally takes offense. So even though we don't know anything much about any of the European countries (and Japan) in TL-191, which of the great powers would you call the most free? Let's say, right before the start of the great war.
 
I'm kinda curious why you said Canada. Mabye because they don't have a Remembrance Era?

Or maybe because the Anglo-Canadian's biggest gripe was having the United States as a neighbor, while the French-Canadian's was living in a country dominated by Anglo-Canadians.
 
Or maybe because the Anglo-Canadian's biggest gripe was having the United States as a neighbor, while the French-Canadian's was living in a country dominated by Anglo-Canadians.

What you're saying is that Canada was more free because there main rival was a potential aggressor rather than a nation that they were pissed at because they got beat by them in two wars?
 
What you're saying is that Canada was more free because there main rival was a potential aggressor rather than a nation that they were pissed at because they got beat by them in two wars?

Huh? Not sure what exactly that's supposed to mean, so no.
 
Huh? Not sure what exactly that's supposed to mean, so no.

What I mean is that Canada wasnt out for revenge against anyone. They saw the US as there greatest threat, and this was beyond anything they did, just poor Anglo-American relations in the wake of the War of Succesion and resulting Canadian independance. Even in OTL there was fear in Canada that the US could try and go up against them, and ITTL with poorer Anglo-US relations, I image that fear is greater.

The US's greatest threat, the CSA, was the result of the country botching up two wars. It's even more humiliating the second time, what with Britian and France involved and the CSA having the last laugh. So of course the US is going to be pissed, thus the Remembrance Era. There of course was guilt and un-easiness with the once great US being humiliated. One could also argue the US policies of the Remembrance Era.
 
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What I mean is that Canada wasnt out for revenge against anyone. They saw the US as there greatest threat, and this was beyond anythj g they did, poor Anglo-American in the wake of the War of Succesion and resulting Canadian independanc e. Even in OTL there was fear in Canada that the Us could try and go up gaint them, and ITTl with poorer Anglo-US relations, I image that fear is greater.

The US's greatest threat, the CSA, was the result of the country botching up two wars. It's even more humiliating the second time, what with Britian and France involved and the CSA having the last laugh. So of course the US is going to be pissed, thus the Remembrance Era. There of course was guilt and un-easiness with the once great US being humiliated. One could also argue the US policies of the Remembrance Era.

What I meant was pretty simple. At the beginning of the series McGregor's biggest complaints were that farming is an exhausting work, and that the USA was just a few miles away, while Galtier bitched about "talk white" racism and his horse not ever answering him. Neither mentioned anything, as far as I can recall, about state-sponsored abuses and tyrannies of the government in Ottawa.

And executing thousands of innocent "francs-tireurs"?

That was during the war, not beforehand. And again, since you seemed to have missed it the first time, "freest" doesn't necessarily mean "100% spotless."

Also, are you confusing "franc-tireurs" with "hostages"?
 
What I meant was pretty simple. At the beginning of the series McGregor's biggest complaints were that farming is an exhausting work, and that the USA was just a few miles away, while Galtier bitched about "talk white" racism and his horse not ever answering him. Neither mentioned anything, as far as I can recall, about state-sponsored abuses and tyrannies of the government in Ottowa.

I see. Well that is a good point.

Well, I would say the USA is the most free out of the countries listed. I didn't vote yet because Trotsky made a good point about Canada, so I'm still not totally sure, and what about other Biritsh dominions? Well, I'll focus on the ones listed for know.

In terms of all the counties, the USA is a democratic nation. Even with the Remembrance Era, it's still a free country, just a very patriotic one. Now granted its life's not great for lower class people, most immigrants, blacks, mormons and Native Americans, but no country is spotless by any means. The country is a democracy by the standards of the time.

Second place would go to Great Britian. Again, a democratic nation, just this time a constitutional monarchy. Of course Britain is second because of her imperial colonies, where for many of the natives, life isn't very free at all. The same could be said for the third place holder, France. Democratic government, but a little unstable so a notch below Britain, and of course the colonies again as mentioned above. I should say that all of these counties governments are near identical to OTL, save for the US and CS of course.

Fourth place is between Germany and Japan. Germany has an elected government, and here are restrictins on the Kaiser, but the government is very autocratic still, like OTL. Japan had an elected government, but I don't know how much "freer" it was than Germany IOTL.

Now we get into the less free, with fifth place being the CSA. It had an elected government, is a quote un quote "democracy", but is by no means "free". It has a huge black population it openly disenfranchises and keeps from climbing up the social ladder. The CSA is a democracy In the sense that OTL apartheid era South Africa was, a democracy only for a relatively small group. I think that the Blacks in the CSA outnumbered the whites as well, thought by no means to the extent blacks outnumbered whites in OTL South Africa.

Sixth palce is between Austria-Hungary and the Ottoman Empire. Both were autocratic, and had a ton of minorities who were purposely kept out of power. I don't think there were elections in the Ottoman Empire. I think there were in AH, but they might have been voting by for nobility and such.

Lastly is Russia. Autocratic, tons of repressed minorities again, barely any elected government, antisemetic pogroms, widespread poverty etc. etc. If you weren't part of the nobility, I image life was ranged from "meh" to god awful.
 

JSmith

Banned
Would someone explain to me how on Earth an argument could be made that the CSA was the most free?
 
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