The Union Forever: A TL

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Mac Gregor

mjanes said:
Now to see if there's any chance the final treaties are done well enough so as to prevent a WWII equivalent in this time line.
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CELTICEMPIRE said:
how will the aftermath of the war play out now?
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Hey everyone, it has been alot of fun but i will be finishing this TL very soon. There will be four more updates. The first two will deal with the treaty ending the war and the immediate aftermath. The next two updates will jump ahead to the world of 2011 and see how the TL has played out with one update focusing on the USA and second on the rest of the world.

If anyone has any questions or input they would like to see in the TL now is the time to ask. Cheers!
 

Mac Gregor

zeppelin247 said:
what i am wondering is now the war is over what is the finaancial state of the allied powers, I mean is Britain as heavily in debt as it was in our time, now much of the Prussian and Italian economy was destroyed by the French invasions and is their any support ITTL Russia for communists are is the majority of the public supportive of the Tsar
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Britain is not as heavily indebted as in OTL but having fought the Anglo-Boer War and the Great War back to back there economy has taken a beating.

Yes, Prussia and Italy have both suffered serious damage due to the war being fought largely on their territory. However, it’s nothing that time can't be fixed.

Russia is considerable more democratic than OTL with a functioning Parliament. Having just won the war the Tsar enjoys considerable popularity. There are communists in the TL but are stronger in France and Prussia than Russia.
 

Alternatehistoryguy47

Mac Gregor said:
Hey everyone, it has been alot of fun but i will be finishing this TL very soon. There will be four more updates. The first two will deal with the treaty ending the war and the immediate aftermath. The next two updates will jump ahead to the world of 2011 and see how the TL has played out with one update focusing on the USA and second on the rest of the world.

If anyone has any questions or input they would like to see in the TL now is the time to ask. Cheers!
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Will there be a President Roosevelt? Theodore or otherwise?
 

Mac Gregor

kevvy2010 said:
Will there be a President Roosevelt? Theodore or otherwise?
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Good question. President Robert T. Lincoln will not be running for a fourth term, so I imagine the Republican nomination for 1912 will come down to Secretary of War Theodore Roosevelt (NY), Vice President Andrew Johnson Jr. (TN), or possible one of the American generals from the Great War. Who would people like to see win in 1912?
 

Alternatehistoryguy47

Mac Gregor said:
Good question. President Robert T. Lincoln will not be running for a fourth term, so I imagine the Republican nomination for 1912 will come down to Secretary of War Theodore Roosevelt (NY), Vice President Andrew Johnson Jr. (TN), or possible one of the American generals from the Great War. Who would people like to see win in 1912?
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Teddy Roosevelt, mainly because it would be more interesting than the Johnson-takes-over-after-Lincoln analouge... unless President Lincoln is going to be assassinated :eek:
 

Mac Gregor

I am currently working on the next update concerning the post war world. I have decided that a pan-German state will be established including Austria. My question for the thread is how should this new state be structured? ITTL Prussia (North German Confederation) is a constitutional monarchy under the liberal minded but aging Frederick III. The conquered territories of Baden, Württemberg, Bavaria, and Austria have all had their monarchies toppled during the course of the war.

My question is would Prussia form a German Empire as in OTL? I am inclined to have Frederick III refuse the title of Emperor (keep in mind they have just fought a world war against the Emperor's of France, Austria-Hungry, and Turkey) but instead create a Federal Kingdom of Germany which would be a federal constitutional monarchy with considerable individual freedom under the Hohenzollerns. What do ya'll think?
 
IchBinDieKaiser

IchBinDieKaiser

I think it would be best to allow him to keep his title of Emperor, but with much less power. In other words, they would need to change the status of the nobility of this new Germany to a similar status that the nobles have in the UK. They don't have any(or much) actual political power. Influence maybe, but not actual power. So they keep the Kaiser as a figure head like the English Monarchy, but they leave all of the goverorning affairs to a civilian government.
 

Earl_of_Somerset

Banned
Coalition

American Expeditionary Force (AEF): General James F. Bell
1st Army: Robert Lee Bullard
3rd Army: Leonard Wood
4th Army: John Pershing

British Expeditionary Force (BEF): Field Marshal Herbert Kitchener
1st Army: Julian Byng
2nd Army: John French
3rd Army: Douglas Haig

Prussian Army Group A: Field Marshal Schlieffen
1st Army:Johannes Georg von der Marwitz
2nd Army:Otto Liman von Sanders
4th Army: Alexander Von Kluck

Prussian Army Group B: Field Marshal Von Moltke
3rd Army:Karl von Bulow
6th Army:Oskar von Huiter

Russian 7th Army: General Alexi Brusilov

Entente

French 1st Army: Ferdinand Foch
French 2nd Army:Louis Franchet d'Esperey
French 3rd Army:Jospeh Gallieni
French 4th Army: Robert Nivelle
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Yes! I made a contribution.

As for Germany, It would be interesting if there was a Dual Monarchy over the Catholic and Protestant Halves.
 

GeneralTigerXVII

Mac Gregor said:
I am currently working on the next update concerning the post war world. I have decided that a pan-German state will be established including Austria. My question for the thread is how should this new state be structured? ITTL Prussia (North German Confederation) is a constitutional monarchy under the liberal minded but aging Frederick III. The conquered territories of Baden, Württemberg, Bavaria, and Austria have all had their monarchies toppled during the course of the war.

My question is would Prussia form a German Empire as in OTL? I am inclined to have Frederick III refuse the title of Emperor (keep in mind they have just fought a world war against the Emperor's of France, Austria-Hungry, and Turkey) but instead create a Federal Kingdom of Germany which would be a federal constitutional monarchy with considerable individual freedom under the Hohenzollerns. What do ya'll think?
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Really sorry to hear that it's ending man, but it has to end sometime. I agree with IchBinDieKaiser on the structure of the Pan-German Empire, but I think you might want to give him some sort of additional power. How about this: once a bill passes Parliment, send it to the Kaiser for vetoing or passing. However, if the bill is vetoed by the Kaiser, it can be overriden by the Prime Minister. Everything else you siad I completely agree with. Can't wait to see the update! :D
 

Mac Gregor

I don't plan on trying to tally the casualty figures myself. However, does anyone want to take a stab at them in comparison to our WW1?
 
The Treaty of Brussels: 1911
  • Index

    • Mac Gregor

    The Treaty of Brussels​

    February – October 1911​

    With the Great War over and the Coalition victorious the world’s attention now turned to building a lasting peace. The Belgian city of Brussels was chosen as the sight of the negotiations which would last for nearly nine months before a comprehension deal could be reached.

    Third French Republic

    At the treaty negotiations France would see its once grand empire divided amongst the victors. Having violently overthrown the French Empire, including having killed its despised former Emperor, gave the French republican delegates a degree of legitimacy with the Coalition powers during the negotiations. Furthermore, the new French government, unlike its predecessor, had little desire to preserve its overseas empire, instead willing to trade overseas territories in order to not have to pay exorbitant monetary reparations. This is a clearly illustrated by France ceding Cameroun to the new Federal Kingdom of Germany. By the end of the treaty negotiations France had lost all of her American, Pacific, Asian and most of her African colonies managing only to retain Algeria. France was forced to allow Corsica and Alsace-Loraine to hold referendums on whether to remain part of France, become independent, or join Italy and Germany respectively. In the end, both provinces remained part of the republic. Furthermore, limits were placed on the French army and navy, and a demilitarized zone along France’s western border was established for twenty five years. Although tough, the treaty did not saddle the young republic with huge monetary reparations or permanently lose any of France’s metropolitan territory allowing the country to recover and prosper in the coming decades.

    The United States of America

    In the treaty, the United States retained nearly all of its island conquests. In the Caribbean the U.S. gained the Panama Canal, Guiana, Guadeloupe, Martinique, Saint Barthelemey, and Saint Martin. In the north Atlantic the tiny islands ofSaint Pierre and Miquelon were kept despite protest from the Newfoundland government and ceded to the State of Maine. In the Pacific the United States acquired a virtual island empire having annexed all of the former French possessions in Polynesia and Micronesia. The Treaty of Brussels also acknowledged American dominance of the Philippine Archipelago. Not wanting to spend the resources garrisoning the unruly islands, the United States would establish the Philippines as an independent republic in 1916 after gaining considerable trade and naval basing rights.

    The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland

    In terms of square miles of territory gained the United Kingdom received the most at the treaty negotiations. Britain greatly increased its African holdings by acquiring Madagascar, the Sudan, and most of French central and west Africa. The treaty granted Britain control of the Suez Canal and Egypt, which Britain set up as a puppet Kingdom of Egypt. Furthermore, Britain established puppet states in Mesopotamia and Indochina. In total, the British Empire would reach its zenith after the Great War controlling more than a quarter of the globe’s population and territory.

    Italian Republic

    Italy regained all the land lost in the Treaty of Milan and annexed all of the Italian speaking regions of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire. Due to the enormous damages that Italy suffered during the course of the war, many Italians including their new President Brancaleone Lucchesi, wished acquire further territories from France such as Corsica, Provence, and Savoy. During the course of the negotiations France retained Savoy and Provence but was forced to offer Corsicans a referendum on whether they wished to join Italy, become independent, or remain part of France with the Corsicans ultimately choosing the later. The Italian Republic did receive from France the important North African territory of Tunis-Tripolitania which included parts of Cyrenaica as well as vast stretches of desert in the interior.

    Russian Empire
    Having already gained Manchuria during the Treaty of Honolulu, the Treaty of Brussels allowed Russia to annex Galicia as well as some territory from the Ottoman Empire in the Caucuses. In eastern Anatolia, Russia established the Kingdom of Kurdistan as a protectorate. Although not specified in the Treaty of Brussels, Russia greatly expanded its sphere of influence in the Balkans following the war.

    Kingdom of Prussia/ German Empire

    Having occupied nearly all of the German speaking areas of Europe by the end of the war, many in the Prussian government decided that the time was at hand to finally create a pan-German state. While negotiations were ongoing in Brussels, the Kaiser convened a convention in Berlin to discuss the formation of a new German nation. At the Berlin convention there was a wide variety of fractions present from Prussia, Austria, and the south German states including militarists, monarchist, republicans, federalists, and those wanting to only incorporate the Protestant or Catholic segments of Germany. After months of debate on August 5, 1911 an agreement was finally reached in what many historians would claim to be one of the best managed compromises in political history. The German states would be united into a new constitutional parliamentary monarchy known as the German Empire with the 80 year old Frederick III crowned as emperor. Internally, the empire itself was divided into several lander or states with significant levels of autonomy. The new German imperial constitution called for a bicameral parliament with the lower house elected from amongst the people (women would not get the vote until the late 1920’s) and an upper house chosen from the nobility from the various states. The constitutional protected both protestant and catholic religions, freedom of assembly and press, and the rule of law. The signing of the Treaty of Brussels in October of 1911 internationally acknowledged the formation of the German Empire and made it the new dominate power on the European continent.
     
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  • Index

    • Mac Gregor

    The World after the Treaty of Brussels. 1912

    1912.png
     

    SilverSwimmer

    So no Phillipine-American war eh?

    I wonder if the United States's newfound Pacific territories, and thier friend in the Phillipines, will come into contention with Japan. It might have already been said, but Japans defeat could have both stemmed or furthered its nationalistic tendencies.
     

    zeppelin247

    wow I was really not expecting the British empire to grow so massively, I really was thinking that the Americans would have greatly tried to limit such large British expansion
     

    Mac Gregor

    zeppelin247 said:
    wow I was really not expecting the British empire to grow so massively, I really was thinking that the Americans would have greatly tried to limit such large British expansion
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    The Americans did the best they could. They helped curb British expansion by promoting Germany getting Cameroon, France retaining Algeria, and having Egypt, Mesopotamia, and Indochina be protectorates instead of being annexed out right.
     

    Ze Kaiser

    Well, that's a nice fat Germany. :D

    Is the British Empire still saddled with a crushing debt like OTL, or is it going to lose its Empire in some other fashion. After all, what goes up must come down.
     
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