The Experimental Armoured Force gets the go ahead.

sharlin

Banned
Colonel’s Fuller and Collins stood on the podium waiting for the hubbub of conversation to die down before Fuller stepped forwards and cleared his throat, instantly there was silence and all eyes turned to him.

“Thank you gentlemen, now we’ve been working together for the past two years in training in the field and in our headquarters and it is my pleasure to tell you that as of…now” the Colonel said as the clock in the theatre chimed midday. “The Experimental Armoured Force is no longer purely Experimental. The Ministry of Defence and Government has authorised an expansion of the Force and has allocated funds to further spread this to not only our armoured forces but the Army as a whole.”

That announcement got everyone talking for sure and the Colonel waited for the noise to die down before continuing. “I don’t know what happened, it seems that either someone saw common sense or Devine Intervention, either way I am not one to look a gift horse in the mouth. For budgetary reasons the planned adoption of Infantry and Cruiser tanks will not proceed, our urgings for a Universal Tank on grounds of effectiveness, cost and function appear to have sunk in and Vickers is starting work on a new design to replace our Mark Is and II’s used in trials.
I am sure there will be some.. opposition to these changes but they are necessary! As you know we can not plan to fight the last war as the French are doing, overseas we’ve all heard of the German rearmament and who here after reading Herr Hitler’s speeches can honestly say that War with Germany will not come and come soon?”

“We are going to be pioneers gentlemen and have no doubt that the Ministry and Army as a whole will be watching us like hawks, we will not fail to impress, we will give Great Britain the army she so rightly deserves.”

On August 12th 1929 the British Government formally accepted the Experimental Armoured Force as a recognised unit and in turn forced the Army to accept it as well. Some of the old ‘Warhorses’ resisted both publically and privately bemoaning the loss of their beloved horse cavalry that had proven almost utterly ineffective in the First World War and loathed the adoption of the tank and truck but these objections were mostly ignored. With tensions in Europe rising the Government started belatedly to rearm. The expansion of plants required to produce the new mechanised armed forces envisioned and dreamed lead to a greater demand for workers and helped industries struggling in the throes of the Great Depression.

The divisive argument about the adoption of Infantry and so called Cruiser tanks was now firmly settled, there would be neither as it increased the logistics strain on units who would have to cater for multiple types of tanks and could lead to problems in battle where you have the wrong tank for the wrong job. The 18lber ‘Birch Gun’ Self Propelled artillery piece based on the slowly being retired Vickers Mk II tank was ordered into production as well as a larger tankette for carrying supplies and ammunition when the Carden-Lloyd Tankette was recognised as being barely suitable for purpose, this new machine would be designed by 1932 and would enter service as both a ‘prime mover’ for supplies and an artillery tug but with an enlarged open rear compartment could also haul an infantry squad with ease a huge improvement over the trucks used in exercises previously which had been left behind by their tracked colleagues in off road conditions.

The new Universal tank Mk 1 entered service a month after the new ‘Universal Carrier’ was released, armed with a longer barrelled and more modern version of the 47mm gun 3 pounder found on the Mark II Medium tanks the machine had a bow mounted machine gun as well as two more in the turret. The 47mm gun was capable of firing both armour piercing rounds and a small high explosive round for dealing with infantry and guns. Whilst it was an inferior weapon to the 2 pounder anti-tank gun entering service in terms of shell velocity it was deemed capable enough and was preferred for being more flexible.

This lead to the Universal Mark II which would ‘hit the shelves’ in 1936 and was a superior machine in every respect over the now viewed as ‘experimental’ Mark I and would feature a new 47mm gun based on an enlarged 2lber retaining the high muzzle velocity of the gun but also the useful ability to fire a HE shell. The 2lber was also mated to the new Universal carrier as a mobile tank destroyer to provide support for infantry and armoured forces whilst designs for a new and heavily armoured tank destroyer and ‘assault tank’ capable of engaging strongpoints and enemy vehicles and shrugging off return fire was also pursued.

The Combined arms approach of the Army had its drawbacks, cost being the biggest. Each of the Combined Arms Brigades would consist of the following:

Recon: 2 x Companies of Daimler Armoured Cars, 16 Universal Carriers armed with Boys Anti-tank rifles and machine guns.
Main Force: One tank Battalion, 48 Mark II Universal Tanks.
One Infantry Battalion with Universal Carriers down to Platoon level as well as an attached motorised Machine gun battalion mounted in Universal Carriers (also armed with Boys AT Rifles and when they were introduced the 2lber)
Artillery detachment: One Mechanised Artillery Brigade of four batteries of 18lb ‘Birch Guns’ SP Artillery, one towed battery of 3.7 inch light howitzers towed by half tracks.
Engineering Detachment: One Company of Royal Engineers on halftracks and Universal Carriers.

The sheer expense of equipping such formations meant that their expansion was slow but the Army also finally embraced mechanisation, adopting a wide range of trucks, halftracks and the ubiquitous Universal Carrier. There were cutbacks too, the sheer cost of a mechanised army meant that some Regiments were disbanded as a cost saving measure. This was met with stiff opposition in the House of Commons but got through with the recognition that the modern British army thanks to its new doctrines were more efficient and powerful despite a reduction in manpower.

By 1939 there were six full Brigades of Combined Arms Units with the Mark IV SP Artillery entering production built to carry the brand new Royal Ordnance QF 25 Pounder rapidly replacing the aging 18 pounder and built on the Universal Mark II chassis. The Universal Mark III tank was also entering service, the Mark II was in general service with the army whilst the Mark III, called the Matilda by its men after a popular comic character (which became its official name) featured the new 6 pounder AT gun, like its 3 pounder predecessor was capable of also firing a HE round out to useful ranges.

Development of an ‘assault tank’ also saw success with the introduction of the Matilda. Nuffield tinkered with the Mark III to make it into an entirely different and much bigger beast. Armed with a 6 pounder the AT-1 (Assault tank design No 1) was a lumbering beast at 20kph and although the design featured a turret, the turret itself was fixed and immobile to save weight. The weight saved with the turret and the smaller engine went into armour and here Nuffield outdid themselves with a staggering 203mm of armour on the front and 104mm on the flank the AT-1 had thicker armour on its vitals than many cruisers. Designed to attack strongpoints like the feared Siegfried Line as well as provide anti-tank fire support for Combined arms units the AT-1 Centurion was starting to see service, issued out in 6 vehicle platoons to the Combined Arms Brigades the machines caused no end of woe for the attached Engineers who had to see if the 41 tonne machines could cross bridges and often had to make bridges for them.

On the First of September 1939 Germany Invaded Poland and the British Army went on alert, all six CAB's (Combined Arms Battalions) were to ordered to form up to prepare to move should Diplomacy fail.



wot_screens_tanks_britain_at_2_image_03.jpg

The AT-1 Assault tank.






Something I wrote during a coffee break, plausable or not? Also why does 2 and a half pages on Word always come out as dinky here :s
 

sharlin

Banned
I'd not thought of that but one could assume that the silly requirement for 'rail transport' would be shoved aside as it would limit the machines. A thing like the AT-1 (the real life AT-2 design) would never fit on a train thanks to its weight.
 
I'd not thought of that but one could assume that the silly requirement for 'rail transport' would be shoved aside as it would limit the machines. A thing like the AT-1 (the real life AT-2 design) would never fit on a train thanks to its weight.

Glad to hear it :)

An added benefit would be an improvement to the tanks endurance possibly as I'm assuming they would need to perform longer road marches and can't always rely on transporters meaning that improvements would be suggested and carried out well in advance of '39.
 

sharlin

Banned
Thats what the Experimental Armoured Force did though, lots of testing and trials, 2 years worth and going off these ideas if the idea was carried out and endorsed the units would either be spread out over their respective regiments or held together on the same camps. If they were spread out it would necessitate more movement by roads and long distance road runs would/should show up any flaws that can be corrected. Thats why the Mark I Universal tank was basically more an experiemental unit that was produced and given to the CABs to see what happened.
 
Argh, you've pre-empted me on this topic. I've been planning to write something along these lines for a while, and am currently working on the outline for the first couple of chapters to see how they go and how people enjoy them.

Well, I will probably still do mine as I've developed my understanding and research of it quite a bit so far.

Looking forward to seeing how it develops
 

sharlin

Banned
It probably won't develop, I was just musing during a coffee break at work and bashed this out on my keyboard :)
 
203mm armor? This is not 'overdoing it'. It needs a completely new verb to be devised.

Is this an integral part of your Franco-Japanese timeline, or unconnected to it?
 
I think you mean Artillery Regiment, if you've got 4-5 batteries.

Gotta say, it sounds like a force with a real punch to it. Decent tanks, infantry support, practiced at combined arms operations...


I'm not 100% sure of the plausibility though; the political challenges are immense.
 

sharlin

Banned
203mm armor? This is not 'overdoing it'. It needs a completely new verb to be devised.

Is this an integral part of your Franco-Japanese timeline, or unconnected to it?

It may become part of the franco-japanese timeline, I'm trying to kickstart my muse for it and it is working :)
 
Unfortunally not too plausible.

The military establishment was in general against mechanization. They wanted to remain noble knights, skilled artists and gentlemen to whom "war" meant horses, heroic missions in the colonies and Rudyard Kipling. To become mechanics in a tank was a nightmare for them. You could just study how almost all militaries resisted introducing the machinegun until WW1 with the same arguments.

A political leadership that was pro-military would listen to the establishment, not crackpots like Fuller. A political leadership that didn't listen to the military establishment would likely be anti-military and simply cut the defence budget with 15%, not create a new, expensive and expansive arm of the military.

The Armoured Force would only be useful in Western Europe, while an ordinary infantry division could be used in Burma, Hongkong, the Gold Coast or in the Commonwealth. (At least with the technical and logistical level of the early 30s.)

It could probably happen, but the POD would have to be very specific. Let Fuller do something heroic and thereby achive higher rank and getting more influence? Make Churchill Minister of War instead of Minister of Finance, and have him continue to support the tanks that he as Minister of Navy financed? Avoid some of the more expensive parts of WW1 (Gallipoli? Greece? Africa?), saving the Empire a lot of money and men that could be spent after 1918? Kipling becoming a tank nut in 1916 and dedicating his remaining time to write stories where technology advanced British soldiers defeated Germans, Afghans or Soviet enemies?

And a nitpick: the AT-1 is incredebly over-armoured. At that time AT guns had a calibre of 37-47 mm, AA guns like the 88 weren't on the horizon and heavy artillery firing in direct mode could still shock the crew to death by HE regardless of the armour thickness. Just scale it down a bit - maybe even slope the armour.
 

sharlin

Banned
The AT-1 was based on a 1943 design for an assault tank that would be used to breech fortified positions like the Seigfried line. With the allies planning on going on the offensive they wanted a machine that could close on enemy pillboxes and disable them without being threatened by artillery fire or AT guns. This design led to the much large A-39 Tortoise Assault gun which mounted a 32lber AA gun as its main weapon and was even more heavily armoured. Could thin the AT-1's armour to 152mm thats still simply gargantuan by any standard.
 
Superkuf. I don't think that it is that unplausible.

It was General Milne, Chief of the Imperial General Staff, who instigated the introduction of the EAF, and he was still CIGS in 1929, so he could quite easily be the influential voice needed to help develop the EAF further.

That's what I'm having in my army, as well as having the Prime Minister and Chancellor being very impressed with the EAF and agreeing to continue funding it
 

sharlin

Banned
“Did you say..eight inches?”

“Yes General, eight inches of solid steel armour over the front of the hull and drivers hatch, the turret has four inches and that’s behind a two inch mantlet, the flanks have a uniform four inches and the rear drops down to two.”

“A bit much isn’t it?”

“Well…we are concerned about the developments of anti-tank weapons as well as the effects of artillery on armoured vehicles. By endeavouring to make the AT-1 as shell proof as we can we also keep it effective against future developments. I assume that the weight is a concern?”

“Yes, at 41 tonnes its very heavy..”

“Well we could thin the protection on the front, down to six inches that would save some weight, perhaps two tonnes and still provide ample protection against anything that could be thrown at it.”

“That would be more desirable yes, I will of course have to talk to the Ministry, would it save money?”

“Naturally General, I can have the savings calculated and let your ADC know by this evening if you wish? Also we was thinking of a simple variant, replacing the 6 pounder with a 3.7 inch howitzer, the change in weight is negligible and would give the vehicle a fine punch against buildings and fortifcations.”

“Get the specifications to me along with the costs and we’ll see if we can twist a few arms, will the change to the frontal protection delay production, what whats going on we may need them sooner rather than later.”

“At best a weeks delay for continued production and of course, it’s a terrible feeling, just waiting for the other shoe to drop, everyone must now see whats coming but there’s nothing we can do but just go along with it.”
 

sharlin

Banned
The Mark I was just that.
Mark II needs a name
the Mark III was going to be called something else but was called the Matilda although it needs an official name.

The Universal carrier could be something like the Saxon?
 
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