The Dead Skunk

[AuroraBorealis]

Two parallels. Everything north of the 31st parallel is still U.S. territory.

So it's quite a small republic… especially since its western border hasn't been clearly defined yet. (I will get to that.)

Spain will probably insist that the border is at the Arroyo Hondo, exactly as when it was French Louisiana. There won't be anything the small republic can do about it either.

The Brits are Spanish allies as well, Spain being far more important at this juncture, than a minor city state at the entrance to the Mississippi.

 

[bm79]

Spain will probably insist that the border is at the Arroyo Hondo, exactly as when it was French Louisiana. There won't be anything the small republic can do about it either.

The Brits are Spanish allies as well, Spain being far more important at this juncture, than a minor city state at the entrance to the Mississippi.

The Spanish, who've just been liberated from the French Ogre with British help, are indebted to Britain and would likely be very generous with the western frontier. At this point, Texas is unsettled land outside a few outposts like Nagodoches.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

The Spanish, who've just been liberated from the French Ogre with British help, are indebted to Britain and would likely be very generous with the western frontier. At this point, Texas is unsettled land outside a few outposts like Nagodoches.

I beg your pardon... how do you figure this...or more to the point..how do you figure the Spanish will come to this conclusion. While their diplomacy at CofV was rather lacklustre, they could not be termed generous to any one by any stretch of the imagination...in deed their interests hardly mattered that much to anyone but them... The peninsular campaign was a campaign of mutual intersts of all parties. whether there are any concessions with regard to the Louisiana republic..the Anglo-Portuguese will still strike the French here because the French are simply increasingly vulnerable in this theatre.

What quid pro quo would you propose that Britain provide Spain in this region to balance the scales, why would they even care....argueably the smaller it is the better it is for both parties. Of course if they were to acceed back to Spanish sovereignty under a joint guarantee of autonomy from Britain...then that changes things significantly.

 

[bm79]

I beg your pardon... how do you figure this...or more to the point..how do you figure the Spanish will come to this conclusion. While their diplomacy at CofV was rather lacklustre, they could not be termed generous to any one by any stretch of the imagination...in deed their interests hardly mattered that much to anyone but them... The peninsular campaign was a campaign of mutual intersts of all parties. whether there are any concessions with regard to the Louisiana republic..the Anglo-Portuguese will still strike the French here because the French are simply increasingly vulnerable in this theatre.

What quid pro quo would you propose that Britain provide Spain in this region to balance the scales, why would they even care....argueably the smaller it is the better it is for both parties. Of course if they were to acceed back to Spanish sovereignty under a joint guarantee of autonomy from Britain...then that changes things significantly.

Perhaps I should have said "can be induced to be generous." Why, you ask? A large as possible Louisiana which can support as large a population as possible suits Britain's desire to not see its gains be recouped by an angry US in a few years' time. Right now, the British can probably afford to post at most two regiments in Louisiana, one of which they'd probably try to replace with Canadian militia as quickly as they can. They need a Louisiana that can maintain its own forces in the future, and the more land to attract settlers, the better.

And as to what Britain could give Spain in return... well, the situation in Mexico is growing hairier each year, and without help, within five years' time the question over the border won't any longer be in Spain's hands anyway.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

Don't forget that at the moment, the arc of coast from Galveston Bay to Atchafalaya Bay is a pirate haven. The main interest of the British will be establishing order in the area, under whichever flag.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

Now for some news about the election.


…given his history, it was, perhaps, inevitable that Randolph’s followers would come to be called the “Tertium Quids,” even though the Federalists had merged with the Democratic-Republicans, and therefore the name no longer made any sense whatsoever.

A question I am more often asked is “why didn’t he ever run for president?” To understand this, you must understand the man. Behind all his eccentricities, this rambling and disjointed speaker was intelligent, observant, a believer in the value of planning ahead and one of the most deeply principled men ever to serve in American public life. As he would say in 1819 in a speech to Congress opposing federal involvement in the planning of the Great Southern Canal, “The moment a man leaves the path of religion or virtue to ascertain how far he may go on the border line of villainy without overstepping it, that man is lost.”

Compromise was anathema to Randolph — but as a man who had served in Congress for some years, he had seen the necessity of it in any government that was not an absolute tyranny. This was part of the reason for his desire to keep the reach of said government as small as possible. And yet — here is a paradox that has bedeviled conservative politicians since Edmund Burke — in order to achieve his goal of limiting the government’s power, he himself had to seek power within that government.

And in 1816 he became a man on a mission — to oppose the “Dead Roses” (a term he had coined in derision, but which the Democratic-Republicans themselves self-applied without shame) and the incoming Adams-Monroe administration with every fiber of his being. “It is my duty to leave nothing undone that I may lawfully do, to pull down this administration,” he said. “Our situation is awful beyond conception. We are going the road that has ruined nations before us. I must be dead before I could refrain at a call like this.”

But to run for president against this ticket seemed an exercise in futility. (This is, of course, exactly what it was. In November the TQ ticket of John Taylor of Caroline and Nathaniel Macon received the vote of only one faithless Delaware elector.) More to the point, Randolph could not run for president and representative at the same time. To pursue the presidency would have been to abandon his own seat. At least in Congress, he would continue to have the opportunity to continue to put forward his thoughts, offer his opinion pieces to the newspapers, and generally combat what he called “the meddling, obtrusive, intrusive, restless, self-dissatisfied spirit” of the DRs.

So it was that the man of courage found himself, not once but several times, holding back while others carried the banner of his ideas onto the primary battlefield of American politics — the Presidential election. In doing so, however, Randolph proved that the Tertium Quid party was more than just his personal hobbyhorse. He showed that others shared his ideals. At the same time, while one TQ electoral standard-bearer after another rose and fell, Randolph, the nation’s “unofficial Leader of the Opposition,” was able to hold sway over the nation’s second party for a dozen years — years which saw it rise from utter irrelevance to at least a regional power base.
Andrea Fessler, A Voice in the Wilderness: The Life of John Randolph of Roanoke

(The quotes are all things J.R. of R. said IOTL, taken slightly out of context.)

 

[CandyDragon]

This is a great read, plausible and well done.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Perhaps I should have said "can be induced to be generous." Why, you ask? A large as possible Louisiana which can support as large a population as possible suits Britain's desire to not see its gains be recouped by an angry US in a few years' time. Right now, the British can probably afford to post at most two regiments in Louisiana, one of which they'd probably try to replace with Canadian militia as quickly as they can. They need a Louisiana that can maintain its own forces in the future, and the more land to attract settlers, the better.

And as to what Britain could give Spain in return... well, the situation in Mexico is growing hairier each year, and without help, within five years' time the question over the border won't any longer be in Spain's hands anyway.

There is nothing in this TL to suggest that the events of Spainès overseas Empire will transpire in quite the same way as OTL.. For one, both Carlos and Francisco have been dispatched to the Americas with sizeable forces to maintain order. One of them, probably Carlos, is resident in Mexico City..the other is either in Havana or Lima. Probably the latter.

Unless Louisiana were to become subject in some fashion to the Spanish crown, it does not suit their interest that it become as large as possible, better they be as weak as possible and dependent on the only power adjacent to them able to help should the US prove intransigent, and the British, disinterested, in a desire to re-incorporate them. We are after all only looking at the "isle of Orleans" and the Florida parishes for the most part right. Or did the US get these terr. as well between the Pearl and Mississippi, and thence all the way to the Appalachicola, as West Florida. If so then "Rep. of Nouvelle Orleans" would have been a more appropriate name for the Republic.

Something along the lines of the Miskitia or the Br. settlers in Honduras perhaps...

In time then, perhaps they may, in a period of turbulence, in a future Mexican Empire, should it transpire, evolve to independence again...It may even transpire that parts of Texas may be added to enlarge such a province. It would be a good place to install a junior member of the French Bourbons, since they are not likely to be re-installed in france...and instill a degree of separateness from both New Spain and Havana, and act as catalyst to draw. the dissaffected French emigres not wishing to to remain in France or return to even a France ruled under a Regency for Napoleon II.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Don't forget that at the moment, the arc of coast from Galveston Bay to Atchafalaya Bay is a pirate haven. The main interest of the British will be establishing order in the area, under whichever flag.

I don't see how this changes in any way the de jure claims of Spain in any manner.. Even after the drubbing at Trafalgar, the Spanish Navy is capable of taking out a few pesky pirates that may be preying upon their commerce in the Gulf. It would be in their interest to now establish a permanent presence on the coast of Texas as a deterrent to keep the pirates away once cleared if they are being such a pesky nuisance.

As for any de facto claims, there are none as only the Native Americans and said pirates of probably various allegiances to anyone are the only inhabitants with a smattering of Mexicans along the Rio Grande perhaps in Nueva Santander.

Spain is hardly likely to give away anything for nothing in return... say renunciation of any claims in Honduras to logg timber except under Spanish auspices, and return of perhaps Trinidad and Tobago as a prid pro quo. The now largely French Planter society that moved there from Martinique following the Revolution with their property might be offered resettlement then, so that the Spanish character of the island is returned... how many actually choose to do so again would be up for debate, since they would be decidedly Conservative and probably decidely monarchist. Of course given the way things are turning out in europe, they might be expected to get this back in any case if Britain and allies keep parts of the French Caribbean. Perhaps yet another source for settlers for a larger Louisianan Republic.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

This is a great read, plausible and well done.

Thank you.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

I'd like to thank bm79 for his assistance.

The Assembly of the Republic of Louisiana was noteworthy for the simplicity of its structure. Unlike the U.S. Congress, it was not a compromise between popular and provincial representation. Nor was it a compromise between democracy and aristocracy, unlike the British Parliament. It was designed by men who were not afraid of a government that could (at least in theory) engage in quick and decisive action when necessary. That, after all, was how they had come to secede in the first place.

The Assembly was comprised of one chamber. Elections were held every three years on the first Saturday in August. Each parish sent at least one representative to the Assembly. If it had between 1,000 and 2,000 residents, it had two representatives. Between 2,000 and 3,000 residents meant three representatives. And so on. Although this might seem to weight the Assembly in favor of the more heavily populated Orleans Parish, it also gave greater influence to the votes of large slaveholders, whose slaves could not vote but were nonetheless counted in the census.

The first order of business of each new Assembly was to choose a president and vice-president. In the case of the 1815-1818 session, these were Jacques Villeré and Jean Noel Destréhan. No one could serve two consecutive terms in either office — indeed, a president or vice-president who had completed one term was obliged to wait two election cycles before having his name put forward again. This was intended to reduce the danger of a single individual dominating the government.

It had, however, a (possibly) unintended effect. Presidents were, with the consent of the Assembly, allowed to appoint ministers who could serve until they died or were replaced. The intention was to allow the Assembly to benefit at all times from the greatest expertise available in a given field. However, it was soon noted that there was no requirement for a minister to be an Assemblyman — or even a citizen of the Republic. The result was the slow growth of a permanent cabinet of “expert advisors” sent from London…
Aaron Penright, The Autoëmendence[1] of Republican Institutions in the Nineteenth Century

[1]A word that will be coined ITTL to describe biological evolution, and will later be used as a metaphor for technological and institutional change.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

While we're all waiting for me to finish the real updates, I'd like to introduce a little feature of this TL: People Born This Year Who Will Show Up Later. I'm not going to tell you too much about them just yet — just a little bit about their early childhoods.

Here's the Class of 1816, so to speak:


March, born a slave on a cotton and tobacco plantation in southern South Carolina. His exact birthdate will never be known, but he was named after the month he was born in, as slave children sometimes were. He will be known as a quiet child. When he is three, a five-year-old white girl will teach him the alphabet, partly as a way of showing off her own mastery of it. Having learned this much, March will quickly work out the basics of reading for himself.

William Burch, born Aug. 4 on a farm in eastern Georgia. He will establish himself as popular with other children, but a notorious and incurable prankster.

Adolf Rasmussen, born Dec. 18, son of a fisherman on the southwest coast of Denmark. In the wake of the Baltic Straits War, his family will move to the United States — specifically, to Gloucester, Massachestts. As a child, he will have very little interest in fishing, but will show a fondness for taking things apart and putting them back together again.

 

[CandyDragon]

While we're all waiting for me to finish the real updates, I'd like to introduce a little feature of this TL: People Born This Year Who Will Show Up Later. I'm not going to tell you too much about them just yet — just a little bit about their early childhoods.

Here's the Class of 1816, so to speak:


March, born a slave on a cotton and tobacco plantation in southern South Carolina. His exact birthdate will never be known, but he was named after the month he was born in, as slave children sometimes were. He will be known as a quiet child. When he is three, a five-year-old white girl will teach him the alphabet, partly as a way of showing off her own mastery of it. Having learned this much, March will quickly work out the basics of reading for himself.

William Burch, born Aug. 4 on a farm in eastern Georgia. He will establish himself as popular with other children, but a notorious and incurable prankster.

Adolf Rasmussen, born Dec. 18, son of a fisherman on the southwest coast of Denmark. In the wake of the Baltic Straits War, his family will move to the United States — specifically, to Gloucester, Massachestts. As a child, he will have very little interest in fishing, but will show a fondness for taking things apart and putting them back together again.

Adolf intrigues me the most, though March very vaguely makes me think of Booker T. Washington.

 

[EnglishCanuck]

This is so awesome!! I'm loving it!

 

[Lycaon pictus]

This is so awesome!! I'm loving it!

I'm glad you like it.

EDIT: 20,000 views. I'd like to thank everybody, especially the people whose criticisms encouraged me to make this TL more plausible.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

And another little nugget of information:

THE (JOHN QUINCY) ADAMS ADMINISTRATION​

PRESIDENT: John Quincy Adams
VICE PRESIDENT: James Monroe

ATTORNEY GENERAL: Smith Thompson (1817-1823), William Wirt (1823-1825)
SECRETARY OF DOMESTIC AFFAIRS: Rufus King
SECRETARY OF THE NAVY: Benjamin William Crowninshield
SECRETARY OF STATE: Henry Clay
SECRETARY OF THE TREASURY: William H. Crawford
SECRETARY OF WAR: Daniel D. Tompkins

 

[Lycaon pictus]

SHAMELESS SELF-PROMOTION ALERT: Vote for "The Dead Skunk" here.
And now, back to our story.

The sun is shining brightly in the Alabama sky
With my hand upon the tiller, none are happier than I
For my wife lives up in Cairo, down in Mobile I’ve a pal
And there’s many a friend and neighbor on the T&T Canal
- “On the T&T Canal,” Classic American Folk Songs for Young People

The sun is shining brightly in the Alabama sky
With my money in my pocket, none are happier than I
For my wife is back in Cairo, down in Mobile I’ve a gal
And there’s many a lovely lady on the T&T Canal
- “On the T&T Canal” (the original lyrics)

All things considered, the preliminary work on the Tennessee and Tombigbee Canal was completed with surprising speed — or perhaps not so surprising, considering how important it was for the republic to have an outlet on the Gulf that it controlled. The fact that there were relatively few (white) property owners along the intended route also helped — both because there was little need to buy anyone out and because the project was not delayed by major landowners seeking to alter the route for their own advantage, as happened often during the planning of the Erie Canal.

The canal route was surveyed over the course of late 1815 and early 1816. The Southern Inland Navigation Company was incorporated in April of ’16, before surveying was even completed. The actual digging began on July 4 of that year — precisely one year before work began on the Erie Canal, which had suffered many delays from political infighting in New York State. Yet, although the T&T Canal was nearly two hundred kilometers shorter than the Erie, it was finished in the same month.

What slowed it down? Two things:
• Construction was shut down for much of 1817 by the war against the Choctaws and Chickasaws. Although Pushmataha and his followers lacked the numbers and firepower to meet the U.S. regular army in the open field, they were experts at irregular attacks against civilians and militiamen. Eventually, however, the Choctaws and Chickasaws were driven into Louisiana.
• Malaria and yellow fever were far more prevalent in the south than in the north. Although the milder winters made it easier to work late in the year, the outbreaks of pestilence made work in the summer nearly impossible. To make matters worse, the coolest part of the day — the time otherwise best suited for work — was the time when mosquitoes were most active, although the connection between mosquitoes and these diseases had not yet been made.

The SINC dealt with this second problem by buying slaves — particularly those deemed too recalcitrant to be of much value elsewhere. Normally, so many willful slaves in the same place at the same time would have been a perfect recipe for disaster. However, on the firm advice of President Adams and Secretary King, the company gave its slaves salaries equal to those of its free workers, which it placed in manumission funds. Slaves who had survived and earned money equal to $10 (later raised to $20) more than their purchase price were freed and rehired as regular salaried workers.

For most of the year, however, the work was shared with large numbers of Italian immigrants fleeing famine and chaos in their homeland. Although many of these men would return to Italy in the 1820s, when they were richer and Italy was at peace, some of them would remain with their families in America, often with anglicized names. Many Venetian gondoliers found ways to apply their skills to the growing network of canals in the American South.

Relations between the Negro and Italian workers were often tense — blacks resented the better working conditions of Italians, while Italians soon realized the quickest route to being accepted as equals by the local English-speaking, Protestant white majority was not to accept the Negro as an equal. In addition, the managers of SINC soon found that an easy way to get a stretch of canal dug quickly was to set a team of Negroes and a team of Italians in competition with one another.

There were, however, some surprising moments of cultural interchange. For example, composer J. F. F. Green[1] would later cite Negro spirituals and work songs as being among his earliest influences. More to the point, Italian-Americans who had been Carbonari in Italy found themselves in sympathy with the plight of the slave — and were only too happy to make common cause with abolitionists, whether they were based in the north or in Florida…
Charles Cerniglia, The Road to The Troubles: The American South, 1800-1840

[1] Joseph Fortune Francis Green, the greatest American composer of the 19th century. His Ode to Freedom (something like a reworked version of the "Anvil Chorus") became the national anthem. (Just to clear up one possible point of confusion, he definitely did not write “On the T&T Canal.”)

 

[stevep]

Lycaon pictus

Interesting. What happens to the freed slaves after the canal is completed? Can't see them being too welcome in the US south and they would very likely have difficulty getting jobs. Could a lot end up in Florida? [Less likely Louisiana as its too damned small for more settlers.

The canal means that the US doesn't need to pass through the Louisiana republic to access the Mississippi but if a war did come they still have to consider a blockade of the canal terminus. Not sure how it will handle the occasional river floods.

Steve

 

[Darth_Kiryan]

And another little nugget of information:

THE (JOHN QUINCY) ADAMS ADMINISTRATION​

PRESIDENT: John Quincy Adams
VICE PRESIDENT: James Monroe

ATTORNEY GENERAL: Smith Thompson (1817-1823), William Wirt (1823-1825)
SECRETARY OF DOMESTIC AFFAIRS: Rufus King
SECRETARY OF THE NAVY: Benjamin William Crowninshield
SECRETARY OF STATE: Henry Clay
SECRETARY OF THE TREASURY: William H. Crawford
SECRETARY OF WAR: Daniel D. Tompkins

Crawford or Clay is next, after Adams, obviously. But with Clay in the Sec of State, he is the definitive heir....could be an interesting future.

I know everyone in that list but the sec of the Navy....never even heard of him. Sounds too British too me to be American.

 

[Lycaon pictus]

Lycaon pictus

Interesting. What happens to the freed slaves after the canal is completed? Can't see them being too welcome in the US south and they would very likely have difficulty getting jobs. Could a lot end up in Florida? [Less likely Louisiana as its too damned small for more settlers.

The canal means that the US doesn't need to pass through the Louisiana republic to access the Mississippi but if a war did come they still have to consider a blockade of the canal terminus. Not sure how it will handle the occasional river floods.

Steve

By the time the T&T is finished, other canals will be under construction. The goal will be to connect the Upper Mississippi and Ohio rivers not just to the Gulf, but to the Atlantic. There will be several termini, including Brunswick, Ga., Savannah and eventually Charleston. Blockading them all will be a bigger job than just occupying Mobile Bay.

As for the freedmen, the President and Domestic Affairs secretary will be quietly arranging land grants out west for those who want to get out while they still have their health.

Crawford or Clay is next, after Adams, obviously. But with Clay in the Sec of State, he is the definitive heir....could be an interesting future.

I know everyone in that list but the sec of the Navy....never even heard of him. Sounds too British too me to be American.

Crowninshield is actually a holdover from the Madison administration. And you're right about Clay.