Rommel Goes East - A WW2 ATL idea.

[Karolus Rex]

The POD is that the German high command manages to convince Hitler to delay Barbarosa until the Axis forces manage control of the Suez. So Rommel goes to the East.

The reason is that the High Command gives him prof that the Soviets have many more divisions than what they thought originally (from what I read the German High Command thought that the Soviets had less than half divisions that those the Red army actually had), forcing barbarosa to be delayed so that they can make a new plan, and at the same time the Italians are more desperate for aid in Greece and North Africa than in OTL. So he decides to send more men to the North Africa Theatre so that they can capture the Suez in an effort to force GB out of the war, so that they can move more men to attack the USSR.

Now my questions are:

• Would you be interested in reading this TL?
• Did someone already made a TL based on something like this?
• And is the POD plausible?

 

[Karolus Rex]

Wrong forum could a mod move this to the right one?

 

[Dathi THorfinnsson]

The POD is that the German high command manages to convince Hitler to delay Barbarosa until the Axis forces manage control of the Suez. So Rommel goes to the East.

The reason is that the High Command gives him prof that the Soviets have many more divisions than what they thought originally (from what I read the German High Command thought that the Soviets had less than half divisions that those the Red army actually had), forcing barbarosa to be delayed so that they can make a new plan, and at the same time the Italians are more desperate for aid in Greece and North Africa than in OTL. So he decides to send more men to the North Africa Theatre so that they can capture the Suez in an effort to force GB out of the war, so that they can move more men to attack the USSR.

Now my questions are:

• Would you be interested in reading this TL?
• Did someone already made a TL based on something like this?
• And is the POD plausible?

3) no

Invading the Soviets was Hitler's idée fixe, and delaying it a year would make it impossible. Well, iOTL, we know it was impossible in the first place, but still. Giving the Soviets time to set up defensive lines in Poland, rebuild the officer corps after the Great Purge, and build T-34s by the thousand, would be so stupid an idea, that even Hitler wouldn't go for it.

Even if he DID decide to provide maximum support to Rommel, most of it can't get there - more ships get sunk on the way to Africa, the men and materiel that Rommel does have can't be supported, the logistics stretch across the desert without decent road or rail, there's little to no fuel or replacement parts, etc., etc.

The the idea that Barbarossa levels of manpower and equipment could suddenly, magically appear in North Africa and let Rommel sweep the Brits out is a fantasy.

 

[ObssesedNuker]

Did someone already made a TL based on something like this?

Yep. It contains a couple of details that one can take issue (for example, I find that the Soviet bounce back is ever so slightly too fast and ignores some seasonal attributes that would freeze the front) with but the overall thrust of it's direction is correct. It does not, suffice to say, end with a decisive German victory over either the Western Allies or the USSR.

 

[kclcmdr]

Have Kessering command the Afrika Korps.. A la motorized infantry.

Let Rommel have the assigned two panzer divisions and one motorized division form an extra tank korp to be assigned to Army Group North to eventually smash his way into Leningrad....

 

[ObssesedNuker]

Let Rommel have the assigned two panzer divisions and one motorized division form an extra tank korp to be assigned to Army Group North to eventually smash his way into Leningrad....

Ugh, this again? The infrastructure and logistical assets simply do not exist to support another panzer corps for AGN. Either Rommel rushes ahead with Reinhardt and Manstein and runs out of fuel in the midst of the pete bog swamps before being subjected to punishing Soviet counterattacks or he follows up behind them and adds to the already sizeable traffic jams before again bogging down in the pete bog swamps south of the city.

 

[riggerrob]

The question is whether Rommel was smart enough to stick to Blitzkrieg doctrine and completely encircle Leningrad before trying to capture the inner city.

Backing up one year ...... would the Brits have allowed Rommel
to capture the Suez Canal intact?
Alternately, how many months would German engineers need to restore the Suez Canal?
How would loss of the Suez Canal reduce trade between England and India?
How much Arab oil would Rommel gain access to?
How much would those new oil sources help Nazi Germany's war effort?

 

[hasdrubal barca]

Ugh, this again? The infrastructure and logistical assets simply do not exist to support another panzer corps for AGN. Either Rommel rushes ahead with Reinhardt and Manstein and runs out of fuel in the midst of the pete bog swamps before being subjected to punishing Soviet counterattacks or he follows up behind them and adds to the already sizeable traffic jams before again bogging down in the pete bog swamps south of the city.

Could Rommel's men be used as reinforcements later in the campaign? Shoring up German position at Tikhvin would make the siege worse. Not to say Leningrad would fall but It could at least give the Germans a better hold.

In essence Hitler actually makes good on his promise:

Russian troops made for Tikhvin, which was located little more than one hundred miles southeast of Leningrad and had been taken by the Germans in mid-November. Two days later, Tikhvin was largely surrounded. Hitler had promised to deliver 100 tanks and more than 20,000 troops, but what the Russians actually encountered were a half-dozen tanks and exhausted men that were freezing. In the face of impossible odds and with 7,000 casualties already lost, German Field Marshal Ritter von Leeb was left with little choice but to abandon Tikhvin to the home country. On December 9, 1941, Red Army forces recaptured the town.

If light of how precarious the overall situation was for Russia, it seems a rather insignificant victory…it’s one town. But it also reopened a major railhead and reduced the road route to Lake Ladoga from nearly 200 miles to just 60. Trucking supplies over the frozen lake had now moved from the realm of “near suicidal” to “feasible”.

For the time being, the victory saved Leningrad. Dmitry Pavlov, Leningrad’s food chief, later wrote, “Without exaggeration, the defeat of the German Fascist forces at Tikhvin and the recapture of the northern railway line up to Mga station saved thousands of people from starvation.”

In his book Absolute War, Chris Bellamy writes, “More than that, the counteroffensive which retook the vital junction at Tikhvin on 9 December 1941 was the first major successful counteroffensive against the Wehrmacht by any combatant in the Second World War.”

The fight for Tikhvin displayed the first chink in the armor of German superiority, and that made the battle a big deal.

https://todayshistorylesson.wordpre...ng-at-tikhvin-gives-soviets-food-for-thought/

How much Arab oil would Rommel gain access to?
How much would those new oil sources help Nazi Germany's war effort?

I don't think Rommel could have taken Egypt. If however we imply he does I think they would find Arab oil very helpful. Philby and Ibn Saud were very opportunistic.....