PODs to get better German panzer units

[Aelita]

One thing that a lot of studies of the Second World War have noted is that in spite of cliches of German efficiency and the quality of German engineering, the German military, particularly mechanized forces, were plagued by terrible logistical inefficiencies and some pretty glaring engineering flaws.

For example, as Richard Overy noted in Why the Allies Won The War, the German army invaded Russia with over 300 different models of trucks and other motor vehicles in their logistical supply train. Each of the Army Groups needed to have one million different types of spare parts.

Many German armored vehicles were plagued with reliability issues, and the final drives of the Tigers and Panthers had some notable issues.

So, what PODs would be necessary to avoid some of these problems?

 

[Elfwine]

I'm not sure on specifics, but you'd have to start at the beginning of the German military build up.

Not being so dependent on foreign vehicles (including tanks and trucks) would be another plus, but how you prevent that is beyond me.

The Third Reich in general sucked pretty hard here.

 

[wolf_brother]

This would appear to be a fundamental structural flaw in the Fascist (Corporatist) state, as you see these same type of inefficiencies crop up in many other fascists states. I would hesitate to say the OP can't be done, or to launch a genre-wide label, but I think an argument could be made that these errors exist due to the state's own history, hierarchy, and ideology in regards to corporations and elitism.

 

[TxCoatl1970]

What everyone else said.
Standardization was anathema for German military production for so many reasons, infighting between various patrons with competing ideas as to the winning strategy, the fact that Nazi Germany was flat-broke and had neither the financial or industrial margin to try fighting anything like the United States or the Soviet Union for more than six months in 1941, but tried to take them both on simultaneously anyway.
It didn't exactly help that they didn't go into full war production until 1943, when the USA and USSR were in full war production and about to bury them, no matter what Wunderwaffe the Germans had in the pipeline.
Blitzkrieg was supposed to be combined arms warfare on the cheap, quick, effective, win the war in six weeks, etc.
I'm not denigrating the technology or fighting technique of the Wehrmacht, but they were in a fight way out of their ability to maintain the initiative and got curb-stomped as their qualitative edge evaporated and their manpower and supply situations just kept worsening. The folks that could be making better tanks were on the front lines, dead, or been captured on the Eastern Front by 1943.

So let's rewind. Let's pretend we have the perfect Albert Speer/ Todt/Gosplan/MITI bootstrap programs to find/make standardized weaponry and logistical train in quantity ready to go the instant Hitler comes to power in 1933.
Militarily, they planned brilliantly. Logistically, they ran into a lot of snags because of the lack of transport and inefficiencies in supplying
formations in motion away from railheads.
Also, pissing away the gift of hundreds of thousands of Soviet POWs willing to turn their guns on Stalin was an act of criminal stupidity. Used properly, they could have taken Moscow and made a buffer state to the Urals and withstood the effects of the first winter campaign to preserve WM troop strength.
Plus, as we've wanked to death, what was a world-beating tank, fighter/U-boat in 1938 was usually obsolete in 1941 and a waste of resources by 1943. That's three versions of whatever to design, prototype, produce, use, refine, and make spare parts for, if you don't go another direction entirely, such as Me-262 jet fighters.

The Germans simply didn't have the money or industrial resources to produce enough good enough tanks/guns/planes to turn the tide once they were in a war of attrition.
Capturing the French, Polish, Czech and Ukrainian industrial areas and capably staffing, retooling, and cranking out whatever the OKW needed in the quantities and qualities demanded were serious obstacles.

 

[Aelita]

What everyone else said.
Standardization was anathema for German military production for so many reasons, infighting between various patrons with competing ideas as to the winning strategy, the fact that Nazi Germany was flat-broke and had neither the financial or industrial margin to try fighting anything like the United States or the Soviet Union for more than six months in 1941, but tried to take them both on simultaneously anyway.
It didn't exactly help that they didn't go into full war production until 1943, when the USA and USSR were in full war production and about to bury them, no matter what Wunderwaffe the Germans had in the pipeline.
Blitzkrieg was supposed to be combined arms warfare on the cheap, quick, effective, win the war in six weeks, etc.
I'm not denigrating the technology or fighting technique of the Wehrmacht, but they were in a fight way out of their ability to maintain the initiative and got curb-stomped as their qualitative edge evaporated and their manpower and supply situations just kept worsening. The folks that could be making better tanks were on the front lines, dead, or been captured on the Eastern Front by 1943.

So let's rewind. Let's pretend we have the perfect Albert Speer/ Todt/Gosplan/MITI bootstrap programs to find/make standardized weaponry and logistical train in quantity ready to go the instant Hitler comes to power in 1933.
Militarily, they planned brilliantly. Logistically, they ran into a lot of snags because of the lack of transport and inefficiencies in supplying
formations in motion away from railheads.
Also, pissing away the gift of hundreds of thousands of Soviet POWs willing to turn their guns on Stalin was an act of criminal stupidity. Used properly, they could have taken Moscow and made a buffer state to the Urals and withstood the effects of the first winter campaign to preserve WM troop strength.
Plus, as we've wanked to death, what was a world-beating tank, fighter/U-boat in 1938 was usually obsolete in 1941 and a waste of resources by 1943. That's three versions of whatever to design, prototype, produce, use, refine, and make spare parts for, if you don't go another direction entirely, such as Me-262 jet fighters.

The Germans simply didn't have the money or industrial resources to produce enough good enough tanks/guns/planes to turn the tide once they were in a war of attrition.
Capturing the French, Polish, Czech and Ukrainian industrial areas and capably staffing, retooling, and cranking out whatever the OKW needed in the quantities and qualities demanded were serious obstacles.

I'm not looking for a German victory though. Just the ways that would result in a better showing. Like, for example, how do we get Albert Speer into a good position in Armaments earlier? Or someone else who might push for more standardization and mitigate the excesses of corporatist inefficiency? I know it's not a silver bullet, obviously.

Geopolitically, I think there are some political PODs that could influence an earlier push to full mobilization for Germany. The general course for my TL, for example, is leaning in that direction, with an American-Soviet revolutionary bloc set on a collision course with a German-Italian-Spanish-Japanese Axis, with rightists in France and Britain chearleeding the Nazis against the great Bolshevik hordes.

 

[Elfwine]

Getting rid of Hitler and having someone not obsessed with building the most lethal military ever yesterday would be good.

Seriously, just developing and rearming at a realistic pace will make things much, much easier.

 

[BlairWitch749]

having guderian be given absolute power over armored vehicle production, training and development, earlier, and more completely would help. Guderian, if in the power position early enough wouldn't have built anything bigger or more complex than the Panzer 4 H

by the way speer sucked at rationalization... the only reason he looks good is because production prior to his taking over was unbelievably god awful, and under his leaderhsip it improved to god awful

 

[Aelita]

having guderian be given absolute power over armored vehicle production, training and development, earlier, and more completely would help. Guderian, if in the power position early enough wouldn't have built anything bigger or more complex than the Panzer 4 H

by the way speer sucked at rationalization... the only reason he looks good is because production prior to his taking over was unbelievably god awful, and under his leaderhsip it improved to god awful

Well, that's a good idea, certainly. Someone who understood the logistics of armored operations making the logistical decisions would be a good start.

And well, understand just how much BS that Speer had to deal with. I wouldn't call him god awful, just average. Which, compared to what came before, makes him look like a god...

 

[Elfwine]

I'm not sure if Guderian is necessary. Even those who are opposed to the so-called "armored idea" (ideal? Must check this to be sure I'm remembering right) - are still better than the mad chaos that happens when the Supreme Leader is insane and his subordinates are picked for reasons other than merit.

But the main reason I'm noting this is that the odds of Guderian being given that kind of authority are pretty poor. Even if the Nazi top leadership is sane, the arguments treating him as an arrogant hothead are loud and persist (and not unfounded).

 

[Markus]

For example, as Richard Overy noted in Why the Allies Won The War, the German army invaded Russia with over 300 different models of trucks and other motor vehicles in their logistical supply train. Each of the Army Groups needed to have one million different types of spare parts.

That has nothing to do with efficiency and the quality of German engineering but with the inability to mass produce enough trucks. That demaded the use of captured trucks.

Many German armored vehicles were plagued with reliability issues, and the final drives of the Tigers and Panthers had some notable issues.

So, what PODs would be necessary to avoid some of these problems?

Bad examples. Both were rushed into production. What was the reliability of the Pz.III and IV? I´d be very surprised if it wasn´t a lot better.

 

[Michael B]

IOr someone else who might push for more standardization and mitigate the excesses of corporatist inefficiency? I know it's not a silver bullet, obviously.

It is worth noting that the Germans were not the only participant in the war who was not particularly standardised. Take the British. Ignoring their use of American equipment they developed three different heavy bombers (Lancaster, Halifax and Stirling) and a range of tanks whilst they tried to sort out unreliability.