Official alternate agricultural practices/technologies Thread

Ethan387 · Feb 23, 2015

In my time here I have noticed a lack of alternate history agricultural (farming) practices in.. Well anything. Maybe it's because most people on here live in cities, but I can't be the only farmer on this site. Most importantly is that if a POD is in 1890 or earlier litteraly everything about our modern day farming practices, from a JD 4020 to strip till and auto steer could be different!

Maybe there's a world without barbed wire, maybe ford never stopped making tractors, maybe cover cropping is as popular as OTL conventional till! Maybe Jonny poppers are only being invented today. Or maybe we have hover tractors power by biodiesel with auto steer accurate to an 8th inch!

Come on there are endless possibilities, so let's get cracking!

Delta Force · Feb 23, 2015

Aeroponics and hydroponics could be quite useful for urban and space based agriculture.

Petike · Feb 23, 2015

Why is this in NPC ?

Ethan387 · Feb 23, 2015

Brand bashing isn't exactly political is it? That's why I didn't put it in chat... is there a different forum I should have considered for this?

araraya · Feb 23, 2015

Ethan387 said:
Brand bashing isn't exa political is it? That's why I didn't put it in chat... is there a different forum I should have considered for this?

I was getting ready to say that pre-1900 would be the best fit but after thinking about it I don't know where you would put this. You are going to have discussions from dates ranging back millenia to the very recent past.

history nerd · Feb 23, 2015

Ethan387 said:
Brand bashing isn't exa political is it? That's why I didn't put it in chat... is there a different forum I should have considered for this?

I would have gone for either pre or post 1900 depending what era you are looking at.

Edit: Go with Pre-1900 as there are already several guys over there who like talking about related subjects and are quite knowledgeable (alternate domestication and whatnot seems to be a fairly popular subject)

araraya · Feb 23, 2015

history nerd said:
I would have gone for either pre or post 1900 depending what era you are looking at.

Edit: Go with Pre-1900 as there are already several guys over there who like talking about related subjects and are quite knowledgeable (alternate domestication and whatnot seems to be a fairly popular subject)

Probably the best bet, he'll just have to create another thread for any post 1900 discussion.

Ethan387 · Feb 23, 2015

Well I mainly meant this thread to be an alternate vehicles/attachments thread but also alternate cattle handling equipment. So I'll move this to after 1900 and start annother in pre 1900 for farming practices. Does that sound good?

Ethan387 · Feb 23, 2015

So mods can you move this to post 1900 then?

Ethan387 · Feb 23, 2015

Hello? Why does this thread need to move when alternate armored fighting vehicles are in NPC?

DG Valdron · Feb 24, 2015

I'd say stop worrying about where you are, and just go for it. Ignore the nit pickers.

In terms of alternate agricultural practices, most of the discussions come down to alternate crops.

Lands of Ice and Mice focuses on lithic mulch agriculture and microclimate engineering, to raise perennial arctic crops - claytonia, sweetvetch and roseroot.

Land of Red and Gold creates agricultural civilizations in Australia, working with perennial dryland crops, notably a hybrid yam and wattle trees.

There's an Atlantis subthread which is based on wetlands/marsh agriculture, using cattails and arrowheads.

There's also a young thread focusing on American Southwest agriculture growing up around the cultivation of mesquite.

I think right now, there's a tentative thread starting up about an earlier domestication of Rice in the African Chad region.

There's been some threads exploring various domestications - Caribou/Reindeer, Moose, Emu, Elephants.

In terms of Agricultural techniques, there's been some look at an earlier acquisition of the horse collar, but that's about it.

Not a lot of discussion on irrigation, raised platform agriculture, the impact of new agricultural tools, etc. etc.

Ethan387 · Feb 24, 2015

Cool, and well if different things are domesticated then you need different equipment to harvest it. That's what this thread is for

Anyone got anything?

Ethan387 · Feb 24, 2015

So, any farmers over here?

riggerrob · Feb 24, 2015

How about domesticating spiders and using their webs instead of silk?

Driftless · Feb 24, 2015

Greater use of Acorns as a food source. Oaks are a relatively common temperate zone tree in the northern hemisphere. Some cultures did make use of the acorn, but nowhere near as wide spread as the trees themselves.

Acorn was a staple food for most of California’s indigenous cultures. It is a rich source of carbohydrate as well as protein, essential amino acids, trace minerals, and vitamins (especially A and C). California Quercus spp range from 3-5% protein, 4-9% fat, and 38-69% carbohydrate.

Some factors limiting use include:

High levels of tannins in some varieties - difficult to digest without adequate preparation.
Competition from many animals that can metabolize acorns
Weevils

However, some varieties of Oaks, such as the White Oak (quercus alba), California Black Oak (quercus kellogii) , along with varieties used by the ancient Greeks, Iberians, and Koreans; were and are more easily utilized with less handling than other varities.

In Pre-Columbian North America, a POD might be acquiring a better management method such as used by California indians:

Unlike many other plant foods, acorns do not need to be eaten or processed right away, but may be stored for a long time, much as squirrels do. In years that oaks produced many acorns, Native Americans sometimes collected enough acorns to store for two years as insurance against poor acorn production years.

After drying them in the sun to discourage mold and germination, women took acorns back to their villages and cached them in hollow trees or structures on poles, to keep them safe from mice and squirrels. The stored acorns could then be used when needed, particularly during the winter when other resources were scarce. Those acorns that germinated in the fall were shelled and pulverized before those that germinate in spring. Because of their high fat content, stored acorns can become rancid. Molds may also grow on them.

Native North Americans took an active and sophisticated role in managing acorn resources by using fire, which increased the production of acorns and made them easier to collect.[citation needed] The lighting of ground fires killed the larvae of acorn moths and acorn weevils by burning them during their dormancy period in the soil. The pests can infest and consume more than 95% of an oak's acorns.

Fires also released the nutrients bound in dead leaves and other plant debris into the soil, thus fertilizing oak trees while clearing the ground to make acorn collection easier. Most North American oaks tolerate light fires, especially when consistent burning has eliminated woody fuel accumulation around their trunks. Consistent burning encouraged oak growth at the expense of other trees less tolerant of fire, thus keeping oaks dominant in the landscapes.

Oaks produce more acorns when they are not too close to other oaks and thus competing with them for sunlight, water and soil nutrients. The fires tended to eliminate the more vulnerable young oaks and leave old oaks which created open oak savannas with trees ideally spaced to maximize acorn production.

Jonathan Edelstein · Feb 24, 2015

Ethan387 said:
maybe cover cropping is as popular as OTL conventional till!

Not a farmer, but since you mentioned cover cropping, how could we make anti-erosion practices popular in time to prevent the Dust Bowl? Was there an earlier time when the need for such practices might have been realized and dryland farmers educated about them? Are there techniques that were feasible in the 30s and were better than those actually used at the time?

Whitewings · Feb 24, 2015

riggerrob said:
How about domesticating spiders and using their webs instead of silk?

It's been tried. The largest piece of spider silk in the world today is just under 9 yards of fabric, took four years and over 80 workers. That was using wild spiders. Farming spiders (it's been tried) is far more labour intensive than simply going out to catch them.

Driftless · Feb 24, 2015

Jonathan Edelstein said:
Not a farmer, but since you mentioned cover cropping, how could we make anti-erosion practices popular in time to prevent the Dust Bowl? Was there an earlier time when the need for such practices might have been realized and dryland farmers educated about them? Are there techniques that were feasible in the 30s and were better than those actually used at the time?

Coon Creek Watershed (Vernon County, Wisconsin) - 1933 Conservation Project - one of the very first large scale conservation/erosion control projects in the US

This is close to my home area - low, but very steep sided hills and bluffs, home to many small dairy farms. The area is highly suceptible to water erosion. The project has paid incalculable dividends for the seventy plus years since it's start. Small farms (usually much less than a square mile) are still a major land use. It's also home to some of the best trout streams in the Midwest - a testament to overall conservation techniques.

*edit* All of those conservation techniques were 20th century developments though. Prior to that, it was too often the human version of locusts stripping the landscape clean and moving on.

Ethan387 · Feb 24, 2015

Jonathan Edelstein said:
Not a farmer, but since you mentioned cover cropping, how could we make anti-erosion practices popular in time to prevent the Dust Bowl? Was there an earlier time when the need for such practices might have been realized and dryland farmers educated about them? Are there techniques that were feasible in the 30s and were better than those actually used at the time?

Maybe for POD number one, have john Deere not invent the stainless steel plow in 1837, deep plowing never comes widespread. Farmers look for other ways to break up the soil deeply. Someone invents the coulter disk 50 years earlier and tillage radish or something else is engineered to break up the hard pan and soon tillage is no longer needed because of the no till drill and a plans doing deep tillage instead of long hours plowing.

That's what I got anyway. Also if a POD in this is later than 1900 by all means post it anyway!

midnight77 · Feb 25, 2015

What about the widespread adoption of the foot plow in antiquity? The Incas only invented it in 1600, and it's perfect for societies without draft animals.