In a scenario where the KMT crushed the Chinese Communists in TTL's Chinese Civil War (assume there is a truncated PRC-in-Manchuria as a "reverse Taiwan" of sorts), how would the military of the Republic of China develop? What would military doctrine of the RoC military be? How would the Republic of China Armed Forces ITTL compare to the People's Liberation Army IOTL?
Military of a victorious KMT China?
- Thread starter Whiteshore
- Start date
What about the development of the Chinese Navy? Would the RoCN be better or worse than OTL's PLAN?
marathag
Banned
With China in the SEATO orbit, doesn't need much to keep a handle on the Soviets during the ColdWar, so mostly ASW and the rest Coastguard. However, if the economy supports it, way want larger surface units for prestige, so may get some cruisers up to an refurb Essex or two.
If this China is interested in shipbuilding, may steal some of what Japan and the South Korea had for a market in that for tankers and later container ships.
Or an ex-British CVL (the Dutch, Indians, French, Brazilians, and Argentines IIRC operated ex-British CVLs at one point or another).
Last edited:
Per the below the Nationalists got a fair amount of surplus equipment after World War II.
So, I would expect that the RoC Navy would start off with surplus US and British ships supplemented by captured Japanese equipment.
As the surplus stuff wears out the Nationalists will probably produce more equipment locally, still supplemented by US and other Allied equipment.
The tensions with North China (PRC) and the Soviet Union will determine the size and composition of the military and air forces the RoC will need for it's borders and internal security.
The Navy will be smaller for coast defense and possibly a coast guard for law enforcement including river patrols.
ENS Ibrahim el-Awal: captured at sea
HMS Mendip, a British WWII destroyer, served in four navies after the war and saw combat in two wars, including being captured on the high seas, certainly a rarity in the modern era. (HMS Mendip s…
wwiiafterwwii.wordpress.com
WWII weapons in Shanghai: VJ Day to 1949
During the 19th and early 20th centuries, Shanghai was famous as China’s international city, a busy trade port with notorious underworld . During the latter part of the 20th century, the city…
wwiiafterwwii.wordpress.com
BlackDragon98
Banned
Depends if the ChiComs are completely gone or there are 2 Chinas.
A united China will have a bigger military than OTL, unless Chiang does something like the Cultural Revolution or some other crazy purge that will set China back by 15-20 years.
A united China will have a bigger military than OTL, unless Chiang does something like the Cultural Revolution or some other crazy purge that will set China back by 15-20 years.
Without PRC China there is likely no stalemate in Korea, if a war in Korea even happens. Even if it does a Manchurian PRC rump state is unlikely to be able to deploy the force necessary to push back UN forces and guard it's border against the RoC who will be looking to finish the job. With the RoC almost certainly becoming a US ally to contain communism in Asia, there is likely no Japanese rearmament. This will reduce feeling in RoC for the need to compete with their old rivals in the naval sphere.
The RoC military will be heavily tilted to building up a massive mechanized land force to protect it's frontier with Soviet aligned Manchuria, and Mongolia, later there will be serious mountain and airmobile forces to defend the western frontier with the USSR. The RoC will also be in range of pretty much all the Russian strategic airforce, which will want as a target since China is big enough that industries in the south will out of range (at least initially) from being threatened by soviet land forces. Thus the RoC will need to also invest in a mdoern interceptor force, along with frontal aviation and tactical air of it's own. Even with heavy US development aid it is not going to have many resources left after building that military and funding industrial development to also develop a large navy.
That said RoC is likely to want some kind of navy for prestige reasons. I would expect a large amount of surplus American ships. Initially this will mean a big batch of old WWII destroyers and some Brooklyn class cruisers. (Probably Savannah and Honolulu since they got scrapped instead of being sold.) They might alter augment this with a British built CVL (likely Leviathan) for a token carrier capability, though I don't see this as being maintained for very long. Most likely dumped in late 70s when the aircraft that fit on them become obsolete, though by this time the Chinese economy might have improved enough to snag some harriers. Leviathan could get a refit to operate them or be swapped for Hermes or a domestically built Invincible type ship. Meanwhile the escort fleet will likely have grown to help the US pacific fleet out with the Soviet Far East navy. More US surplus ships , perhaps combined with some domestically built types. Probably a lot of Perry clones along with a bunch of Spruance type air defence destroyers to replace the old cruisers. The one significant place of investment may be in conventionally powered submarines which would have the mission of hunting down their soviet counterparts in the sea of Japan and protecting Chinese coastal waters. Most of these are probably bought from British and French yards, though later on there might be domestic models too.
Despite maintaining a modest blue water force, the RoC Navywould probably have a significant littoral component of missile boats and fast attack craft with which to contest the Bohai and yellow seas with the PRC'S naval forces.
The RoC military will be heavily tilted to building up a massive mechanized land force to protect it's frontier with Soviet aligned Manchuria, and Mongolia, later there will be serious mountain and airmobile forces to defend the western frontier with the USSR. The RoC will also be in range of pretty much all the Russian strategic airforce, which will want as a target since China is big enough that industries in the south will out of range (at least initially) from being threatened by soviet land forces. Thus the RoC will need to also invest in a mdoern interceptor force, along with frontal aviation and tactical air of it's own. Even with heavy US development aid it is not going to have many resources left after building that military and funding industrial development to also develop a large navy.
That said RoC is likely to want some kind of navy for prestige reasons. I would expect a large amount of surplus American ships. Initially this will mean a big batch of old WWII destroyers and some Brooklyn class cruisers. (Probably Savannah and Honolulu since they got scrapped instead of being sold.) They might alter augment this with a British built CVL (likely Leviathan) for a token carrier capability, though I don't see this as being maintained for very long. Most likely dumped in late 70s when the aircraft that fit on them become obsolete, though by this time the Chinese economy might have improved enough to snag some harriers. Leviathan could get a refit to operate them or be swapped for Hermes or a domestically built Invincible type ship. Meanwhile the escort fleet will likely have grown to help the US pacific fleet out with the Soviet Far East navy. More US surplus ships , perhaps combined with some domestically built types. Probably a lot of Perry clones along with a bunch of Spruance type air defence destroyers to replace the old cruisers. The one significant place of investment may be in conventionally powered submarines which would have the mission of hunting down their soviet counterparts in the sea of Japan and protecting Chinese coastal waters. Most of these are probably bought from British and French yards, though later on there might be domestic models too.
Despite maintaining a modest blue water force, the RoC Navywould probably have a significant littoral component of missile boats and fast attack craft with which to contest the Bohai and yellow seas with the PRC'S naval forces.
BlackDragon98
Banned
A united KMT China that's as big as OTL China might possibly buy the Avro Arrow.
The plane was an ideal interceptor and specifically designed to defeat Soviet planes.
Looks like Canada's aviation industry might survive.
The plane was an ideal interceptor and specifically designed to defeat Soviet planes.
Looks like Canada's aviation industry might survive.
marathag
Banned
Nehru won't be able to play footsie with the USSR if the RoC is solid with the USA and expects things to turn out well for him
The scenario assumes that a PRC-in-Manchuria exists as a "reverse Taiwan".
oof, China will likely remain mostly foreign-equipped (in terms of sophisticated stuff like tanks and planes, I'm sure Hanyang will slap together a Garand clone in due time) until the 60s in that case, as Manchuria was the most industrialized part of pre-war china by a significant margin.
And that likely means the NATO-ization of the RoC's military.
BlackDragon98
Banned
Then the NRA will be less powerful than the OTL PLA.
All the industrial complexes and raw materials will be unavailable to them as the USSR will leave them for the ChiComs.