Map Thread XX
- Thread starter Balkanized U.S.A
- Start date
- Status
soviet_killer
Banned
I mean, I did say that by the later half of the 21st century they start turning even non-citizens into "pure" citizens using genemodding, hence why all education is the same all across the populations. And I mean, slavery isn't really used. More like 'forced labour' or 'Redemption' if going with the theocratic vibe. And I mean, every up has its downs, so yeah. And by egalitarian I mostly mean that between the genders there are no inequalities.
soviet_killer
Banned
well, depends. Just like the Draka, they don't hold Europeans in much of a higher regard, regardless of their skin color. Just that they didn't get to Europe yet.
I guess the POD would be that England continuous being under the Danish crown.
But to be honest I had no real idea what the POD would be.
X-Post from the MOTF 231.
An Examination of the Plague Outbreak of 529 in the Republic of Kootenai.
The outbreak of the Plague in the Republic of Kootenai in the year of Divine Flame 529 was a major shock to the Kaskadin region. It is thought that the Plague had originally come from the Republic of Yukon in the north, but now it is thought that it might have originated from a virus frozen in the rapidly melting glacial ice. The Plague first hit the town of Bonner, where it wiped out 4/5th of the population. News spread just about as fast as the virus. The (at that time) small town of Spoakann locked down early, utilizing soldiers from the nearby Fort Alvey to blockade anything coming from Cordalane or farther north, which ended up sparing much of the town's population. Everything east of Spoakann was hit hard by the plague, leaving multiple towns and villages with either half or their entire populations. The residents of Bonner would eventually move to Sanpoint and the 743 residents of Fort Callis would eventually be transfered to Fort Alvey. The death over half of the population would eventually lead to the Republic of Kootenai to be conquered by the Governorship of Walla'allah, a neo-republican state that stretched from the city of Walla'allah to the small town of Rosalia, in the year of Divine Flame 592. The town of Bonner would become abandoned in 536 and Fort Callis would eventually be formed into a small settlement between Sanpoint and Cordalane in 585.
The now province of Kootanei would eventually bounce back from the devastation that the plague brought with it. By the year of the Divine Flame 665, the region was experiencing prosperity, being one of the major trade route stops on the Maple Highway brought lots of money into the city, and a cultural renaissance with an explosion of artistic works either rediscovered or being written anew. The Plague of 529 would feature heavily in the works, being the focal point of at least 4 plays, 2 novels, a plethora of short stories, and multiple neo-folk songs.
I'm planning to try and consolidate everything I have for this series into a single public thread at some point (tentatively scheduled for April 21, but probably not), but at the moment all there is out here in any kind of organized sense is my other posts in this thread.
Very nice. Although now I wonder about its neighbors, and whether it's done any colonizing in the Americas. (And if so, whether said colonies are just as Balkanized). Who's bulging into central Russia? Is it some sort of independent "East Russia", or just those darn Tatars?
Working on something Game of Thrones/ASOIAF related. Using a basemap by @targy793, who may not be on the site anymore. The basis is a fusion of Show and Book, taking many things from book lore but arriving at a similar ending as seen in the show. This is a map that will feature the Kingdom of the North present at the end of the show. Given that 7 is a holy number (so much so that when Dorne joined as an 8th kingdom, it was still called the Seven Kingdoms) rather than call it the 6 Kingdoms, they simply formally count Dorne as the 7th Kingdom to offset the loss of the North and help build an identity that accepts Northern independence.
As I couldn't fit every house on here, and Westeros has a very vague hierarchy of houses, I opted for a "dominant House" system, based in lands a vassal House directly controls and lands of other Houses who defer to them (though all are pledged to House Stark).
As for what's going in the "The Beyond" (the new name for the Land of Always Winter now that it's... well not always winter anymore), I'm torn on which sigil to use to represent the children of Jon Snow, who I have dominating the still confederated clans of the Free Folk. As the only Westerosi nobility amongst them, they not only have their father's willpower and strength, but maintain connections to those in the 'South' who supported Jon Snow as a ruler (despite his own wishes)... I'm torn between a Blackfyre style inversion of the Stark sigil with a red eye for Ghost, or a Targaryen inspired sigil with a Ghost-inspired colorscheme, as I feel they would not be so hesitant to call themselves Targaryens since Daenerys is still a positive figure amongst the Freefolk.
Said informal 'House' still needs a name though, and beyond puns like House Whitefang and House Targstark, the best I've got right now is House Whitefyre, House Freestark, House Whitewolf, or House Freedragon.
I might be cutting the restored House Bolton (whose sigil I made by fusing show and book) with the idea that rather than let House Karstark and House Thenn contest Karhold, House Thenn is granted rule of the Dreadfort. It's an idea but honestly I'm just not sure who would replace House Bolton beyond House Thenn. The current restored House Bolton idea is to have it led by "Theon Bolton", the son of Jeyne Poole and (possibly) Ramsay Bolton, who seeks to restore the House's honor. My way of making show and book reconcile in regards to who marries Ramsay is that Ramsay marries Jeyne, but discovers who she is in this timeline, before marrying Sansa in a deal with Littlefinger. Sansa pleads for Jeyne to be spared, only resulting in her being tortured, before both Jeyne and Sansa are rescued by Theon.
Assuming Jeyne is pregnant, there is a chance the baby is that of a Bolton soldier or of Ramsay, but for the purposes of bringing the remaining Bolton vassals and the smallfolk of the region into the fold, Queen Sansa gives the Dreadfort to Jeyne and House Poole with the notion that her son will be a Bolton and heir to the lands, to help bring more legitimacy to Sansa's reign. Buuuuut... Jeyne aborting her pregnancy makes sense given what she dealt with, so maybe just give it to House Thenn or Cassel. I'm thinking about it.
As I couldn't fit every house on here, and Westeros has a very vague hierarchy of houses, I opted for a "dominant House" system, based in lands a vassal House directly controls and lands of other Houses who defer to them (though all are pledged to House Stark).
As for what's going in the "The Beyond" (the new name for the Land of Always Winter now that it's... well not always winter anymore), I'm torn on which sigil to use to represent the children of Jon Snow, who I have dominating the still confederated clans of the Free Folk. As the only Westerosi nobility amongst them, they not only have their father's willpower and strength, but maintain connections to those in the 'South' who supported Jon Snow as a ruler (despite his own wishes)... I'm torn between a Blackfyre style inversion of the Stark sigil with a red eye for Ghost, or a Targaryen inspired sigil with a Ghost-inspired colorscheme, as I feel they would not be so hesitant to call themselves Targaryens since Daenerys is still a positive figure amongst the Freefolk.
Said informal 'House' still needs a name though, and beyond puns like House Whitefang and House Targstark, the best I've got right now is House Whitefyre, House Freestark, House Whitewolf, or House Freedragon.
I might be cutting the restored House Bolton (whose sigil I made by fusing show and book) with the idea that rather than let House Karstark and House Thenn contest Karhold, House Thenn is granted rule of the Dreadfort. It's an idea but honestly I'm just not sure who would replace House Bolton beyond House Thenn. The current restored House Bolton idea is to have it led by "Theon Bolton", the son of Jeyne Poole and (possibly) Ramsay Bolton, who seeks to restore the House's honor. My way of making show and book reconcile in regards to who marries Ramsay is that Ramsay marries Jeyne, but discovers who she is in this timeline, before marrying Sansa in a deal with Littlefinger. Sansa pleads for Jeyne to be spared, only resulting in her being tortured, before both Jeyne and Sansa are rescued by Theon.
Assuming Jeyne is pregnant, there is a chance the baby is that of a Bolton soldier or of Ramsay, but for the purposes of bringing the remaining Bolton vassals and the smallfolk of the region into the fold, Queen Sansa gives the Dreadfort to Jeyne and House Poole with the notion that her son will be a Bolton and heir to the lands, to help bring more legitimacy to Sansa's reign. Buuuuut... Jeyne aborting her pregnancy makes sense given what she dealt with, so maybe just give it to House Thenn or Cassel. I'm thinking about it.
maybe I'm crazy, but how about this - A three-headed white wolf with red eye spewing flame on a black field
Hated this part of show, it doesn´t make much sense to me, from the pov of Littlefinger (heh, when I thought about it, from the point of Boltons too) nor from the pov of storytelling (being wedded and tyrannised by psychotic "prince"...? again??
)... but there were much more things I didn´t like about show, especially later (not that I watched last season)Otherwise, map is nice!
I guess that North will stay unstable, however - grudges among wildlings and "southerners" won´t die easy and quickly, and since there is now nothing to separate them... On the other hand, it gives more strenght to the Starks, as long as they are able not let things escalate too much (I bet that at least Sansa or whoever is northern ruler, will be able)
And Stark/Targaryen cadet branch right beyond the borders (hehe) may became problem too (not under Jon, I guess, but in one, two generations, who knows...
By the way, if is (north) Westeros climate getting warmer, we may see some sort of colonisation in nort, or even Beyond? Either from southern parts of North, from Seven/Six kingdoms or from Essos? Hell, even if climate stay the same, there are still heavy losses after wars and invasions, so potentially some space for newcomers from more populous parts of world...
@BMN bwahaha, sounds cool. The house could be named "monster-wolf" - which seems stupid to me, but something less stupid along this line could work?
That could work. I might bust out the Book version of the Stark sigil for that.
Oh yeah it was unbearably stupid and countrary to his plans for Sansa. I’m just trying to find a way to reconcile the Show and Book. It totally doesn’t fit his MO either, since Littlefinger seeks to destabilize rather than stabilize.Hated this part of show, it doesn´t make much sense to me, from the pov of Littlefinger (heh, when I thought about it, from the point of Boltons too) nor from the pov of storytelling (being wedded and tyrannised by psychotic "prince"...? again??
Otherwise, map is nice!
I guess that North will stay unstable, however - grudges among wildlings and "southerners" won´t die easy and quickly, and since there is now nothing to separate them... On the other hand, it gives more strenght to the Starks, as long as they are able not let things escalate too much (I bet that at least Sansa or whoever is northern ruler, will be able)
And Stark/Targaryen cadet branch right beyond the borders (hehe) may became problem too (not under Jon, I guess, but in one, two generations, who knows...
By the way, if is (north) Westeros climate getting warmer, we may see some sort of colonisation in nort, or even Beyond? Either from southern parts of North, from Seven/Six kingdoms or from Essos? Hell, even if climate stay the same, there are still heavy losses after wars and invasions, so potentially some space for newcomers from more populous parts of world...
@BMN bwahaha, sounds cool. The house could be named "monster-wolf" - which seems stupid to me, but something less stupid along this line could work?
An idea is Littlefinger intends for Sansa to decry in front of other northern lords that “Arya” is in fact Jeyne, and thus ruining Roose’s attempt to usurp the North via bloodties. Yada yada yada, things go wrong, and Sansa ends up a Bolton hostage while Baelish escapes. Maybe Sansa came willingly so long as Jeyne was to be spared. Ramsay is the kind of sick bastard to “honor his word” and not kill Jeyne, but instead subject her to torture for Sansa to watch.
Anyways, I’m very much leaning on the North being unstable. The map is in-fact going to be for a future civil war in the North, with the new Seven Kingdoms happily sitting back and letting the North suffer the consequences of freedom.
Great map, what's the climate like? Is Octana like Antarctica or is the climate generally warmer?
Octana IS like Antarctica, i plan to name the continents after stars or greek Gods, Geminia is more like North America, Callia is more like Australia, Aries is More like Eastern China.
Courtesy of u/jjpamsterdam from Reddit, a series of maps depicting the Confederation of American States (Confederatie van Amerikaanse Staaten): an American union formed between a Dutch-speaking north and an English-speaking south. More than a dozen maps and graphics have been made for this series; don't want to clutter the thread too much, though, so I've picked out four of the best maps. The rest are listed below, with both thread and direct image links.
The First Anglo-Dutch War happens, just as OTL. After the end of the war the Self-Government in New Netherland, that was repealed at the start of this war, is re-established in 1654.
The British nations fall into civil unrest following Oliver Cromwell’s death in 1658 as his son Richard is not competent enough to retain the power of the Lord Protector. Charles II doesn’t return to England in 1660.
Due to internal unrest in the British nations, the Second Anglo-Dutch War is more decisive. The Treaty of Breda looks a bit different and readjusts several colonial borders. This includes readjustments to the colonial borders in North America, setting the border at the Versche Rivier (Connecticut River), establishing the small colony of Connetikock with mixed English, Dutch and French settlers already present. The Dutch obviously hold on to New Netherlands and also gain recognition for their rule over the territory of New Sweden (Nieuw-Zweden). With a significant Lutheran Swedish (and Finnish) population there, the New Netherland administration decides to set up a separate colonial administration there, allowing for local autonomy, although the language of administration remains Dutch in both of these colonies.
The unrest in the British nations only ends after William of Orange becomes King of England, Ireland and Scotland in 1689. Mary II doesn’t die from Smallpox in 1694. Instead of several miscarriages William and Mary have several children. The Dutch and British remain politically aligned for the next century.
The French and Indian War still takes place, but this time pits the French against a joint Anglo-Dutch front in North America. Just as OTL, the superior navy cuts off the French from effectively reinforcing their troops in North America. Eventually the Anglo-Dutch alliance occupies New France. The territories south of the Ottawa river is handed over to the Dutch, the area north and east of that river is handed over to the British. The British create the new (mostly French-speaking) colony of Quebec. The Dutch set up a new colony of Merenland (“Land of Lakes”) in what is known as Southern Ontario OTL. The boundary between British and Dutch zones of influence further west is defined as the Ohio river, although neither side of the river is densely populated (by Europeans) at this point in time.
In the years following the French and Indian War, the British and Dutch governments want to share the cost burden with the American colonies, leading to growing unrest there. Much like OTL, the colonies are declared in rebellion and troops are dispatched to restore order. This takes place in both the British and Dutch colonies, although with different levels of intensity. The British colonial forces manage to hold on to most of the areas in New England and Quebec, but lose power over the southern colonies. The Dutch also lose control over most of their holdings in North America. By the early 1790s and due to the French Revolutionary Wars the British and Dutch can’t afford to continue the conflict in North America. The colonies of New Netherland, Connetikock, New Sweden, Merenland, Chesapeake (Virginia, plus what’s left of Maryland), North Carolina , South Carolina and Georgia are recognised as independent. Resistance to British rule continues in New England, but many supporters of independence start moving into the newly independent states to the south and west.
The Continental Coordination Council, which had previously led the war effort against the colonial powers, comes together in 1792 to agree on the Articles of Confederation, forming the Confederation of American States (Confederatie van Amerikaanse Staaten). The individual states retain internal autonomy, especially in terms of language (English or Dutch), their religious policy (Puritan, Reformed, Lutheran, etc.) and the economic model (pre-industrial or plantation-based). The area to the west is subject to overlapping claims from different states but is in practice largely administered as territory. Areas north of the Ohio river generally have Dutch-speaking administrations, whereas territories further south are English-speaking.
In a different version of the War of 1812, the Confederation of American States fights the British for control over North America. The British believe this to be a minor theatre of the Napoleonic Wars. The Americans see it as the first time to truly assert their new sovereignty. The official casus belli is the impressment of New Englanders into British military service, despite the previous peace treaty granting them an exemption from this duty to the crown. The significant number of New Englander exiles living in the Confederation are also a factor, pushing their new home states for a liberation of the provinces that also rebelled against colonial rule but ultimately were retained by the British.
The war is quite similar to OTL, as the British simply lack the numbers in North America and have to rely heavily on Native American allies. On the flipside, the American militia forces are disorganised and can hardly sustain much of an offensive operation. Contrary to what New England exiles want to make, the American government believe the independence movement from Massachusetts to Maine is much weaker than in the late 18th century. Many New Englanders strongly opposed to the crown have already moved south and west. The reminder of the population is largely apolitical, with independentists not numerous enough for a major uprising. Additionally, the mostly Catholic Frenchmen in Quebec are also not too keen to become part of the strongly Protestant Confederation.
In the end, the war ends with a draw and no border changes. Both sides can claim symbolic victories. The British manage to seriously threaten the capital of the Confederation in Christina. The Americans can claim a major victory in the newly-acquired Louisiana towards the very end of the war. The main losers of the conflict are the Native Americans, whom Britain no longer regards as worthwhile allies, instead focusing their efforts on empire-building in other regions of the world.
In the years before and during the war, several new states were formed and admitted to the Confederation. This follows a decision by the Council of the Confederation to rescind all existing States’ claims on territories further west and allow emerging States there to apply for membership. The balance between English- and Dutch-speaking states as well as (some time later) between industrial- and plantation-based economies in these new states will lead to further conflict. For now, all new western States north of the Ohio river are Dutch-speaking and all States south of it are English-speaking.
Louisiana, the southernmost portion of the territory acquired from France, is also admitted with French being the official language there, but English becoming more prominent in practice with southern settlers moving in. For now it remains the Confederation's only officially French-speaking state.
Admitting Vermont - a state with a mixed population and many French and Dutch speakers in an officially English-speaking state - was solved by compromise. Vermont never formally decided on an official language. In practice this means that English, French and Dutch are used to different degrees throughout the State for now.
The language map illustrates the spread of European languages in the CAS, as of 1860. As in OTL, the issue of slavery is leading to a showdown between the Southern states, which rely on plantation-based economies, and the more industrialised North. The majority of immigration, mainly German, Polish and Irish at this point, went into the north and passed through Nieuw Amsterdam. This is reflected in the more “spotty” Dutch in the northern states, compared to the solid blue in the south. German immigrants in particular have an easy time picking up the new language, though, as it’s quite close to what they natively speak.
There has been some migration towards the western coast, mainly starting in western Mizoeri and following a few semi-established trails. The two new western states of Schuyler and Washington (located in OTL California) are a last-ditch effort to find a compromise in the slavery issue by extending the Ohio Line all the way to the Pacific, finally admitting Washington as a slave state and Schuyler as a free state in 1858. After being admitted as a state, the House and Senate of Washington immediately set forth to abolish slavery there, as the majority of voters there are opposed to the institution, despite there being very few slaves in the state at this point. They succeed in 1859, amending Washington’s constitution and leading to ever-worsening tension between free and slave states.
In this timeline, the additional issue of language adds to the difference in culture between the states. Although the division is not as clear, with English-speaking abolitionists in Vermont or Washington and Dutch-speaking proponents of slavery in Mizoeri or (parts of) Texas, the line can generally also be drawn according to the language.
- Alternate North American Independence: A Multilingual Confederation of American States (1792) - Map
- Languages and Ethnic Background (1792) - Map
- Flag Ideas - Flags: 1 / 2 / 3 / 4
- Alternate War of 1812 - Political Map / War Map
- Territorial Development (1854) - Map
- Railroads and Population (1860) - Map / Population & Flags
- European Languages Spoken (1860) - Map
- Civil War (1861) - Maps & Writeup: 1 / 2 / 3
- Civil War (1862-1863) - Maps & Writeup: 1 / 2 / 3
- Civil War (1863) - Maps & Writeup: 1 / 2 / 3
- Civil War (1864-1865) - Maps & Writeup: 1 / 2 / 3 / 4
- Westward Expansion (1770-1870) - Map
- Map of New Netherland (Contemporary - Google Maps style) - Map
The First Anglo-Dutch War happens, just as OTL. After the end of the war the Self-Government in New Netherland, that was repealed at the start of this war, is re-established in 1654.
The British nations fall into civil unrest following Oliver Cromwell’s death in 1658 as his son Richard is not competent enough to retain the power of the Lord Protector. Charles II doesn’t return to England in 1660.
Due to internal unrest in the British nations, the Second Anglo-Dutch War is more decisive. The Treaty of Breda looks a bit different and readjusts several colonial borders. This includes readjustments to the colonial borders in North America, setting the border at the Versche Rivier (Connecticut River), establishing the small colony of Connetikock with mixed English, Dutch and French settlers already present. The Dutch obviously hold on to New Netherlands and also gain recognition for their rule over the territory of New Sweden (Nieuw-Zweden). With a significant Lutheran Swedish (and Finnish) population there, the New Netherland administration decides to set up a separate colonial administration there, allowing for local autonomy, although the language of administration remains Dutch in both of these colonies.
The unrest in the British nations only ends after William of Orange becomes King of England, Ireland and Scotland in 1689. Mary II doesn’t die from Smallpox in 1694. Instead of several miscarriages William and Mary have several children. The Dutch and British remain politically aligned for the next century.
The French and Indian War still takes place, but this time pits the French against a joint Anglo-Dutch front in North America. Just as OTL, the superior navy cuts off the French from effectively reinforcing their troops in North America. Eventually the Anglo-Dutch alliance occupies New France. The territories south of the Ottawa river is handed over to the Dutch, the area north and east of that river is handed over to the British. The British create the new (mostly French-speaking) colony of Quebec. The Dutch set up a new colony of Merenland (“Land of Lakes”) in what is known as Southern Ontario OTL. The boundary between British and Dutch zones of influence further west is defined as the Ohio river, although neither side of the river is densely populated (by Europeans) at this point in time.
In the years following the French and Indian War, the British and Dutch governments want to share the cost burden with the American colonies, leading to growing unrest there. Much like OTL, the colonies are declared in rebellion and troops are dispatched to restore order. This takes place in both the British and Dutch colonies, although with different levels of intensity. The British colonial forces manage to hold on to most of the areas in New England and Quebec, but lose power over the southern colonies. The Dutch also lose control over most of their holdings in North America. By the early 1790s and due to the French Revolutionary Wars the British and Dutch can’t afford to continue the conflict in North America. The colonies of New Netherland, Connetikock, New Sweden, Merenland, Chesapeake (Virginia, plus what’s left of Maryland), North Carolina , South Carolina and Georgia are recognised as independent. Resistance to British rule continues in New England, but many supporters of independence start moving into the newly independent states to the south and west.
The Continental Coordination Council, which had previously led the war effort against the colonial powers, comes together in 1792 to agree on the Articles of Confederation, forming the Confederation of American States (Confederatie van Amerikaanse Staaten). The individual states retain internal autonomy, especially in terms of language (English or Dutch), their religious policy (Puritan, Reformed, Lutheran, etc.) and the economic model (pre-industrial or plantation-based). The area to the west is subject to overlapping claims from different states but is in practice largely administered as territory. Areas north of the Ohio river generally have Dutch-speaking administrations, whereas territories further south are English-speaking.
In a different version of the War of 1812, the Confederation of American States fights the British for control over North America. The British believe this to be a minor theatre of the Napoleonic Wars. The Americans see it as the first time to truly assert their new sovereignty. The official casus belli is the impressment of New Englanders into British military service, despite the previous peace treaty granting them an exemption from this duty to the crown. The significant number of New Englander exiles living in the Confederation are also a factor, pushing their new home states for a liberation of the provinces that also rebelled against colonial rule but ultimately were retained by the British.
The war is quite similar to OTL, as the British simply lack the numbers in North America and have to rely heavily on Native American allies. On the flipside, the American militia forces are disorganised and can hardly sustain much of an offensive operation. Contrary to what New England exiles want to make, the American government believe the independence movement from Massachusetts to Maine is much weaker than in the late 18th century. Many New Englanders strongly opposed to the crown have already moved south and west. The reminder of the population is largely apolitical, with independentists not numerous enough for a major uprising. Additionally, the mostly Catholic Frenchmen in Quebec are also not too keen to become part of the strongly Protestant Confederation.
In the end, the war ends with a draw and no border changes. Both sides can claim symbolic victories. The British manage to seriously threaten the capital of the Confederation in Christina. The Americans can claim a major victory in the newly-acquired Louisiana towards the very end of the war. The main losers of the conflict are the Native Americans, whom Britain no longer regards as worthwhile allies, instead focusing their efforts on empire-building in other regions of the world.
In the years before and during the war, several new states were formed and admitted to the Confederation. This follows a decision by the Council of the Confederation to rescind all existing States’ claims on territories further west and allow emerging States there to apply for membership. The balance between English- and Dutch-speaking states as well as (some time later) between industrial- and plantation-based economies in these new states will lead to further conflict. For now, all new western States north of the Ohio river are Dutch-speaking and all States south of it are English-speaking.
Louisiana, the southernmost portion of the territory acquired from France, is also admitted with French being the official language there, but English becoming more prominent in practice with southern settlers moving in. For now it remains the Confederation's only officially French-speaking state.
Admitting Vermont - a state with a mixed population and many French and Dutch speakers in an officially English-speaking state - was solved by compromise. Vermont never formally decided on an official language. In practice this means that English, French and Dutch are used to different degrees throughout the State for now.
The language map illustrates the spread of European languages in the CAS, as of 1860. As in OTL, the issue of slavery is leading to a showdown between the Southern states, which rely on plantation-based economies, and the more industrialised North. The majority of immigration, mainly German, Polish and Irish at this point, went into the north and passed through Nieuw Amsterdam. This is reflected in the more “spotty” Dutch in the northern states, compared to the solid blue in the south. German immigrants in particular have an easy time picking up the new language, though, as it’s quite close to what they natively speak.
There has been some migration towards the western coast, mainly starting in western Mizoeri and following a few semi-established trails. The two new western states of Schuyler and Washington (located in OTL California) are a last-ditch effort to find a compromise in the slavery issue by extending the Ohio Line all the way to the Pacific, finally admitting Washington as a slave state and Schuyler as a free state in 1858. After being admitted as a state, the House and Senate of Washington immediately set forth to abolish slavery there, as the majority of voters there are opposed to the institution, despite there being very few slaves in the state at this point. They succeed in 1859, amending Washington’s constitution and leading to ever-worsening tension between free and slave states.
In this timeline, the additional issue of language adds to the difference in culture between the states. Although the division is not as clear, with English-speaking abolitionists in Vermont or Washington and Dutch-speaking proponents of slavery in Mizoeri or (parts of) Texas, the line can generally also be drawn according to the language.
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I haven't really figured too much of the world beyond the HRE. My original idea was that the HRE slowly eats away at a stubborn and resilient Russian tsardom. The current border largely follows the Don and Volga Rivers making further expansion difficult in a country that is already famous for being impossible to conquer. With regards to colonization it probably would be pretty fractured, with various petty realms trying to get some skin in the game, albeit not as much so as the HRE itself as colonization doesn't really lend itself to hereditary land acquisition. While the larger realms would be much better primed to colonize, there would be a lot more cases than OTL of small countries like Courland participating, and maybe some small states would band together to finance a colony. Compared to OTL there would be a lot more Métis-type areas where natives and Europeans mix.
Awesome scenarioCourtesy of u/jjpamsterdam from Reddit, a series of maps depicting the Confederation of American States: an American union formed between a Dutch-speaking north and an English-speaking south. Nearly a dozen maps have been made for this series, but I don't want to clutter the thread too much; so I've picked out three of the most important maps. The rest are listed below, with both thread links and direct links to maps.
- Alternate North American Independence: A Multilingual Confederation of American States - Map
- Languages and Ethnic Background - Map
- Flag Ideas
- Alternate War of 1812 - Political Map / War Map
- Territorial Development - Map
- Railroads and Population - Map / Population & Flags
- Civil War (1861) - Maps: 1 / 2 /3
- Civil War (1862-1863) - Maps: 1 / 2 / 3
- Map of New Netherland in Google Maps style (Contemporary) - Map
The First Anglo-Dutch War happens, just as OTL. After the end of the war the Self-Government in New Netherland, that was repealed at the start of this war, is re-established in 1654.
The British nations fall into civil unrest following Oliver Cromwell’s death in 1658 as his son Richard is not competent enough to retain the power of the Lord Protector. Charles II doesn’t return to England in 1660.
Due to internal unrest in the British nations, the Second Anglo-Dutch War is more decisive. The Treaty of Breda looks a bit different and readjusts several colonial borders. This includes readjustments to the colonial borders in North America, setting the border at the Versche Rivier (Connecticut River), establishing the small colony of Connetikock with mixed English, Dutch and French settlers already present. The Dutch obviously hold on to New Netherlands and also gain recognition for their rule over the territory of New Sweden (Nieuw-Zweden). With a significant Lutheran Swedish (and Finnish) population there, the New Netherland administration decides to set up a separate colonial administration there, allowing for local autonomy, although the language of administration remains Dutch in both of these colonies.
The unrest in the British nations only ends after William of Orange becomes King of England, Ireland and Scotland in 1689. Mary II doesn’t die from Smallpox in 1694. Instead of several miscarriages William and Mary have several children. The Dutch and British remain politically aligned for the next century.
The French and Indian War still takes place, but this time pits the French against a joint Anglo-Dutch front in North America. Just as OTL, the superior navy cuts off the French from effectively reinforcing their troops in North America. Eventually the Anglo-Dutch alliance occupies New France. The territories south of the Ottawa river is handed over to the Dutch, the area north and east of that river is handed over to the British. The British create the new (mostly French-speaking) colony of Quebec. The Dutch set up a new colony of Merenland (“Land of Lakes”) in what is known as Southern Ontario OTL. The boundary between British and Dutch zones of influence further west is defined as the Ohio river, although neither side of the river is densely populated (by Europeans) at this point in time.
In the years following the French and Indian War, the British and Dutch governments want to share the cost burden with the American colonies, leading to growing unrest there. Much like OTL, the colonies are declared in rebellion and troops are dispatched to restore order. This takes place in both the British and Dutch colonies, although with different levels of intensity. The British colonial forces manage to hold on to most of the areas in New England and Quebec, but lose power over the southern colonies. The Dutch also lose control over most of their holdings in North America. By the early 1790s and due to the French Revolutionary Wars the British and Dutch can’t afford to continue the conflict in North America. The colonies of New Netherland, Connetikock, New Sweden, Merenland, Chesapeake (Virginia + what’s left of Maryland), North Carolina , South Carolina and Georgia are recognised as independent. Resistance to British rule continues in New England, but many supporters of independence start moving into the newly independent states to the south and west.
The Continental Coordination Council, which had previously led the war effort against the colonial powers, comes together in 1792 to agree on the Articles of Confederation, forming the Confederation of American States (Confederatie van Amerikaanse Staaten). The individual states retain internal autonomy, especially in terms of language (English or Dutch), their religious policy (Puritan, Reformed, Lutheran, etc.) and the economic model (pre-industrial or plantation-based). The area to the west is subject to overlapping claims from different states but is in practice largely administered as territory. Areas north of the Ohio river generally have Dutch-speaking administrations, whereas territories further south are English-speaking.
In a different version of the War of 1812, the Confederation of American States fights the British for control over North America. The British believe this to be a minor theatre of the Napoleonic Wars. The Americans see it as the first time to truly assert their new sovereignty. The official casus belli is the impressment of New Englanders into British military service, despite the previous peace treaty granting them an exemption from this duty to the crown. The significant number of New Englander exiles living in the Confederation are also a factor, pushing their new home states for a liberation of the provinces that also rebelled against colonial rule but ultimately were retained by the British.
The war is quite similar to OTL, as the British simply lack the numbers in North America and have to rely heavily on Native American allies. On the flipside, the American militia forces are disorganised and can hardly sustain much of an offensive operation. Contrary to what New England exiles want to make, the American government believe the independence movement from Massachusetts to Maine is much weaker than in the late 18th century. Many New Englanders strongly opposed to the crown have already moved south and west. The reminder of the population is largely apolitical, with independentists not numerous enough for a major uprising. Additionally, the mostly Catholic Frenchmen in Quebec are also not too keen to become part of the strongly Protestant Confederation.
In the end, the war ends with a draw and no border changes. Both sides can claim symbolic victories. The British manage to seriously threaten the capital of the Confederation in Christina. The Americans can claim a major victory in the newly-acquired Louisiana towards the very end of the war. The main losers of the conflict are the Native Americans, whom Britain no longer regards as worthwhile allies, instead focusing their efforts on empire-building in other regions of the world.
In the years before and during the war, several new states were formed and admitted to the Confederation. This follows a decision by the Council of the Confederation to rescind all existing States’ claims on territories further west and allow emerging States there to apply for membership. The balance between English- and Dutch-speaking states as well as (some time later) between industrial- and plantation-based economies in these new states will lead to further conflict. For now, all new western States north of the Ohio river are Dutch-speaking and all States south of it are English-speaking.
Louisiana, the southernmost portion of the territory acquired from France, is also admitted with French being the official language there, but English becoming more prominent in practice with southern settlers moving in. For now it remains the Confederation's only officially French-speaking state.
Admitting Vermont - a state with a mixed population and many French and Dutch speakers in an officially English-speaking state - was solved by compromise. Vermont never formally decided on an official language. In practice this means that English, French and Dutch are used to different degrees throughout the State for now.
The 1860 language map illustrates the spread of European languages in the CAS in 1860. As in OTL, the issue of slavery is leading to a showdown between the southern states, which rely on plantation-based economies, and the more industrialised north. The majority of immigration, mainly German, Polish and Irish at this point, went into the north and passed through Nieuw Amsterdam. This is reflected in the more “spotty” Dutch in the northern states, compared to the solid blue in the south. German immigrants in particular have an easy time picking up the new language, though, as it’s quite close to what they natively speak.
There has been some migration towards the western coast, mainly starting in western Mizoeri and following a few semi-established trails. The two new western states of Schuyler and Washington (located in OTL California) are a last-ditch effort to find a compromise in the slavery issue by extending the Ohio Line all the way to the Pacific, finally admitting Washington as a slave state and Schuyler as a free state in 1858. After being admitted as a state, the House and Senate of Washington immediately set forth to abolish slavery there, as the majority of voters there are opposed to the institution, despite there being very few slaves in the state at this point. They succeed in 1859, amending Washington’s constitution and leading to ever-worsening tension between free and slave states.
In this timeline, the additional issue of language adds to the difference in culture between the states. Although the division is not as clear, with English-speaking abolitionists in Vermont or Washington and Dutch-speaking proponents of slavery in Mizoeri or (parts of) Texas, the line can generally also be drawn according to the language.
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