People say all sorts of Stupid things about Video Games.
When Exactly does WWII Kick off in KR and who usually Strikes First? WWII with no Hitler or Stalin will Feel Strange...
Kaiserreich: Legacy of the Weltkrieg
- Thread starter RiverDelta
- Start date
People say all sorts of Stupid things about Video Games.
When Exactly does WWII Kick off in KR and who usually Strikes First? WWII with no Hitler or Stalin will Feel Strange...
alot of the time it's french aggression or if it take long enough sometimes Germany does something of a "preemptive war"
Somewhere between 1937 and 1939 usually because of something France does to piss off Germany or France hitting Germany first. It's entirely possible to start in 1936 but that requires either player suicide or a really bad decision made by the AI.
If it is the path I'm thinking of, the Commune of France, given it most likely results in a double Entente-Reichspakt tag-team on the Syndintern, with National France starting off with a foothold in southern France.
Usually the Commune of France if you escalate the situation with the FAU too rapidly. Germany usually doesn't play nice there and that's the greatest odds of kicking off the war too early. The Commune does best when it has the chance to build up and fight the war after doing all it can to win Spain and America for the Syndicalist cause before kicking it all off.
Does anyone have any ideas for the German union focus tree? (the nation that you can create after occupying Germany)
I guess a starting point could be the DH German Union events (at least the Syndie ones, while I haven't double-checked I seem to remember the democratic and right-wing authoritarian formations of the German Union being deprecated in HOI4 - I'm more certain of the Prussia-formed GU being deprecated). So... FAUD (Radical Socialist)/Spartacist (Syndicalist)/Socialist Unity (Totalist) options in the Congress, Foreign/Industrial/Military/Domestic choices in the First Congress, and short navy and air force trees to decide focus.
Let's wait until Germany proper actually has a complete focus tree.
I thought of possible sub-trees based on the ideologies of the occupier
How about this concept of right-wing paths for National France:
Social Conservative: Gaullism prevails, strongman democracy of the regular electoral sort
Authoritarian Democrat: Enlightened Despotist Bonapartist Liberal Empire
Paternal Autocrat: Absolutist Bourbon monarchy with Pétainism, which in the absence of Vichy France isn't quite so far right but is mostly very militarist and revanchist
National Populist: Action Française reactionary junta staffed by some of the generals who were in the real life OAS- and as per the earlier discussion, with a House of Orléans monarch as their puppet figurehead, in a typical Kaiserreich/alternate history ironic twist
For the purposes of this hypothetical, let's say the Bourbon-Orléans split reoccurs under differing claimants.
Social Conservative: Gaullism prevails, strongman democracy of the regular electoral sort
Authoritarian Democrat: Enlightened Despotist Bonapartist Liberal Empire
Paternal Autocrat: Absolutist Bourbon monarchy with Pétainism, which in the absence of Vichy France isn't quite so far right but is mostly very militarist and revanchist
National Populist: Action Française reactionary junta staffed by some of the generals who were in the real life OAS- and as per the earlier discussion, with a House of Orléans monarch as their puppet figurehead, in a typical Kaiserreich/alternate history ironic twist
For the purposes of this hypothetical, let's say the Bourbon-Orléans split reoccurs under differing claimants.
The problem is the KR canon regarding Henri V, who is meant to be a massive reformer dedicated to a Orleanist France. The other thing is, at this point only Bonapartes or Orleans is the choice as all the Legitimists left are all Spanish pretenders.
Essentially, I'd put two version of Gaullism under a republic and Gaullism under the Orleanist monarchy. Though I think most of the DH Orleanist stuff has higher chances of accepting the Socialist party in elections after Liberation than the typical republican one, the VIC tag having Henri V as HoS increases the chance of allowing socialist competition by like 10 or something.
Essentially, I would upend the things and have the Republican nationalists be the most right as neither the Bonapartes or Orleanists ever really wanted Paternal Autocracy or National Populism. I think best bet would be to have Orleanists as the democratic option for monarchy along with Darlan or something, Bonapartes as a Liberal Empire thing with maybe some flavour/ways to avoid the Taureg revolt and better win their loyalty a la Germany-in-Exile, De Gaul as Caesar with options for democracy upon liberation and a final option for De Gaul or someone else as Full Dictator for ever.
You must remember that National France is predominantly bitter right wingers, not a more even spread of exiles as in Britain, but in France you have some people dedicated to a certain idea of the republic. The monarchists are used to being out in the cold, and old laws of exile meaning they are also more used to Algiers itself etc so maintain their relative positions as being right of centre to moderate right, but people such as Darlan and De Gaulle are more likely to be radicalised by the experience of the revolution and exile.
Well, I'd say a start could be four separate paths depending on the occupier: German Democratic Republic(leftist) German Republic(any of the democracies) Kingdom of Germany(Authdem or Pataut) and German State(Natpop). I guess that for the DDR you'd have it follow whatever ideology the Commune is; meanwhile the Kingdom could have you decide whether to have some Russian Prince as King or pick the King of Bavaria. I also think any Natpop Germany should have events with Mittelafrika; I think I suggested upthread that if Savinkov conquers Germany Goering should have the option to recognize whatever puppet regime Savinkov puts in power there, automatically switching Mittelafrika to the Souveranisten and having them join Savinkov's alliance in exchange for full independence. It never made sense to me that Goering would just hand over independence to the Kaiser if Savinkov is right there to be a new patron who will definitely give less of a shit about silly things like human rights.
Usually the war starts around 1939 but it can start a bit earlier depending on what happens.
The Commune of France is generally the country that starts off the war because in the KR lore, Revanchism is high there. It kinda makes sense: Revanchism in France was already sky high after the 1870 defeat and the loss of Alsace-Lorraine. A loss in World War I would likely put anti-German sentiment and Revanchism through the stratosphere.
Speaking of which, I always find it odd that the Commune of France gets wargoals against Germany but not National France. Alsace-Lorraine would still be in German hands and given the loss of World War I, anti-German sentiment would still be high, syndicalist or not. I understand how the need to retake the mainland from syndicalists could be a priority but Germany would likely be the next target.
Personnally, I kinda liked the idea they had where you had to chose what Regime you want first then decide what to do later on. So I'd rather do this:
- Keeping the military government: according to the lore, the military is basically in charge at the start of the game as a consequences of the defeat in the Weltkrieg and the syndicalist rising. It makes sense given the collapse of the institutions and the fact the country had just come out of the Welltkrieg so the army still had a big role. That being said, the basis of the military government is that it's supposed to be temporary until a new regime is established. It'd be nice if you had a choice that basically said "We're keeping this until the mainland is free from the Syndies" at the start instead of switching Regime right away. If you don't want this to be a popular move then have it only reduces the penalties National France gets at the start instead of removing them. Once the mainland is free, you then you're asked again what to do with the government and get your usual three choices... Or decide that this Provisional Military Government works just fine. Basically would be an Authoritarian Democrat/Paternal Autocrat path where the military takes charge, with the distinction being made on how liberal you want the military to be.
- The Fourth French Republic: you choose to keep France a Republic but given how weak and discredited the Third Republic was by the loss of the Weltkrieg, it is decided to rebalance the power to have a stronger executive (but not remove the legislative body). You start with Social Conservatives in power because of what the regime is made of, but you keep elections and get choices between Market Liberals or Social Conservatives in the elections afterwards (and possibly Social Reformists if you choose to).
- The Third French Empire: you crown Louis Bonaparte as Napoleon VI, because the Bonapartes are always there when the Republic falls. You then get the choice to go between a Liberal Empire or an Authoritarian one. The Liberal Empire is basically a Constitutionnal Monarchy but with the need for a stronger executive given by the failures of the Third Republic, the Emperor isn't a complete figurehead. In elections, your choices are Market Liberals, Social Conservatives or Authoritarian Democrats (to represent the fact the Emperor isn't a complete figurehead). The Authoritarian version gives even more powers to the Emperor and reduces the Legislative body to a lackey of the executive: it basically becomes a Paternal Autocrat path.
- The Third Restoration: You do away with the Republic alltogether and crown the Duke of Guise as the rightful King of France, Jean III. To represent the strength of the Action Française within Monarchist circles at the time, you become National Populist as the regime adopts Maurras's National Integralism's ideas and the regime becomes fully Antiparliamentary. You stay in this position until Jean III dies in 1940 (as he did OTL), at which points his son becomes Henri VI. You then get a choice: either Henri VI has no problem with Maurrassian ideas and you stay Nat Pop... Or he has and that's gonna cause a problem. If you want to stay Nat Pop, you then have Henri VI lose the ensuing power struggle and forced to adbicate in favor of his son Henri VII (the OTL actual count of Paris, who was born in 1933 and thus would be underage and in need of a regency, making him a convenient puppet). You could also look for another prince but from my research the pretenders would have their own problem (the next one in the Orléans line is apparently the heir to the Brazilian Empire if my research is right while the legitimate pretender is the son of Alphonse XIII of Spain) or go through a female line but that doesn't seem coherent with the conversatism if not reactionnary nature of French Monarchist movements. The question will not rise however if Henri VI wins the ensuing power struggles, at which point you get to reform the regime: the way I see it you'd be given basically the same choices you get in the Third French Empire (Liberal Constitutionnal Monarchy or Paternal Autocrat path) depending on how you want Henri VI to enact his reforms. You get rid of National Populism either way.
- The attitude towards the Left: National France is strongly right wing because the opposing Commune of France is strongly left wing. The question then becomes how tolerant do you want National France to be towards the Left in general? The first question will arise with Social Reformists which you can authorize or ban but the question would become more important once you've retaken the mainland as you don't have very fond memories of Syndicalism. In which case, you either choose recounciliation or execution.
- The colonial question: this would basically be where you determine the rights of your colonial subject and it would be a rather important question given that you're based in your colonies. The possibilities would basically be split between Integration or Segregation, the latter being more risky because of the possible revolts it could cause.
- The Entente/Your Foreign Policy: you'd develop your relationship with your British (only Syndies call them Canadians
) allies. Or break your ties alltogether if you want either to build Anglophobia (could happen, was a thing for a long time after all) or want to make your own alliance (such as a "Bourbon pact" with Spain and the Two Sicilies for example). - Recovering the Mainland: essentially would keep the basis you have on the tree currently, though with additions linked to how the rest would be reworked, with possible expansion to compensate if there is a need for that. I'd expand on the idea to raise Maquisards though. And I'd also give the possibility to have National French elements infiltrate the Commune's military, given how much military personnel National France has. The Commune of France gets a similar event to the "Lawrence of Arabia restores the UK" one, though it's just the military getting rid of the Totalists of Marcel Déat (whose basically the equivalent of Mosley in the UoB): it'd be nice if you actually saw the military go for "This syndie nonsense has gone long enough: let's just call the government in Algiers" for example. Of course, you could likely make the event as rare as the Lawrence restore the UK one.
- The German question: The Commune hates the Kaiser but I doubt National France's attitude would be kinder... Recovering Alsace-Lorraine was part of the Welktkrieg Propaganda. Plus the peace was rather humiliating for France in KR: its colonial Empire is mostly gone after all. So in my opinion, this deserves a particular focus tree where you decide what you do with the Reich: do you befriend your old ennemy because Syndicalism is your main ennemy or do you prepare for another revenge like those dirty syndies occupying the mainland do?
Action Francaise fits with PatAut more, honestly. It's plausible in KR that they could be radicalized more to become Natpop, but they were always more old school reactionary than Fascistic. An idea I like is having the French Royalists embrace Integralism; it would make sense given that it seems to be quite popular in Catholic countries. Incidentally, it would also be cool to have an Integralist path for the Carlists.
What exactly is integralism it’s all over Kaiserreich but I don’t get what it is still
Basically, it's an ideology that, much like Fascism, believes that the nation and the state should be one. Integralism, however, is explicitly Monarchist and advocates a kind of new-Feudalism, where regions are given a great deal of autonomy; the thought is that local autocrats would be more in touch with the people than far away politicians, and thus a country that purely expresses the will of the people would be created. The reality is probably less rosy, but we don't actually have an example of the ideology being tried, so you never know. Integralism also features an absolutist monarch who I believe has authority when he wants it but day to day running would be handled by local governors.
While Integralism is anti-semetic(probably; at least the leader of Brazil's Integralists was an anti-Semite) that's surprisingly the limit of their bigotry. As alluded to by the Brazilian focus tree, Integralism considers minorities to be important parts of the nation, and identifies an end to racial discrimination as an important step to ensuring the nation can be as strong as possible. While the Portuguese Integralist's anti-racism is not as explicit their focus tree also alludes to "benevolent imperialism" suggesting that the African clonies of Integralist powers would be integrated and their denizens theoretically granted equal rights. At the very least, given all the events surrounding native African terrorism in Mittelafrika being sponsored by Portugal, your average African perfers Portugal's Integralists to Goering, although this isn't saying much.
Speaking of Portugal what’s the easiest way to go pataut as Portugal?
I think it basically requires losing the war with. Mittelafrika.
It’s kind of annoying because it’s not necessarily guaranteed to happen and even then not in a timely manner