Jacobite UK leads to monarchist conservative US?

[Fatt Shea]

Let’s say the jacobites won in their 1745 uprising with French assistance and the American revolution ended up happening under somewhat similar circumstances (like taxes being raised after a war the jacobites get involved in but also due to friendlier relations with France causing a proclamation line, the weakening of parliament and equal rights for catholics etc.)

I could see it making the revolution being a pro Hannoverian one because they would be seen as the natural enemy of the jacobite government who were causing the problems for Americans. This could result in an American monarchy under the house of Hannover ruling the new US in a constitutional monarchy (it would be ironic if George III ended up being the first American king). There might be some problems as the potential king might prefer to just rule Hannover so a brother might be sent instead, although the Hannovers would still claim America as part of their claims to Britain so the king of America might also be king of Hannover, maybe sending a king of viceroy there or maybe staying there for some months of the year.) The revolutionaries would also view the old British parliamentary system more favourably since they’d see that as the one that they had prospered under so they might choose a system more similar to that than the more radical system they chose OTL. This would mean no president and senate which means that system wouldn’t be as widespread across the world since the US wouldn’t make it popular, it could also result in the US being more unitary basing their model of the UK of England and Scotland which the jacobites disrupted, but this won’t be too extreme as there’d still be interstate rivalries. Religion would also be impacted since there would be a greater emphasis placed on the protestant identity of the US in contrast to the catholic jacobites and their french allies. This could result in a far less secular America which could encorperate religion into their government in small ways although they aren’t likely to have a national church like the ik due to the religious diversity of protestants in the US. The new nation would also be far less likely to accept catholic immigrants like the Irish and Italians and anti catholic conspiracy theories would be far more popular with people accusing political opponents of being papists far more often. Another effect would be foreign policy related a jacobite UK might be harder to reconcile with after the war meaning hostile relations for longer which would damage trade for the US a lot resulting in a weaker economy and fears of a re conquest (realistic or not) they would also be hostile to France and Spain who the UK would be allied to meaning they couldn’t rely on their alliance, if the UK keeps its part of canada then the US would be surrounded by enemies. This would result in the US being a nation much more interested in its military focusing on building a large army and navy early on rather than having a smaller one a first. Another possibility is powerful and wealthy whig politcal famlies who fled after the Jacobite victory (probably to Hannover) moving to the new US after the war and influencing them to be like pre jacobite Britain.

 

[Analytical Engine]

This could result in a far less secular America which could encorperate religion into their government in small ways although they aren’t likely to have a national church like the ik due to the religious diversity of protestants in the US.

Most of the thirteen colonies had established religions pre-independence (only Rhode Island and Pennsylvania didn't). Several states held onto them for a while afterwards.

 

[Fabius Maximus]

Most of the thirteen colonies had established religions pre-independence (only Rhode Island and Pennsylvania didn't). Several states held onto them for a while afterwards.

IIRC the last was Massachussetts, which kept its established Church until the 1830s.

 

[Kellan Sullivan]

Lets take it from the top:

Let’s say the jacobites won in their 1745 uprising with French assistance and the American revolution ended up happening under somewhat similar circumstances (like taxes being raised after a war the jacobites get involved in

Taxes weren't the issue, representation was.

but also due to friendlier relations with France

Uh why? France essentially promised the Jacobites that "sure, we'll help", then found themselves conveniently busy after the first landing. France's input was minimal and if Bonnie Prince Charlie pushes from Derby to seize the crown, France has missed the window. Likely, Charlie rides into power without any further French help. Louis XV might offer a daughter to BPC but there's no guarantee he'd accept. And there's no guarantee James would accept, given that at the start of the 1740s, he was trying to score either Maria Theresia's sister or Karl VII's eldest daughter. And Frederick the Great was willing to offer either his sister, Anna Amalia, or his niece, Elisabeth of Bayreuth, for BPC as late as post-1745

causing a proclamation line, the weakening of parliament and equal rights for catholics etc.)

And a weakened parliament (when parliamentary oligarchy was what caused the ARW to start with) equals ARW?

I could see it making the revolution being a pro Hannoverian one because they would be seen as the natural enemy of the jacobite government

By who?

who were causing the problems for Americans. This could result in an American monarchy under the house of Hannover ruling the new US in a constitutional monarchy (it would be ironic if George III ended up being the first American king).

So you want to offer an American crown to a German state that has neither a navy nor a port? How is this any different to the Prince Henry of Prussia is king of America idea? Prussia at least has a navy (albeit a small one)

There might be some problems as the potential king might prefer to just rule Hannover so a brother might be sent instead, although the Hannovers would still claim America as part of their claims to Britain

Assuming Hannover still claims Britain at all.

so the king of America might also be king of Hannover, maybe sending a king of viceroy there or maybe staying there for some months of the year.)

Elector, no kings inside the HRE. And that's ASSUMING Maria Theresia doesn't do what she wanted OTL and STRIP Hannover of the electorate (she has every right to*, only reason she didn't was because Hannover and Britain were in PU)

*The electorate was bestowed contingent on Hannover voting Habsburg in the imperial elections. In the 1740 one, George II voted for Karl Albrecht of Bavaria, in violation of this condition. Hence Maria Theresia's reaction. It was her (pro-English) husband who talked her out of it. Her husband was also surrounded by dozens of Jacobites who followed him to Vienna from Lorraine.

The revolutionaries would also view the old British parliamentary system more favourably since they’d see that as the one that they had prospered under

Prospered how? What did America export to prosper? Until 1850 the American economy still relied heavily on Britain and Europe

so they might choose a system more similar to that than the more radical system they chose OTL. This would mean no president and senate which means that system wouldn’t be as widespread across the world since the US wouldn’t make it popular, it could also result in the US being more unitary basing their model of the UK of England and Scotland

The US would be more unitary thanks to the Jacobites not parliament. Likely the Dominion of New England, Dominion of Carolina and Dominion of Virginia division that both Charles II and James II wanted gets pushed through. The local company charters get revoked and a singular "unit" is created. Benefit in 1750 is that most of the original leaseholders are dead (unlike when James II tried it in 1685-1688), although the Calvert heirs in Maryland are still around IIRC.

These three "dominions" would likely also mean that its easier to contain a rebellion and send the army in if need be

which the jacobites disrupted, but this won’t be too extreme as there’d still be interstate rivalries. Religion would also be impacted since there would be a greater emphasis placed on the protestant identity of the US in contrast to the catholic jacobites and their french allies.

Because 1776-JFK wasn't bad enough for Catholics in the US?

This could result in a far less secular America which could encorperate religion into their government in small ways although they aren’t likely to have a national church like the ik due to the religious diversity of protestants in the US. The new nation would also be far less likely to accept catholic immigrants like the Irish and Italians and anti catholic conspiracy theories would be far more popular with people accusing political opponents of being papists far more often. Another effect would be foreign policy related a jacobite UK might be harder to reconcile with after the war meaning hostile relations for longer which would damage trade for the US a lot resulting in a weaker economy and fears of a re conquest (realistic or not) they would also be hostile to France and Spain who the UK would be allied to meaning they couldn’t rely on their alliance, if the UK keeps its part of canada then the US would be surrounded by enemies. This would result in the US being a nation much more interested in its military focusing on building a large army and navy early on rather than having a smaller one a first. Another possibility is powerful and wealthy whig politcal famlies who fled after the Jacobite victory (probably to Hannover) moving to the new US after the war and influencing them to be like pre jacobite Britain.

Fleeing to the US in 1745 when Paris, the Netherlands, Germany etc are right there is risiculous. Why would the duke of Smithfield in the UK flee to a backwoods colony where he has no money, no interest and he's a nobody. The Portuguese court fleeing to Brasil OTL was a last resort, it was expensive, and when they arrived, there was a whole new mess of problems. So I'm not sure where this idea comes from that the Whigs will evacuate en masse to the colonies. Hell, the Pelhams are the type who'll turn out to cheer Prince Charlie as he rides into London

 

[Maponus]

It would depend on how the restored Jacobite Kingdom treats the Independents. If they continue James II/VII's policy of strategic tolerance towards the Independent Protestant Churches it might cause a divide between different Protestant denominations in the colonies that the Crown can exploit to divide and conquer any potential rebellion. However, if the restored Jacobites are feeling vengeful for the involvement of Independents in the Glorious Revolution they might launch some kind of crackdown that would galvanise a united protestant opposition in the colonies.