Is it possible? Today's Croatia (except Slavonia of course), Serbia (except Vojvodina), Bosnia and Bulgaria to be romance speaking with the byzantines successfully repealing slavic invasions.
Is it possible for the balkans to keep romance speaking under a Byzantine Empire able to repeal slavic invasions?
- Thread starter Tupiniquim
- Start date
If there were no Muslim conquests, Roman Empire would have greater control over the Balkan peninsula..
Slavic migrations would still happen but they would probably be assimilated in time..
I don't see Romance speaking Balkans though.. With a strong 7th-8th Roman Empire there would be greater Greek influence in the region..
Slavic migrations would still happen but they would probably be assimilated in time..
I don't see Romance speaking Balkans though.. With a strong 7th-8th Roman Empire there would be greater Greek influence in the region..
Romance languages would probably have a stronger position in the Balkans. Prior to the Slavic conquest of the region and subsequent language shift the inhabitants spooke multiple different languages. Prominently among these were languages belonging to the Romance, Greek and Albanian/or predecessor to Albanian. East Germanic might also have been spoken in some places around what is today Serbia.
My guess is that Romance languages might be more widespread in what is now Montenegro and Northern Bulgaria, aswell as possibly in what is now Serbia. Southern Bulgaria, Turkish Thrace and North Macedonia would probably be Greek speaking. If the Byzantines retain Bosnia and Dalmatia, then the position of Romance languages should be stronger than in OTL. Among the educated elite Greek would probably be the most important written language, being used for offical functions and education. Romance based languages might be restricted as mostly spoken language, with only non-offical use among the litterate.
My guess is that Romance languages might be more widespread in what is now Montenegro and Northern Bulgaria, aswell as possibly in what is now Serbia. Southern Bulgaria, Turkish Thrace and North Macedonia would probably be Greek speaking. If the Byzantines retain Bosnia and Dalmatia, then the position of Romance languages should be stronger than in OTL. Among the educated elite Greek would probably be the most important written language, being used for offical functions and education. Romance based languages might be restricted as mostly spoken language, with only non-offical use among the litterate.
Wouldn't Latin stay a government language of the Byzantines though if they keep the romance speaking areas that they lost otl before switching to Greek?
Greek was the lingua franca for most of the Byzantine Empire/Eastern Roman Empire and had been so for centuries. Undoubtedly the loss of Latin speaking regions made it more likely for Greek to fully takeover the functions once held by Latin. Allthough Greek speaking regions were always the most central parts of the Byzantine Empire. The loss of the rich and densely populated Italy was probably a large blow to the position of Latin in the Byzantine Empire. Unlike Italy the Romance speaking regions of the Balkans were relativly sparsely populated and poor, and thus less likely to increase the status of Latin in the Byzantine Empire.
Ultimatly i think that as long as the Byzantines are primarliy based in the Greek speaking world, it is likely that it is going to be the dominant language, even without the loss of the Balkans and Italy. Allthough the practice of both Greek and Latin being the central Roman languages is likely to continue.
Trying to read that, I think you really needed a beta. The amount of misspellings, grammar issues, missed words and stuff uncapitalised makes it virtually unreadable.
As to the OP, I think whether the balkans become greekified or not depends on whether or not Italy is retained. Even if Rome successfully repells the Muslims and retains the eastern provinces if Italy is lost to the Lombards or Franks then the Latin core of the empire is gone which would lead to an outsized influence of greek. Without Italy the empire has little reason to maintain latin as a court language, as this is not getting into the resulting influence that other groups might have now that the borders once covered by italy are now at what is the wester borders of croatia.
I believe that so many Slavs came in during this time that it was impossible to actually stop them. After all the region had been a depopulated mess ever since the migration period began, so I believe that Slavic would still become the language of the Balkans even if there were no Muslim counquests.
Yeah but it gets better by 2020, but now that our mention it might as well go back and fix the grammar issues .
And I did
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Wars in the east crippled the Romans ability to fight on multiple fronts.
I think that is the line of thought being deployed.
The Thracians were already assimilated into the incoming Latin-speaking colonists, and a lot of the native Thracians were also taken into the troops that were fighting further east. By the time of the Slavic invasions, not much remained of the Thracian-speakers in the Balkans. Probably by the fourth/fifth century.
EDIT: Sorry, I answered a completely different question.
I'll answer the one you actually asked now.
Your question was: Is it possible for the Balkans to (keep being?) Romance speaking under a Byzantine Empire able to repeal slavic (Slavic) invasions?
Yes? But the Balkans were severely depopulated by the Romans' aggressive recruiting policy unto the Thracians. That's what allowed the invasions in the first place.
EDIT: Sorry, I answered a completely different question.
I'll answer the one you actually asked now.Your question was: Is it possible for the Balkans to (keep being?) Romance speaking under a Byzantine Empire able to repeal slavic (Slavic) invasions?
Yes? But the Balkans were severely depopulated by the Romans' aggressive recruiting policy unto the Thracians. That's what allowed the invasions in the first place.
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eh constans would likely change that i mean he could hava taken souther italy with no muslim invasion its quite likely he would be able to take most italy.
There are four non-Slavic Balkan nations I know with Romania, Hungary, Albania and Greece. Historically, the Balkans were home to Illyrians, Thracians and Celts as well as those who spoke Romance or Greek. If they hadn't been conquered by the Romans, I reckon that Illyrian, Thracian and Celtic dialect would've stayed the norm by the time of the Slavic Migration. If the Balkan nations had repulsed Rome and stayed independent, they probably would've kept their native languages.
File:Bgiusca Jirecek Line.jpg - Wikipedia
I deliberateliy did not mention the Jireček line, because it would be anachronistic. Almost all of the Balkans south to the Peloponese with the exception of Albania and coastal (Greek-speaking) enclaves and mountainous (Latin-speaking) was majority Slavic-speaking in the seventh century. It eventually reverted somewhat.
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I don't agree with that motion with out the island invasions the Byzantine would be able to better fend off and countian them we know the slavs I'm Greece and other parts were assimilated the same thing could very well happen
Most of the Balkans were Greek speaking...File:Bgiusca Jirecek Line.jpg - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
Where did the proto-Albanian language fit in this and how did it survive?
No but I can do you one better. Balkans speaking Armenian based languages.
I mean OTL Maurice planned to resettle the region with Armenians after the Slavic migrations were curbed and the Avars vaporized, and imo that's even more ripe for interesting stuff than just southern Romanians
I mean OTL Maurice planned to resettle the region with Armenians after the Slavic migrations were curbed and the Avars vaporized, and imo that's even more ripe for interesting stuff than just southern Romanians
armenians were moved to balkans before and after him and as we know there numbers were never big enough to change much