French recruiting of German soldiers after WW2

[stubear1012]

I am reading fictional novel about the French War in Indochina. At the start of the book, the main character is captured by the French during the end of WW2. When asked, he told the French that he served in the Panzer units. He and several other combat veterans were sent to a POW camp. There the French screen the men looking war criminals and high ranking Nazis. The remain POW were then offered a chance to join the French Foreign Legion. In exchange for fighting for France, the men were offered steady pay and then French citizenship upon being honorable discharged. After training, the men were shipped to Indochina where the rest of the story is set at.

I am wondering did France actively recruit German POW's to fight in the Foreign Legion? If so does anyone one know how many Germans served in the Legion after WW2?

 

[Carl Schwamberger]

Yes, mostly 'Alsatians' who had served in the German army. When France restarted conscription in 1946 that lot were encouraged to recover legitimate French citizenship by joining the army. Some did. These combat veterans did not fit in well among the fresh faced conscripts & often were discharged early. The other much smaller group were those the Foreign Legion recruited. I've been told as many as 10,000 were recruited by the FL, but how many actually served is another matter. There was a high rejection rate during initial training by the FL.

My take is the combat veterans, Alsatian or German were mostly uninterested in any further military service. My more direct experience is combat veterans, particularly those over age 28 have a lot of health problems, wounds, chronic illnesses, mental health problems. Some can serve on as senior NCOs or officers, but most are not suitable for further service in a peace time military. You want ignorant young kids who can be manipulated for your lower ranks. Its a bit different in war, but there are still a lot of health problems emerging with veterans over age 28.

 

[GorillaTheater]

Germans have generally been pretty well represented in the Legion. I'm going to hazard a very rough guess that historically their numbers have hovered around 25%, and may have reached 35% after the world wars. Anecdotally, I'd say the combat vets did their 5 years and bailed, since I've heard that the average age of Legionnaires at Dien Bien Phu in 1954 was 23.

 

[stubear1012]

Thank you for this information. I can see where most German combat veterans would just want to go home.

 

[MichaelWest]

My faulty memory is that the Foreign Legion took in a lot of Germans, somewhere between 1/4 and 1/3 strength, they weeded out Nazis but welcomed both veterans and those who wanted to serve but could not yet in Germany before the establishment of the Bundeswehr. I recall that a lot of Germans were at Dien Bien Phu. Obviously the French tend to minimize the contributions just as they did many years later when 2e REP was very British in make-up, but as always the Legion takes what it can and serves France in the far away and dirty places. You need to did but my reading years ago was that post-war the Legion relied upon German veterans and recruits, they had served before the war too, adding to the diverse story that is the Legion.

 

[Rufus Shinra]

German veterans in the FFL is a tradition after France-Germany wars. After 1871 and 1918, bedouins heard a lot of German-sounding marching songs in the desert. 1945 was no exception.

 

[yulzari]

Obviously the French tend to minimize the contributions just as they did many years later when 2e REP was very British in make-up, but as always the Legion takes what it can and serves France in the far away and dirty places.

When 2e REP was known as 2 Para.......

 

[riggerrob]

Post WW2, the FFL was derisively reffered to as “DeGaulle’s SS” common soldiers drafted into the French Army. Several FFL regiments sported SS (blood group) tattoos as they marched past singing German songs.

 

[longsword14]

Post WW2, the FFL was derisively reffered to as “DeGaulle’s SS” common soldiers drafted into the French Army. Several FFL regiments sported SS (blood group) tattoos as they marched past singing German songs.

Got a source for this ? SS having much presence in FFL is something I have seen refuted in several places. The OP might be reading Devil's Guard ( which is a bad book ), that made the SS trope popular.

 

[MichaelWest]

When 2e REP was known as 2 Para.......

Indeed and the French were not keen on it.

 

[Rufus Shinra]

Post WW2, the FFL was derisively reffered to as “DeGaulle’s SS” common soldiers drafted into the French Army. Several FFL regiments sported SS (blood group) tattoos as they marched past singing German songs.

From what I heard, it was actually the reverse, that recruiters specifically prevented anyone with such a tattoo from enlisting in the FFL.

Not to say that war criminals didn’t get into the FFL, as one camp survivor also enlisted to get close to one of his former guards and kill him. He got fired from the Legion after whacking the former guard, but I think that’s it.

 

[kclcmdr]

Got a source for this ? SS having much presence in FFL is something I have seen refuted in several places. The OP might be reading Devil's Guard ( which is a bad book ), that made the SS trope popular.

Perhaps the OP had also read Casca, The Legionnaire, when WW2 ended n he was captured by French troops and was offer military service to avoid POW hard labour options...

 

[stubear1012]

Yes, I was reading Casca, The Legionnaire. I am working through the series. In the book Casca was in the Panzer and was not a member of SS. In the fictional series, the character Casca was not know for killing innocent women and children. The recruiting portion discussed that there was a mixture of German soldiers including paratroopers and possible SS in Wehrmacht and civilian clothes. The French did separate out any suspected war criminals that they could identify.

I had assumed that while the SS had panzers that the regular German army also had panzers. Is my assumption correct in that these two groups were separate?

I do appreciate the comments which help me understand what was going on in this time period.

 

[longsword14]

Yes, I was reading Casca, The Legionnaire. I am working through the series. In the book Casca was in the Panzer and was not a member of SS. In the fictional series, the character Casca was not know for killing innocent women and children. The recruiting portion discussed that there was a mixture of German soldiers including paratroopers and possible SS in Wehrmacht and civilian clothes. The French did separate out any suspected war criminals that they could identify.

Casca was after Devil's Guard, so it is a continuation of the trope that the FFL was full of SS in Indochina. IIRC Bernard Fall discusses this in Hell in a Very Small Place where he estimates that a fraction of total troops in DBP were FFL, and out of those a part were German. Out of those only a small fraction could have been ex SS.
Go to armchairgeneral.com and look at user lirelou's post on this ( or anything related to Vietnam ).

 

[MichaelWest]

I had assumed that while the SS had panzers that the regular German army also had panzers. Is my assumption correct in that these two groups were separate? I do appreciate the comments which help me understand what was going on in this time period.

The SS began as a bodyguard for Hitler and evolved into an elite military that was as much ideology as fighting force, it was to be the Aryan vanguard, a truly Nazi Army, in parallel and ultimately in place of the old regular Army. Thus is quickly became armored as that was the cutting edge, modern and "elite", but as the war dragged on it gained foreign recruits and mundane infantry, shaded to ideological fervor it was given a place in every theater and every part of the ground war, especially in anti-communist fights. At bottom the SS was favored in equipment and supply but was not truly an elite by war's end, arguably just the most loyal men to the Third Reich or desperate, for example the last SS troops fighting included French SS in Berlin. Post-war they try to emphasize the "elite" nature, shading to being a Marine Corp, arguing they were just another Army but minimizing its roots and connections to the genocide and camp guards who equally wore the SS badges. Although I might swallow that not all SS men were murderous fanatics, that was who they were meant to be by the Nazi ideology, men dedicated to do everything asked, the SS is inseparable from the Nazi party and Hitler's vision.

 

[mudhead]

Casca was after Devil's Guard, so it is a continuation of the trope that the FFL was full of SS in Indochina. IIRC Bernard Fall discusses this in Hell in a Very Small Place where he estimates that a fraction of total troops in DBP were FFL, and out of those a part were German. Out of those only a small fraction could have been ex SS.
Go to armchairgeneral.com and look at user lirelou's post on this ( or anything related to Vietnam ).

According to Martin Windrow's The Last Valley there were very few Third Reich veterans of any kind still in the FFL at this time - a few senior NCOs, at most. I recommend this book: review here.

 

[longsword14]

According to Martin Windrow's The Last Valley there were very few Third Reich veterans of any kind still in the FFL at this time - a few senior NCOs, at most. I recommend this book: review here.

Yes. The age of the soldiers would require most to have been early-teen SS veterans, so not really possible.