Eastern Colonialism
- Thread starter Zor
- Start date
Rex Romanum
Banned
Yes, it's called "OTL".
Seriously, though, Imperial Japan is perfectly fit with your typical Colonial Empire's criterias: various overseas territories taken from "barbarians", immense arrogance and superiority complex, brutal and inhuman treatments toward "lesser races"...what else that you want?
Seriously, though, Imperial Japan is perfectly fit with your typical Colonial Empire's criterias: various overseas territories taken from "barbarians", immense arrogance and superiority complex, brutal and inhuman treatments toward "lesser races"...what else that you want?
Yes I know about that. I was thinking more along the lines of East Asia colonizes the new world and so forth.
Zor
We already discussed this in detail here. China did not expand because it possessed an ethnocentric viewpoint, and already possessed most of the resources it needed through trade inside and outside of its borders. Japan was not in a position to expand outside of the islands before the late 16th century, and would have been limited to areas around coastal Siberia, while the situation would have been similar for Korea as well. The latter two also had access to plenty of resources through trade with East and Southeast Asia.
Of course, small-scale expeditions overseas, which occurred to a degree IOTL when Chinese migrants headed to Southeast Asia, could have been more expansive. However, the governments would have been generally unwilling to spend their resources into conducting more widespread ones, when they generally did not see any tangible benefits.
Of course, small-scale expeditions overseas, which occurred to a degree IOTL when Chinese migrants headed to Southeast Asia, could have been more expansive. However, the governments would have been generally unwilling to spend their resources into conducting more widespread ones, when they generally did not see any tangible benefits.
I can't speak to particular timelines, but there are ways this could have happened.
In particular, if there had been no Mongol conquests under Temujin, Sung China would have continued as a large scale mercantile power with much maritime activity. It is unlikely that the Sung state would have sponsored colonization, but that isn't a requirement.
Areas like the west coast of the New World and Australasia were thinly populated (and vulnerable to Old World epidemic diseases). Even scattered trading outposts would be enough seed to grow into significant settler colonies, and set the ethnic character of these areas.
If they survived disease, famine, and all the other reasons why setting up settler colonies is not a "send people, get settler colonies" enterprise.
Yes, but you're ignoring the devastation that occurred more than a century before then, when the Jurchen took over North China. Although the Song still retained the south, they were severely impacted, and it would have taken them many decades, if not centuries, to recover significantly. A significant amount of maritime activity certainly existed before and after the invasion, but there was no particular impetus to form colonies overseas, due to the lack of pressures which caused the Europeans to look outward.
Although the (Khitan), Jurchen, and/or the Mongols might not have invaded China in another timeline, other nomadic groups would have probably taken their places, given the long-term trend IOTL. Not only would the invasions have caused the Song to invest more resources into repelling the incursions from the north, but the decrease in population would have also led to very limited population pressures, with more resources for each individual. The constant invasions from the Khitan, Jurchen and Mongols also did not cause the Chinese to look overseas in order to seek better conditions, so I don't see any way for chaotic conditions causing widespread emigration to occur either.
If the Song retained the southern areas, trade would have still been conducted on a widespread level, and although there might have been some limited explorations overseas, there would be no particular reason to form stable colonies, due to minimal population and economic pressures, after recovering from nomadic invasions to the north.