Earliest Possible Humans in Americas?

[Emperor RyRy]

So we all want native Americans to do better than IRL, and I think the best way to do so is to have paleoamerindians reach the continent much much earlier, so therefore megafauna populations have time to rebound before the Ice Age ends.

What do you all think is the earliest possible date for human colonization of the Americas? I remember that only a few years ago everybody believed that they made he trek about 50,000 years ago, but now it is agreed to be about 15,000.

 

[Riain]

I have done a bit of reading and from what I can tell the Americas were populated in a couple of waves, the first being about 23, 000 years ago and possibly up to 28, 000 years ago.

 

[trurle]

40000 years. The maritime technology (rafts) which enabled settling Australia may bring early humans from modern Indonesia to America, if some extreme luck with weather happens.

 

[Emperor-of-New-Zealand]

Could Homo neanderthalensis have made it to the Americas?

 

[iori]

Could Homo neanderthalensis have made it to the Americas?

I suppose it's theoretically possible, though it's unlikely as IOTL Neanderthals lives predominantly in Europe, with the furthest East they lived being Central Asia (the furthest, furthest was that area of Russia between Mongolia and Kazakhstan), but on the other hand Neanderthals were more adapted to Cold Weather, so trekking through Siberia and Beringia would be easier for them.

 

[Emperor-of-New-Zealand]

I suppose it's theoretically possible, though it's unlikely as IOTL Neanderthals lives predominantly in Europe, with the furthest East they lived being Central Asia (the furthest. furthest was that area of Russia between Mongolia and Kazakhstan), but on the other hand Neanderthals were more adapted to Cold Weather, so trekking through Siberia and Beringia would be easier for them.

That would make for an interesting ATL: Neaderthals make it to the Americas, but for some reason Homo sapiens does not...

Assuming our species develops as we did in OTL, imagine coming across a thriving Neanderthal civilisation in the Americas at the Age of Discovery.

 

[iori]

That would make for an interesting ATL: Neaderthals make it to the Americas, but for some reason Homo sapiens does not...

It's unlikely Humans would just not do anything, however you could see a situation where the Neanderthals, having lived in Beringia long before at that point had changed the ecosystem to the point that it was less attractive to Human migrants, so you might see less Human migration, though I suspect that you'd probably see some Human populations making the trek and surviving; with more competition and less unspoiled game I could see the Human populations not booming and spreading as much though, so at the smallest you might just see some Arctic societies to maybe seeing Humans migrate South and populate the warmer West coast.

Assuming our species develops as we did in OTL, imagine coming across a thriving Neanderthal civilisation in the Americas at the Age of Discovery.

Oog sneezing 52,000 years ago means things are not gonna be similar.

But yes, Homo Sapiens civilization coming into contact with Homo Neanderthalis civilization would be interesting.

 

[Sian]

tangent, but do note that pre-historical PoDs are considered to be evolutionary, which are considered to be ASB ... Doesn't make sense no, but thats what Calbear and the rest of the mod/admin team have been enforcing for the last some time.

 

[Emperor RyRy]

tangent, but do note that pre-historical PoDs are considered to be evolutionary, which are considered to be ASB ... Doesn't make sense no, but thats what Calbear and the rest of the mod/admin team have been enforcing for the last some time.

I'm fairly sure that's not true, and if it is, then I can make the argument that this isn't at all evolutionary. Anyway, it hasn't been shut down yet.

 

[Tocomocho]

I'm not sure what's the date of H. sapiens expansion to NE Asia, but I think it's later than Europe's (40-30000 years ago). So if you go back further you might end with no H. sapiens expanding to the Americas, but the previous hominids in the area known as "Denisovans" doing it. We don't have full skeletons of Denisovans but it's practically given that they are the descendants of East Asian populations of the H. erectus complex (just like H. neanderthalensis descends from the western populations) and that modern humans in NE Asia and Australia carry Denisovan genes as a result of ancient interbreeding.

I suppose the Denisovans had even less advanced tools than Neanderthals and that they also only hunted face to face and did not use range weapons. So American megafauna would still suffer, but also have a better chance to adapt than with H. sapiens, and by the time H. sapiens do show up they'd be used to thinking "two feet = trouble".