Different cold war

[A.M. Turtle]

Bouncing an idea in my head for a timeline and wanted to ask a question. Is it possible for the western allies and the USSR shortly after defeating Nazi Germany to have to two parties fight one another before the USSR learns the secret of nuclear weapons?

 

[I Blame Communism]

No, not without several bloodthirsty psychopaths reaching positions of supreme authority.

The Soviets were on their last legs when they made it to Berlin: supply lines stretched thin, divisions depleted, a desperate need to return to civilian production. They took so much industry out of all their occupied areas not just because they wanted to be pricks: their own country and its industry was utterly gutted by the Nazi invasion and genocide and it took their every resource to defend themselves. The last thing in the world they needed was a war with the west, with America still having vast resources to call on and a major headstart in the bomb race: the USSR knew the "secret" even before America sort of gave the game away but blowing up Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and had in fact encouraged their use, because they really didn't feel like invading Japan, for the reasons mentioned above.

 

[Cook]

For a nation on “their last legs” the Soviet Union had no great difficulty deploying 1.5 million men and 5500 tanks to invade Manchuria and North Korea in August 1945 (The Manchurian Strategic Offensive Operation). And that was without withdrawing any significant force from Europe.

Meanwhile the fighting had hardly stopped in Germany before the US started redeploying forces to the Pacific.

But the Soviets had no reason to fight. Stalin’s advisers were confident that the US would retreat once again into isolationism and Europe would suffer another post-war depression, opening the way for Soviet takeover.

If he thought the US would hang around in Europe things may have been different. Or if Truman felt that Americans really didn’t defeat Germany just to hand Europe over to another dictator.

 

[I Blame Communism]

For a nation on “their last legs” the Soviet Union had no great difficulty deploying 1.5 million men and 5500 tanks to invade Manchuria and North Korea in August 1945 (The Manchurian Strategic Offensive Operation). And that was without withdrawing any significant force from Europe.

The last sentence is the significant one. The USSR had fresh forces waiting in the Far East for a brilliantly-executed lunge against a battered, exhausted, underarmed, obsolete army. They weren't going to try the same trick on the United States of America.

Meanwhile the fighting had hardly stopped in Germany before the US started redeploying forces to the Pacific.

Yes, what does this prove? That the US still had huge resources to draw on? Yes, my point exactly...

But the Soviets had no reason to fight. Stalin’s advisers were confident that the US would retreat once again into isolationism and Europe would suffer another post-war depression, opening the way for Soviet takeover.

It's certainly true that Stalin was atcually capable of making a sane decision now and again, rather more often, in fact, than most people think.

If he thought the US would hang around in Europe things may have been different.

Stalin might have just felt like unleashing nuclear destruction on the people of Russia?

Or if Truman felt that Americans really didn’t defeat Germany just to hand Europe over to another dictator.

I'm glad to see an admission that such aggression would actually have to come from our side. Which is another reason why it wouldn't happen.

 

[Crueldwarf]

The USSR had fresh forces waiting in the Far East

In fact more than million troops were redeployed to Far East from Europe.

Other points is correct.
Help allies to finish off Japan (and retrieve long-lost territories) was sane decision. And starting of another war was insane decision.

 

[I Blame Communism]

In fact more than million troops were redeployed to Far East from Europe.

Other points is correct.
Help allies to finish off Japan (and retrieve long-lost territories) was sane decision. And starting of another war was insane decision.

Thanks for the correction; you're absolutely right. I think the cliche derives its appeal from Cold War era fantasies and that, not any historical validity or even fascination, has given it its longevity.