DBWI: No German Revolution/Restoration?

[AltoRegnant]

OTL, german communists briefly took over the weimar republic in late 1930, as the depression entrenched itself. However, when the quality of life still struggled, people of faith were being persecuted, and Stalin seemed bent on making them a puppet state. Cue General Rommel in 1931, initiating a civil war to restore the monarchy, under Kaiser Wilhelm III (his father having been killed by communists in the netherlands the year before while III ran off to denmark). Eventually the war was won and Wilhelm ruled as Kaiser. Despite being a monarchist(duh), WIllhelm recognized that the workers had valid issues. As such, while he insured that private property and free trade and such would not be threatened, he did also negotiate several moves to help workers, like strengthening Unions so long as they had his personal approval.

Personally i'm more interested in foreign policy. OTL, Kaiser Wilhelm made a deal with poland: Danzig for german aid in a conquest of lithuania (with poland getting memel) and if the soviets moved on them. He also negotiated a deal with China to give military aid like advisors, gear, and forces (veterans of the civil war) in exchange for northern formosa. (incidentally when the communists later tried to flee to it they found the german garrison not exactly pleased on the matter). When French Commune rose and started working against all the european states, though special resentment was made for germany, he immediately started rearming, and encouraged other nations to follow suit.

While the inevitable war with France and Russia was difficult on the kaiserreich, Germany and Poland had the support of nations like Britain, America, Denmark, and Italy. After it, Germany stood with Britain and America at the top of the world, with Germany having annexed most of France's 'decolonized soviet allies'.


So i have two questions-
WI the commies never took over and the weimar republic limped on?
OR
WI Wilhelm was never restored his throne

 

[Whiteshore]

Despite being a monarchist(duh), WIllhelm recognized that the workers had valid issues. As such, while he insured that private property and free trade and such would not be threatened, he did also negotiate several moves to help workers, like strengthening Unions so long as they had his personal approval.

Don't forget how he worked surprisingly well with the SPD (especially considering the KPD persecuted rival leftists as much as they did the right-wing).

 

[Tales Weaver]

how he worked surprisingly well with the SPD

That Collaboration Broke SPD in two as ex-USPDers left the party in reaction to that. The ex-USPDers formed PDS, which is now known as Die Linke.

 

[Whiteshore]

That Collaboration Broke SPD in two as ex-USPDers left the party in reaction to that. The ex-USPDers formed PDS, which is now known as Die Linke.

With one Otto Grotewohl being the most prominent of the founders of said party.

 

[Vnix]

Without the German restauration it's quite likely that the House of Habsburg wouldn't manage to get back in Austria and some of the surrounding countries.

 

[GeorgeUK]

A genocidal dictatorship would have arisen in Germany. A war would have followed, then a frozen war between the west and the Soviet Union.

 

[Vnix]

A genocidal dictatorship would have arisen in Germany. A war would have followed, then a frozen war between the west and the Soviet Union.

I honestly think a genocidal dictatorship is a bit ASB mate, a dictatorship is something I can agree would happen? But genocidal? Nah. Besides against whom would they be genocidal? The French? I mean they lost their colonies so genocide seems impossible, I mean they wouldn't and couldn't do it against anyone in Europe?!

 

[trollolol12]

I honestly think a genocidal dictatorship is a bit ASB mate, a dictatorship is something I can agree would happen? But genocidal? Nah. Besides against whom would they be genocidal? The French? I mean they lost their colonies so genocide seems impossible, I mean they wouldn't and couldn't do it against anyone in Europe?!

Maybe genocidal against gypsies?, i mean, their reputation isn't good in Europe. So, if a genocidal state was raised in Germany (somehow), gypsies would be its victims..

 

[Vnix]

Maybe genocidal against gypsies?, i mean, their reputation isn't good in Europe. So, if a genocidal state was raised in Germany (somehow), gypsies would be its victims..

are there that many in Germany? I think most are in eastern europe

 

[Roches]

I always get confused between Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel and Generał Juliusz Rómmel, the President of Poland. And I have to say it’s strange that we always call him “General” when he was an Oberstleutnant* (lieutenant colonel) in 1931 and he ended his career as a field marshal. He even preferred to be called “Herr Generalfeldmarschall” rather than “Herr Reichskanzler”.

[* OOC: Rommel gets an early promotion here. OOC2: If there’s going to be a genocide, or even an oppressed group, it’ll be the Jews. Hitler didn’t invent antisemitism. Martin Luther wrote things that read like something out of Der Stürmer.]

 

[GDIS Pathe]

General Rommel in 1931, initiating a civil war

You mean Hans Von Seeckt correct? While Rommel was at the head of one of the Reichswehr detachments assigned to take Berlin it was Seeckt and the rest of the General staff who orchestrated the main elements of the coup.

 

[Johnrankins]

I honestly think a genocidal dictatorship is a bit ASB mate, a dictatorship is something I can agree would happen? But genocidal? Nah. Besides against whom would they be genocidal? The French? I mean they lost their colonies so genocide seems impossible, I mean they wouldn't and couldn't do it against anyone in Europe?!

Agreed, there is no reason to assume they would be more murderous than OTL. Someone has read too much Great War propaganda.

 

[AltoRegnant]

Do you guys think the Monarchist Resurgence could happen without Wilhelm III? OTL, Rómmel was eventually crowned King of the second Commonwealth, the Habsburgs eventually came back in Austria, Hungary and croatia and bosnia (not serbia though) as . But the level to which these things depended on Willy III is seriously disputed. Personally i lean towards monarchy making a comeback regardless (Alfonso XIII is credited with averting a civil war for many of the same things WIlhelm III did, and Victor Emmanuel shut down fascism before it could take italy like what had happened in Japan. But at the same time those kings all embraced socialistic elements of society and arose in seriously unstable nations.

 

[ASUKIRIK]

A genocidal dictatorship would have arisen in Germany. A war would have followed, then a frozen war between the west and the Soviet Union.

I heard that Adolf Hitler, the then leader of the NSDAP, has written something nasty about Jews and other minority groups in his first book "Mein Kampf", but they never gained much in 1930 election and was persecuted by the Communist Regime soon after.

Hitler himself was able to escape from what would be certain death by being (very ironically), smuggled out with other mental patients of Dr Sigmund Freud (who is a Jew and from his then hated Vienna at that). Apparently living back in Vienna with Dr. Freud helped him change his ways so much, he becomes a bonafide artist and writes his second book "Mein Freund Dr. Freud", which he denounces violence and authoritarianism from both sides of the political spectrum, and suggested that all human violence stems from their complicated relationship with their parents and their sets of genitalia.

Look, Hitler's paintings are obviously marked for Adult Only due to very obvious imageries of human genitalia and sexual actions, but in a way, he championed Dr. Freud's theory all the way, so...

 

[Vnix]

I've actually read that most obnoxious book by mr Hitler. I cannot understand how he could come to those horrible conclusions. Glad that he changed his opinion after!


I do think we can all agree that if there wasn't a communist uprising and a subsequent monarchist revival then something else would set off the poweder keg that was Europe. Personally I think there may be two possible groups, a revival of the CP and Entente, or a German Russian alliance. Without a strong monarch I don't think peace with Poland could have happened. Hell even with that powerful and friendly monarch (towards Poland I mean) there have still been significant problems and even some minor wars between Germany and Poland iOTL

 

[Whiteshore]

a German Russian alliance

Well, prior to the German Revolution, the Reichswehr and the RKKA were even conducting military cooperation with each other as realpolitik trumped ideology.

 

[AltoRegnant]

Could the weimar republic survive? OTL, the communists only staged the first coup after the US freaked out over what turned out to be a brief recession of the stock market. Could the us remaining calm keep german democracy alive?

 

[Basileus_Komnenos]

Don't forget how he worked surprisingly well with the SPD (especially considering the KPD persecuted rival leftists as much as they did the right-wing).

Wilhelm III though was only using them as a counterweight to the more radical Communists and actual Republicans who wanted to abolish the monarchy. Though Wilhelm III later discarded them as his power and influence re-emerged with the German Army which he helped rearm in opposition to the Treaty of Versailles. Wilhelm III also surprisingly retained the power of the Throne thanks to the rise of Communism making monarchism seem like an alternative to it.

Though I wonder how Austria and Hungary will develop since the Empire was restored under Kaiser Otto I thanks to Wilhlem III's backing.