The Mexico without Santa Anna thread made me think of another idea which has probably been done before . . . but whatever.
The Portugese Royal Family fled Portugal and lived in Brazil for much of the Peninsular War. When they left, Pedro, a son of the King of Portugal, was left as regent of Brazil. His father attempted to take away some of Brazil's royal privileges, Pedro decided to lead rather than fight the nationalist sentiment, and moved to make himself the Emperor of Brazil.
So what if the Spanish Bourbons do the same thing? The Bourbons manage to flee to Mexico ahead of the French. Now things would get messy. Charles IV may have officially abdicated, and with this POD his first son, Ferdinand, may also have abdicated. If Ferdinand hadn't, then he would technically be king, but I don't know how well that would hold up. I think that Ferdinand would probably end up being the King, because he was pro-Great Britain, and I think that for this scenario to work out his two brothers (Carlos and Francisco) came with him to Mexico. Its actually questionable whether their father would come, since he had such a bad relationship with his heir Ferdinand. So anyway, Ferdinand is now ruling the Spanish Empire from Mexico City. The Peninsular War would probably start, only now the Spanish elite in the Americas don't have a chance to set up their own little regimes ruling in the name of an imprisoned king, they have to deal with a real, live, Spanish King, living in the Americas, and ruling his Empire from Mexico City.
Would Ferdinand rule from Mexico City? I don't know if its the most strategic place to rule from, but certainly does have the advantage of being the center of "New Spain" which I believe was the largest and most well developed of the Spaniards' American possessions.
What would his brothers' do? I presume that having his brothers with him in the Americas, he may use them as Viceroys, rather than rely on people outside the family. Of course, after witnessing Ferdinand familial loyalty, I don't know how much I would trust my own brothers either . . .
How would the people of the Spanish Americas act? Ferdinand was an absolutist, and in the Americas he would be supported by the conservative elements from across the Empire. I think that with his presence the liberals would be force to choose between the Spanish King or the French Emperor, and that would maintain support for Ferdinand's colonial regimes.
What would Ferdinand do? The man ruled terribly in Spain once he was restored, but I don't know if that was how he would rule in ATL, since he wouldn't have suffered a 7 year imprisonment by the French. I think that one thing that is certain is that his pro-British feeling would definitely be policy, and the Spanish Court-in-Exile would be a British ally. Perhaps contingents of troops from Spanish America participate in the Peninsular War? Also, with him out of imprisonment, he would be able to marry, something that he would probably do, since his wife had died in 1806. So who would he marry? I'm leaning towards Maria Teresa, the King of Portugal's oldest daughter. She was also in an American exile, in Rio de Janerio, and in OTL Federinand ended up marrying her younger sister, so I think that his marriage works. Plus the woman was very conservative, and IOTL she had a boy without dying (something that none of Ferdinand's OTL wives accomplished)
What legal difference would occur? IOTL the Portugese created the "United Kingdom of Portugal, Brazil and the Algraves" during their rule from Brazil. With Ferdinand ruling from Mexico, would be change his style to reflect the new importance of the Americas to his exiled court, ala the Portugese?
What would happen once the Napoleonic War ends? Ferdinand would probably return to Spain, but what of his brothers? If Ferdinand gets a son during his American exile, then his two younger brothers are out of the royal running, and their time in the Americas would probably make the Spanish Americas ready for at least someone of royal blood staying to rule. Carlos appears to me to be the perfect candidate for his brother to leave in the Americas. The man was extremely conservative, but in an old-fashioned way, refusing to overthrow his brother, but more than willing to fight his niece for the Spanish throne. Carlos could be left either as regent for all of the Americas, or just New Spain, but either way I think he would be a good candidate for staying in the Americas. If Ferdinand ends up without a male heir, then Carlos can make his ill-fated attempt to gain the Spanish throne, and when that fails go back to the Americas, keep "King of Spain" in his titles, and rule an independent American Kingdom (how much of Spanish America? not sure). The youngest brother, Fransico, maybe could rule from Lima, but he doesn't appear from my cursary reading to have been very politically interested, though his line ended up sitting on the throne, with his son as King Consort of Spain, and his grandson as King of Spain (though it is widely speculated that his grandson was not HIS grandson, since his son was probably not the child's father).
Anyway, Thoughts?
The Portugese Royal Family fled Portugal and lived in Brazil for much of the Peninsular War. When they left, Pedro, a son of the King of Portugal, was left as regent of Brazil. His father attempted to take away some of Brazil's royal privileges, Pedro decided to lead rather than fight the nationalist sentiment, and moved to make himself the Emperor of Brazil.
So what if the Spanish Bourbons do the same thing? The Bourbons manage to flee to Mexico ahead of the French. Now things would get messy. Charles IV may have officially abdicated, and with this POD his first son, Ferdinand, may also have abdicated. If Ferdinand hadn't, then he would technically be king, but I don't know how well that would hold up. I think that Ferdinand would probably end up being the King, because he was pro-Great Britain, and I think that for this scenario to work out his two brothers (Carlos and Francisco) came with him to Mexico. Its actually questionable whether their father would come, since he had such a bad relationship with his heir Ferdinand. So anyway, Ferdinand is now ruling the Spanish Empire from Mexico City. The Peninsular War would probably start, only now the Spanish elite in the Americas don't have a chance to set up their own little regimes ruling in the name of an imprisoned king, they have to deal with a real, live, Spanish King, living in the Americas, and ruling his Empire from Mexico City.
Would Ferdinand rule from Mexico City? I don't know if its the most strategic place to rule from, but certainly does have the advantage of being the center of "New Spain" which I believe was the largest and most well developed of the Spaniards' American possessions.
What would his brothers' do? I presume that having his brothers with him in the Americas, he may use them as Viceroys, rather than rely on people outside the family. Of course, after witnessing Ferdinand familial loyalty, I don't know how much I would trust my own brothers either . . .
How would the people of the Spanish Americas act? Ferdinand was an absolutist, and in the Americas he would be supported by the conservative elements from across the Empire. I think that with his presence the liberals would be force to choose between the Spanish King or the French Emperor, and that would maintain support for Ferdinand's colonial regimes.
What would Ferdinand do? The man ruled terribly in Spain once he was restored, but I don't know if that was how he would rule in ATL, since he wouldn't have suffered a 7 year imprisonment by the French. I think that one thing that is certain is that his pro-British feeling would definitely be policy, and the Spanish Court-in-Exile would be a British ally. Perhaps contingents of troops from Spanish America participate in the Peninsular War? Also, with him out of imprisonment, he would be able to marry, something that he would probably do, since his wife had died in 1806. So who would he marry? I'm leaning towards Maria Teresa, the King of Portugal's oldest daughter. She was also in an American exile, in Rio de Janerio, and in OTL Federinand ended up marrying her younger sister, so I think that his marriage works. Plus the woman was very conservative, and IOTL she had a boy without dying (something that none of Ferdinand's OTL wives accomplished)
What legal difference would occur? IOTL the Portugese created the "United Kingdom of Portugal, Brazil and the Algraves" during their rule from Brazil. With Ferdinand ruling from Mexico, would be change his style to reflect the new importance of the Americas to his exiled court, ala the Portugese?
What would happen once the Napoleonic War ends? Ferdinand would probably return to Spain, but what of his brothers? If Ferdinand gets a son during his American exile, then his two younger brothers are out of the royal running, and their time in the Americas would probably make the Spanish Americas ready for at least someone of royal blood staying to rule. Carlos appears to me to be the perfect candidate for his brother to leave in the Americas. The man was extremely conservative, but in an old-fashioned way, refusing to overthrow his brother, but more than willing to fight his niece for the Spanish throne. Carlos could be left either as regent for all of the Americas, or just New Spain, but either way I think he would be a good candidate for staying in the Americas. If Ferdinand ends up without a male heir, then Carlos can make his ill-fated attempt to gain the Spanish throne, and when that fails go back to the Americas, keep "King of Spain" in his titles, and rule an independent American Kingdom (how much of Spanish America? not sure). The youngest brother, Fransico, maybe could rule from Lima, but he doesn't appear from my cursary reading to have been very politically interested, though his line ended up sitting on the throne, with his son as King Consort of Spain, and his grandson as King of Spain (though it is widely speculated that his grandson was not HIS grandson, since his son was probably not the child's father).
Anyway, Thoughts?