AHC: Surviving Dalmatian language

[Nanwe]

With a PoD from the 12th-13th centuries onward, manage to make the Dalmatian language, which died off in the 19th century, survive into the 21st century. It doesn't have to a thriving language, if it's a small isolated language like Romansh nowadays it also works.

I imagine its survival depends on its capacity to outlast the double challenge that Venetian and Serbo-Croatian represented to its status as a living language. But I'm essentially clueless as to how to do that.

 

[Salvador79]

Ragusa-wank?

 

[Arkenfolm]

Ragusa-wank?

Could just be a Slav/Croat-screw. Most likely scenario is a Venice-wank. Reform Venice into a modern state in the late 18th century, keeping control of enough of Dalmatia. Come the 21st century, there's still a few dozen speakers (maybe less, but they're still alive) of Dalmatian out there, and a language revival program is in place.

 

[Nanwe]

bumping for some more comments.

 

[Nanwe]

Could just be a Slav/Croat-screw. Most likely scenario is a Venice-wank. Reform Venice into a modern state in the late 18th century, keeping control of enough of Dalmatia. Come the 21st century, there's still a few dozen speakers (maybe less, but they're still alive) of Dalmatian out there, and a language revival program is in place.

That could work, thanks for the idea. But wouldn't that probably also require Venice not being conquered by Napoleon/Austrians?

 

[Dathi THorfinnsson]

What is your 'Dalmatian'? Is it modern Illyrian? An Italian dialect? a Slavic variant?

Wasn't the word used for at least a couple of these?

 

[Marko]

It is a independent Romance language (though it might be more correctly called a group of languages due to the endemic nature of the dialects) belonging to the wider Italo-Dalmatian language group within the Romance language family.

In order for it to survive you need a South Slavic and Italian/Venetian screw.

A strong surviving Theme of Dalmatian centred on Zadar as the dominant force on the Adriatic instead of Venice would be the best chance for it to survive. Such a functional potential successors state of the ERE could have its language influence the entire Adriatic basin with the Dalmatian influences being felt in the Italian communes on the west coast of the Adriatic.

Another possibility is that Istria does not fall to the Franks and stay in the hands of ERE and gets incorporated later into the Theme of Dalmatia, which would provide much needed manpower and economic base to such a potential state. Though that could create a language duality with both Dalmatian and Istriot surviving to this day.

 

[Nanwe]

What is your 'Dalmatian'? Is it modern Illyrian? An Italian dialect? a Slavic variant?

Wasn't the word used for at least a couple of these?

The romance language belonging to the Italo-Dalmatian family.

It is a independent Romance language (though it might be more correctly called a group of languages due to the endemic nature of the dialects) belonging to the wider Italo-Dalmatian language group within the Romance language family.

In order for it to survive you need a South Slavic and Italian/Venetian screw.

A strong surviving Theme of Dalmatian centred on Zadar as the dominant force on the Adriatic instead of Venice would be the best chance for it to survive. Such a functional potential successors state of the ERE could have its language influence the entire Adriatic basin with the Dalmatian influences being felt in the Italian communes on the west coast of the Adriatic.

Another possibility is that Istria does not fall to the Franks and stay in the hands of ERE and gets incorporated later into the Theme of Dalmatia, which would provide much needed manpower and economic base to such a potential state. Though that could create a language duality with both Dalmatian and Istriot surviving to this day.

Isn't Istriot still spoken by a few hundred people in Croatia and such? Obviously the population displacements after WWII did not help these languages. In any case, I was just wondering how to keep the language alive, if not thriving, kind of like in the various Dalmatian islands and such.

But both are interesting possibilities.

 

[Marko]

Yes Istriot is spoken by some 300 people. I guess I could have written that sentence better, upon second reading I realise it could be read as both are currently extinct.

 

[Qhapaq Inka]

Considering that two other Romance languages, Istriot and Istro-Romanian, survive in the region of Istria, you could have a group of Dalmatian speakers settle there in the 17th or 18th century as well, and presto! Dalmatian survival.