I like the latter idea. A nice, semi-tropical island with a nice city-state on it. Nice beaches and a small countryside with a medium-sized city.
AHC: A Homosexual Homeland
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I like the latter idea. A nice, semi-tropical island with a nice city-state on it. Nice beaches and a small countryside with a medium-sized city.
tehskyman
Banned
Implausible, gay acceptance hasn't really gained populairity until fairly recently
Personally I dont think that this could happen. OP you should go and post this idea in future history because in the history will this ever happen. Acceptance of gay people has only really gained traction in recent years seeing as its only been a few years in most western nations that even gay marriage has been recognized. Id say that going along our pc tendencies and continuing down this path in maybe 50 years this idea will gain traction. It wont happen otherwise.
These two points I think are important. Also creating some homosexual homeland IMO would be a horrific step in the wrong direction, as it says they are different when the entire Gay/Lesbian movement is about acceptance a normal in every society. I think what would be more plausible would be a nation becomes more accepting of homosexuals that more gay couples move there at best, however like most people, they would probably still be identify to their culture of origin.
Dorozhand
Banned
The idea I proposed wasn't necessarily a homosexual homeland, but more of an universal haven for homosexuals, existing so that no matter what happens elsewhere in the world, or what attitudes and laws change, there will always be somewhere that will be completely tolerant. A kind of "Gay Mecca".
If by some magic, a country of homosexuals or broader sexual minorities was formed, I suspect that it would have difficulty attracting settlers from relatively free countries, who would only want to visit it on vacation. It would get refugees from Uganda and angry Russians, and people from various other improperly governed countries. Most of these people will have difficulty getting along, and I suspect most won't have any money. And then the tourists will stop coming.
This is ASB
First, sexual orientation doesn't define a culture.
Second, homosexuals can't reproduce.
First, sexual orientation doesn't define a culture.
Second, homosexuals can't reproduce.
Dorozhand
Banned
What about a Gay Mecca? The idea being that it's a haven for homosexuals around the world that would always exist no matter what social or legal changes occur elsewhere in the world. That idea is actually starting to grow on me.
Generaloberst
Banned
Yeah, but that wasn't what the thread's topic was.
It was about a country entirely for gay people.
The OP used the term "homeland" not country. The two are not the same thing, despite what so many comments writers seem to think. But I still think a homosexual homeland is the stuff of fantasy.
When a person says they are a Jew (as an example) we know they will hold certain beliefs and values and perform certain practices no matter where they are or what sort of environment they are in so there is much which makes a Jewish homeland a viable option but homosexuals have only one thing in common: they are predominately sexually attracted to people of the same gender.
A homosexual here in New Zealand can openly run for office and no one gives a damn as long as they do their job when they're elected. They have full legal protection from discrimination. The sex acts they perform, provided they are between consenting adults, are legal. They can get all the benefits and entitlements that other groups in New Zealand can enjoy and they can get married. They live in a society that is another universe to that of a (Deep South) American or a Russian homosexual where declaring your sexuality could cost you job opportunities or even cost you your life.
There is also another thing that is needed for a homeland: a deep commitment to a particular patch of land. Jews have a deep attachment to the lands of the Bible as they helped shape the faith that all Jews have. Where is the physical and spiritual homeland of a homosexual? Apart from a common sexual orientation do they have a place of profound value and importance to them? If not, there can never be a homosexual homeland.
When a person says they are a Jew (as an example) we know they will hold certain beliefs and values and perform certain practices no matter where they are or what sort of environment they are in so there is much which makes a Jewish homeland a viable option but homosexuals have only one thing in common: they are predominately sexually attracted to people of the same gender.
A homosexual here in New Zealand can openly run for office and no one gives a damn as long as they do their job when they're elected. They have full legal protection from discrimination. The sex acts they perform, provided they are between consenting adults, are legal. They can get all the benefits and entitlements that other groups in New Zealand can enjoy and they can get married. They live in a society that is another universe to that of a (Deep South) American or a Russian homosexual where declaring your sexuality could cost you job opportunities or even cost you your life.
There is also another thing that is needed for a homeland: a deep commitment to a particular patch of land. Jews have a deep attachment to the lands of the Bible as they helped shape the faith that all Jews have. Where is the physical and spiritual homeland of a homosexual? Apart from a common sexual orientation do they have a place of profound value and importance to them? If not, there can never be a homosexual homeland.
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It occurs to me that Key West is really gay, and everyone loves the Conch Republic. Would a mostly gay sovereign state count, or does it have to be a state created explicitly as a gay homeland?
Incognito
Banned
I am a bit upset at all the people who seem to have ignored the helpful link in the OP.
To all those saying that this would be used to “get rid of gays”/”ghettoize gays”, I’d like to point out that according to the article the idea of a “homosexual nation” was thought up by the LGBT community itself, not some “Madagascar Plan” by anti-gay bigots as the “final solution to the Gay Problem”.
To those saying “gay people around the world have nothing in common” I repeat that the proponents of the movement (within the LGBT community itself) argue that homosexuals around the world share common concerns & hardships and thus developed a shared culture and history which they see as the grounds of nationalism. Now granted, OTL the “Queer Nationalism” (not my term; that’s what this LGBT movement is called apparently) is not powerful enough to create its own nation – which is why I posted this as an Alternative History Challenge.
https://www.scss.tcd.ie/~ekapros/files/previous/gam.html
Grey indicates no violence or no available data while dark red indicates high violence. More info at the link.
To all those saying that this would be used to “get rid of gays”/”ghettoize gays”, I’d like to point out that according to the article the idea of a “homosexual nation” was thought up by the LGBT community itself, not some “Madagascar Plan” by anti-gay bigots as the “final solution to the Gay Problem”.
To those saying “gay people around the world have nothing in common” I repeat that the proponents of the movement (within the LGBT community itself) argue that homosexuals around the world share common concerns & hardships and thus developed a shared culture and history which they see as the grounds of nationalism. Now granted, OTL the “Queer Nationalism” (not my term; that’s what this LGBT movement is called apparently) is not powerful enough to create its own nation – which is why I posted this as an Alternative History Challenge.
Funny enough, one of the OTL attempts was something very similar to what you imagined.I'm imagining a colony on a Pacific atoll somewhere farming pineapples, coconuts, and citrus fruits, living in brightly painted art-deco houses and speaking a mixture of Polari and Esperanto
Global Anti-Semitism Monitor 2001-2010:
https://www.scss.tcd.ie/~ekapros/files/previous/gam.html
Grey indicates no violence or no available data while dark red indicates high violence. More info at the link.
If you replaced “a country of homosexuals or broader sexual minorities” with “United Kingdom”/”USA”/”the Western World” in the above quote people would call you out as being a racist anti-immigrant bigot and report you.
Segregate mothers, sperm donation and artificial insemination.
I'd prefer the latter to meet the OP.
Let's include in any list of reproductive options for gay men or lesbians seeking to reproduce good old copulation. Just because it is not enjoyable does not necessarily mean it is not possible. Edward III got made somehow, okay? and not by Mel Gibson.
Also, let's not forget that continued immigration could keep the population of such a state constant even with a relatively low birthrate. So long as there's a Utah...
Seriously though, obviously the gay nationalism concept held much greater attraction for gay men and lesbians in the United States and Europe back in the days when social and legal prohibitions were much stronger and homosexuality did actually mean enduring discrimination, harassment and deprivation of freedom in such a way as to seriously inhibit one's daily life. By which I mean suffering through electroshock therapy, enduring a prison term, or being denied a law license for being a homosexual. As matters stand today, I doubt I would migrate to a gay and lesbian specific state if one existed.
Of course matters are far different in places like Russia, Africa or the Arab world. Now someone mentioned the possibility of gay men, lesbians and transgender people in these places immigrating to countries more tolerant of them. Of course this can be easier said than done, though many countries grant asylum for persecution on the basis of sexual orientation.
However, if someone were to try to imagine how the gay nationalism concept might work in the twenty-first century, they might think of creating a place to which sexual dissidents in oppressive societies can emigrate quickly and easily, without paying substantial fees to an immigration lawyer or lingering on a waiting list.
You'd need a place not highly populated, relatively poor, relatively easily defensible, and not claimed by some other place with a strong military.
Also, let's not forget that continued immigration could keep the population of such a state constant even with a relatively low birthrate. So long as there's a Utah...
Seriously though, obviously the gay nationalism concept held much greater attraction for gay men and lesbians in the United States and Europe back in the days when social and legal prohibitions were much stronger and homosexuality did actually mean enduring discrimination, harassment and deprivation of freedom in such a way as to seriously inhibit one's daily life. By which I mean suffering through electroshock therapy, enduring a prison term, or being denied a law license for being a homosexual. As matters stand today, I doubt I would migrate to a gay and lesbian specific state if one existed.
Of course matters are far different in places like Russia, Africa or the Arab world. Now someone mentioned the possibility of gay men, lesbians and transgender people in these places immigrating to countries more tolerant of them. Of course this can be easier said than done, though many countries grant asylum for persecution on the basis of sexual orientation.
However, if someone were to try to imagine how the gay nationalism concept might work in the twenty-first century, they might think of creating a place to which sexual dissidents in oppressive societies can emigrate quickly and easily, without paying substantial fees to an immigration lawyer or lingering on a waiting list.
You'd need a place not highly populated, relatively poor, relatively easily defensible, and not claimed by some other place with a strong military.
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Dorozhand
Banned
That's not the same thing and you know it
I agree, though, that immigration is capable of sustaining a city-state sized nation. Especially one that is dedicated to being a permanent asylum that is red-tape free to get into.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22856586
In the late 1930's Mussolini exiled Italian homosexuals to the Tremiti archipelago until late 1939. So if Mussolini decide he had more important things to do Ethiopa, Libya, late trains etc and leaves them there. Come 1943and stories of what Germany is doing to the gay population reach the islands. People start worrying about their own fate, they make contact with the allies and are supplied arms. In September 1943 as the Allies invade the south of Italy they rebel and declare the islands a republic.
Today 70 years later the 3 islands of San Domino, San Nicola and Caprara with a total 5 square kilometres make up the smallest country in the world.
In the late 1930's Mussolini exiled Italian homosexuals to the Tremiti archipelago until late 1939. So if Mussolini decide he had more important things to do Ethiopa, Libya, late trains etc and leaves them there. Come 1943and stories of what Germany is doing to the gay population reach the islands. People start worrying about their own fate, they make contact with the allies and are supplied arms. In September 1943 as the Allies invade the south of Italy they rebel and declare the islands a republic.
Today 70 years later the 3 islands of San Domino, San Nicola and Caprara with a total 5 square kilometres make up the smallest country in the world.