WI Henry VIII gets decisively defeated and captured by the French in 1544?

Suppose Henry VIII gets defeated and captured during his 1544 invasion of France, how might the French have dealt with him? A huge ransom would have been a must, but would he somehow have been forced to recant and return England to the authority of the Pope? In regards to this, I don’t think Henry would have followed through as soon as he returned to England, but I can see the French still making it a condition of his release. Another thing I think they might insist upon would be the cessation of Calais and for the English kings to drop their pretensions over the throne of France.
 
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What would be pretty interesting is if Francis I did to Henry VIII the same thing as what Charles V had done to him, namely demanding Henry VIII's son and heir as a hostage in exchange.
 
What would be pretty interesting is if Francis I did to Henry VIII the same thing as what Charles V had done to him, namely demanding Henry VIII's son and heir as a hostage in exchange.
A chance for them to turn the boy into a good Catholic I suppose?
 
What would be pretty interesting is if Francis I did to Henry VIII the same thing as what Charles V had done to him, namely demanding Henry VIII's son and heir as a hostage in exchange.
Why would he do that, first of all? Charles V did this because, well, Francis I had another son in France during the entire hostage situation
 
A chance for them to turn the boy into a good Catholic I suppose?
I doubt that would be Francis' main purpose. But, yes, obviously, if Edward grew up as a hostage in France, he would be raised Catholic.

Why would he do that, first of all? Charles V did this because, well, Francis I had another son in France during the entire hostage situation
Charles did it in order to force Francis to apply the Treaty of Madrid.
 
I doubt that would be Francis' main purpose. But, yes, obviously, if Edward grew up as a hostage in France, he would be raised Catholic.


Charles did it in order to force Francis to apply the Treaty of Madrid.
That was Francis' own fault for not enforcing the treaty and not paying ransom...I am sure Henry would gladly pay up because unlike Francis he has NOT extra sons as back up spares...
 
What would be pretty interesting is if Francis I did to Henry VIII the same thing as what Charles V had done to him, namely demanding Henry VIII's son and heir as a hostage in exchange.
Pretty unlikely who Henry would agree to leave his precious son as guarantee for the payment of his ransom AND I doubt who Francis would ask for it
 
Pretty unlikely who Henry would agree to leave his precious son as guarantee for the payment of his ransom AND I doubt who Francis would ask for it
What is Henry gonna do if the French continues to lock him up?He is in no position to really negotiate, just like Francis was when he was in the hands of the Charles.He pretty much has to agree to everything and find a way to negate those terms once he is out.
 
Pretty unlikely who Henry would agree to leave his precious son as guarantee for the payment of his ransom AND I doubt who Francis would ask for it
Henry would NOT be in a position to argue for better terms same way Francis I was NOT when he was captured by Charles...
 
Henry would NOT be in a position to argue for better terms same way Francis I was NOT when he was captured by Charles...
Besides Francis knows all too well how one could refute a treaty once they are out of jail. He didn’t give two shits about his own son and heir because he had a spare, so Edward as hostage is the way to go.
 
What would be pretty interesting is if Francis I did to Henry VIII the same thing as what Charles V had done to him, namely demanding Henry VIII's son and heir as a hostage in exchange.
I think he would love to do it to Charles if he could, but he does not have the same personal hatred toward Henry VIII. He wants all the allies against Charles he can find and does not want to permanently anger Henry.
 
I think he would love to do it to Charles if he could, but he does not have the same personal hatred toward Henry VIII. He wants all the allies against Charles he can find and does not want to permanently anger Henry.
Actually - what did Charles even do to Francis. I never really got the cause of their rivalry so to say
 
Actually - what did Charles even do to Francis. I never really got the cause of their rivalry so to say
I think it simply began with geopolitics but it became a personal feud eventually. Charles even threatened to fight François in single combat, which would be a fascinating timeline.
 
What is Henry gonna do if the French continues to lock him up?He is in no position to really negotiate, just like Francis was when he was in the hands of the Charles.He pretty much has to agree to everything and find a way to negate those terms once he is out.
Henry would NOT be in a position to argue for better terms same way Francis I was NOT when he was captured by Charles...
Besides Francis knows all too well how one could refute a treaty once they are out of jail. He didn’t give two shits about his own son and heir because he had a spare, so Edward as hostage is the way to go.
the point is who Francis accepted to give his sons as COLLATERAL for the payment of HIS OWN ransom. If he had payed (and Charles asked for the boys hoping to get the money as he suspected who Francis would NOT pay his ransom once freed) his sons would be given back to him. I can NOT see Henry agreeing to such deal (he would search another way for paying his own ransom and be freed).
 
the point is who Francis accepted to give his sons as COLLATERAL for the payment of HIS OWN ransom. If he had payed (and Charles asked for the boys hoping to get the money as he suspected who Francis would NOT pay his ransom once freed) his sons would be given back to him. I can NOT see Henry agreeing to such deal (he would search another way for paying his own ransom and be freed).
Could he actually get the money while in prison?I‘d imagine England would be in complete chaos with the king in prison and it would take time for the money to be collected.Last time something like this occurred, they had Eleanor of Aquitaine as regent.Not sure Catherine Parr could control the situation.

By the way, what is the pope’s reaction gonna be to all of this, is he gonna pressure Francis to force Henry to submit to the Church ?
 
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Could he actually get the money while in prison?I‘d imagine England would be in complete chaos with the king in prison and it would take time for the money to be collected.Last time something like this occurred, they had Eleanor of Aquitaine as regent.Not sure Catherine Parr could control the situation.

By the way, what is the pope’s reaction gonna be to all of this, is he gonna pressure Francis to force Henry to submit to the Church ?
Katherine Parr was a very capable regent and the pope cannot control Henry's behavior anymore
 
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