"What Madness Is This?" Volume II: Prophecies in the Dark

Rivercat893

Banned
That could be a problem too, although I do think having a story where the Jewish characters/people are being treated as "Betters" would send them into convulsions and drive them away. Like how AFAIK, no neo-Confederates liked Timeline 191, it just doesn't portray the movement to their desires. I personally would be concerned with the reaction to media like the Joker movie or the Confederate alt-history TV show where it seemed, for a time at least, people and a lot of news outlets really latched onto them as being objectionable for one reason or another, whether justified or not. The Confederate show got canceled because of the backlash and while Joker didn't I do think WMIT's reception would be harmed from receiving such backlash; I just feel like something that would drive the largest numbers of the types of people you've mentioned to WMIT would be such a rejection by the mainstream audiences and media.
If done well, a WMIT series could be really darkly hilarious and endearing.
 
At the risk of crossing lines regarding commentary, I think you would be more likely to have issues with Dominionist types, who can get scarily close to this TL. There was a rally in DC this past weekend featuring both White and Black pastors of this type alongside Jews, and one guy literally said "Hallelujah is just American for Praise the Lord."
I hope that (similar to Union race theory preventing adoption by RL white supremacists) the drugs, free love and spiritualism* will repel Dominionists who would otherwise positively associate with the AFC and the RU. That's the beauty of this timeline, it's unique and divergent enough that it's full of poison pills that would repel anything but ironic adoption by extremists.

*Don't knock it, I know people in my real life opposed to ouija boards as necromancy
 
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I hope that (similar to Union race theory preventing adoption by RL white supremacists) the drugs, free love and spiritualism* will repel Dominionists who would otherwise positively associate with the AFC and the RU. That's the beauty of this timeline, it's unique and divergent enough that it's full of poison pills that would repel anything but ironic adoption by extremists.

*Don't knock it, I know people in my real life opposed to ouija boards as necromancy

Theoretically, they would probably have a hard on for everything pre-Oswald and be able to wave away drugs as "they didn't know any better." Spiritualism may or may not get them: lots of these folks are Pentecostal and believe in a variety of alleged supernatural powers accessible through faith.
 
Theoretically, they would probably have a hard on for everything pre-Oswald and be able to wave away drugs as "they didn't know any better." Spiritualism may or may not get them: lots of these folks are Pentecostal and believe in a variety of alleged supernatural powers accessible through faith.
So just a bunch of Steelists huh? And there's pentecostal and then there's "summon an angel that's heavily implied to be an eldritch horror"
 
What Madness is This is, in my opinion, as unmarketable as it is enjoyable. It's like an extreme version of the Paper's Please Problem where the premise is so off-putting most people wouldn't give it a try without some good coercion. I don't think you could make a WMIT TV show or movie though without either powerblasting basically everything that makes it good away so that it becomes socially acceptable, or stepping on too many toes that it would be strangled in production.

A book though, if you still consider making stories out of it Napoleon, would probably work. They'd add the ability to give more context to the universe, something you desperately would need. A video game, as mentioned upthread, might work too as it allows for more context and narrative, but I suspect it might run afoul of the Gamers meme and potentially suffer for it as well.

Anywho, 11/10 work, I've loved it. Thank you for bringing your dystopia to us. Sorry if I sound a bit like a downer, I just would hate to see WMIT getting mainstream attention for the wrong reasons.
Your best bet would probably be a mod of an existing video game.
 
That could be a problem too, although I do think having a story where the Jewish characters/people are being treated as "Betters" would send them into convulsions and drive them away. Like how AFAIK, no neo-Confederates liked Timeline 191, it just doesn't portray the movement to their desires. I personally would be concerned with the reaction to media like the Joker movie or the Confederate alt-history TV show where it seemed, for a time at least, people and a lot of news outlets really latched onto them as being objectionable for one reason or another, whether justified or not. The Confederate show got canceled because of the backlash and while Joker didn't I do think WMIT's reception would be harmed from receiving such backlash; I just feel like something that would drive the largest numbers of the types of people you've mentioned to WMIT would be such a rejection by the mainstream audiences and media.
I hope that (similar to Union race theory preventing adoption by RL white supremacists) the drugs, free love and spiritualism* will repel Dominionists who would otherwise positively associate with the AFC and the RU. That's the beauty of this timeline, it's unique and divergent enough that it's full of poison pills that would repel anything but ironic adoption by extremists.

*Don't knock it, I know people in my real life opposed to ouija boards as necromancy
Theoretically, they would probably have a hard on for everything pre-Oswald and be able to wave away drugs as "they didn't know any better." Spiritualism may or may not get them: lots of these folks are Pentecostal and believe in a variety of alleged supernatural powers accessible through faith.
You all have a point in that there are enough poison pills to maybe have my concerns amount to a nothing burger, a la the Joker movie, but at the same time my watching the last decade of ironic extremism jokes mask actual extremism has made me wary.
 
I have to say, I originally got into this timeline looking for Alternate America scenarios, namely one where slaves are freed earlier or the War of 1812 goes differently. The title should have been a big red flag but I kept reading and was really confused when posts about the AFC started happening. Then I was disgusted. Fast forward a year and now I'm on a coked out frenzy with my L I B E R T Y T O R C H trying to hunt Irish sasquatch on my free time for Prophet, President, and Party.
 

Rivercat893

Banned
I have to say, I originally got into this timeline looking for Alternate America scenarios, namely one where slaves are freed earlier or the War of 1812 goes differently. The title should have been a big red flag but I kept reading and was really confused when posts about the AFC started happening. Then I was disgusted. Fast forward a year and now I'm on a coked out frenzy with my L I B E R T Y T O R C H trying to hunt Irish sasquatch on my free time for Prophet, President, and Party.
There's always HeX's A More Perfect Union or Sarthaka's The Revenge of the Crown if you're interested.
 
The only extremist group I could ever see actually liking the RU is the Neoreactionaries, but those guys don’t really exist outside of the blogosphere and they’re all literal schizos so nobody really takes them seriously. You don’t really need to worry about them.
 
Your best bet would probably be a mod of an existing video game.

HOIV comes to mind. Imagine the research slots including new drugs to hype up your soldiers lol. TNO has proven you can push the boundaries of HOIV beyond what was intended. Plus the focus tree would be interesting to say the least.
 
HOIV comes to mind. Imagine the research slots including new drugs to hype up your soldiers lol. TNO has proven you can push the boundaries of HOIV beyond what was intended. Plus the focus tree would be interesting to say the least.
Sir, what have you done?

I can imagine it now... the Republican Union blasting through South America, the Empire of Europa conquering Germany and engaging in a cold war with Russia, the very first atomic bombs being invented and actually doing a lot of damage, the unleashing of biological weapons upon Brazil, the Final Solution to the Inferior Question....

Where's the discord?
 
I think that a strategy game adaptation of WMIT would work very well. Gameplay might cut back and forth between grand strategy management and tactical situations.

The grand strategy mode would be the leader's office, with a map, a phone, a typewriter, an organizational chart, a stack of blueprints, a ledger, and the big red button. In the grand strategy mode, the player controls the nation's leader in first person and can manipulate the objects. Pulling up the map shows the strategic situation in detail. The player can see national boundaries, spheres of influence, ongoing wars and battles, weather conditions, and other such things. From the map screen they can commit military formations to various missions around the world. Picking up the phone opens the diplomacy screen, where the player can execute various diplomatic options such as entering into and breaking alliances or trying to court smaller countries into their sphere of influence. The typewriter allows the leader to select legislation to propose, or choose which decrees they will impose, depending on the form of government. These laws change the economic situation and stability of the country. The leader can reshuffle military and civilian positions with the organizational chart to make the government run more smoothly. From here, one can also purge recalcitrant subordinates. One directs the country's technological progress with the stack of blueprints by choosing what the country will fund. The ledger provides a detailed overview of the present situation and contains comprehensive intelligence about other countries (the truth of the information about foreign countries may vary based on how well funded and competent the intelligence services are). The big red button launches the nukes, plunging the world into chaos and serving as the "quit" feature. Before the invention of the nuclear bomb, there might be just an arrow pointing away from the desk indicating that the leader has left. There might also be a system by which the leader spends some economic power to make cosmetic changes to the office or add new features like a radio or TV set.

The office's appearance would vary based on country.

The office would be turn based, allowing the player to change the week when they see fit.

From the map screen, accessible through the office, the player could access battles in various parts of the world as they become relevant. The battles would look like something from a Total War game or digitized Warhammer. I think that this would be the place to showcase all the world's insane military units of the air, land, sea, and space. Battles would be real time rather than turn based, but the player can speed up time. They last up to seven in-game days, and can be automated.

There would be multiple sides:
- RU/NUSA, with a chain of events to implement the Oswald Reforms or try to maintain the Steelist order in the face of growing popular resentment
- Russian Empire/IPRR, where the player decides early on whether to stick with the Tsar or advance the Illuminist revolution
- Europa
- Nordreich/Germania, with the option to choose among splinter states if the empire falls
- North/Qing China and associated warlords
- South/Republican China and associated warlords
- Carolina
- Gran Colombia
- Brazil, beginning as a Europan dominion but with optional paths to serve as the last bastion of the Bonapartes if Paris falls or as the home of the Eduist revolution
- Worm Cult, with goals and powers exclusively centered around infiltrating and subverting other countries and a creepily flesh-like cave for an office
- Various others

Each side would start with a list of goals. Completing particular combinations opens up different successive lists. However, one theme is clear. These lists put the great powers on collision courses with one another so that nuclear war is practically inevitable. The game starts out in 1905, giving players some time to prepare for the onslaught of the Great War. The War is the first true challenge of the game, and determines who the great powers will be afterward. Then, there is an interval of peace during which players have the opportunity to repair their nations and consolidate power. But, through the 30s and 40s, the Madness draws the great powers back onto a war footing. Most of the later gameplay consists of maintaining one's own sphere of influence and subverting the enemies while preparing for the eventual, apocalyptic, nuclear war.
 

Rivercat893

Banned
HOIV comes to mind. Imagine the research slots including new drugs to hype up your soldiers lol. TNO has proven you can push the boundaries of HOIV beyond what was intended. Plus the focus tree would be interesting to say the least.

I think that a strategy game adaptation of WMIT would work very well. Gameplay might cut back and forth between grand strategy management and tactical situations.

The grand strategy mode would be the leader's office, with a map, a phone, a typewriter, an organizational chart, a stack of blueprints, a ledger, and the big red button. In the grand strategy mode, the player controls the nation's leader in first person and can manipulate the objects. Pulling up the map shows the strategic situation in detail. The player can see national boundaries, spheres of influence, ongoing wars and battles, weather conditions, and other such things. From the map screen they can commit military formations to various missions around the world. Picking up the phone opens the diplomacy screen, where the player can execute various diplomatic options such as entering into and breaking alliances or trying to court smaller countries into their sphere of influence. The typewriter allows the leader to select legislation to propose, or choose which decrees they will impose, depending on the form of government. These laws change the economic situation and stability of the country. The leader can reshuffle military and civilian positions with the organizational chart to make the government run more smoothly. From here, one can also purge recalcitrant subordinates. One directs the country's technological progress with the stack of blueprints by choosing what the country will fund. The ledger provides a detailed overview of the present situation and contains comprehensive intelligence about other countries (the truth of the information about foreign countries may vary based on how well funded and competent the intelligence services are). The big red button launches the nukes, plunging the world into chaos and serving as the "quit" feature. Before the invention of the nuclear bomb, there might be just an arrow pointing away from the desk indicating that the leader has left. There might also be a system by which the leader spends some economic power to make cosmetic changes to the office or add new features like a radio or TV set.

The office's appearance would vary based on country.

The office would be turn based, allowing the player to change the week when they see fit.

From the map screen, accessible through the office, the player could access battles in various parts of the world as they become relevant. The battles would look like something from a Total War game or digitized Warhammer. I think that this would be the place to showcase all the world's insane military units of the air, land, sea, and space. Battles would be real time rather than turn based, but the player can speed up time. They last up to seven in-game days, and can be automated.

There would be multiple sides:
- RU/NUSA, with a chain of events to implement the Oswald Reforms or try to maintain the Steelist order in the face of growing popular resentment
- Russian Empire/IPRR, where the player decides early on whether to stick with the Tsar or advance the Illuminist revolution
- Europa
- Nordreich/Germania, with the option to choose among splinter states if the empire falls
- North/Qing China and associated warlords
- South/Republican China and associated warlords
- Carolina
- Gran Colombia
- Brazil, beginning as a Europan dominion but with optional paths to serve as the last bastion of the Bonapartes if Paris falls or as the home of the Eduist revolution
- Worm Cult, with goals and powers exclusively centered around infiltrating and subverting other countries and a creepily flesh-like cave for an office
- Various others

Each side would start with a list of goals. Completing particular combinations opens up different successive lists. However, one theme is clear. These lists put the great powers on collision courses with one another so that nuclear war is practically inevitable. The game starts out in 1905, giving players some time to prepare for the onslaught of the Great War. The War is the first true challenge of the game, and determines who the great powers will be afterward. Then, there is an interval of peace during which players have the opportunity to repair their nations and consolidate power. But, through the 30s and 40s, the Madness draws the great powers back onto a war footing. Most of the later gameplay consists of maintaining one's own sphere of influence and subverting the enemies while preparing for the eventual, apocalyptic, nuclear war.
Since our man Napoleon53 has crafted some sculptures, this could easily become an RPG game or a series of novels.
 
HOIV comes to mind. Imagine the research slots including new drugs to hype up your soldiers lol. TNO has proven you can push the boundaries of HOIV beyond what was intended. Plus the focus tree would be interesting to say the least.
Sir, what have you done?

I can imagine it now... the Republican Union blasting through South America, the Empire of Europa conquering Germany and engaging in a cold war with Russia, the very first atomic bombs being invented and actually doing a lot of damage, the unleashing of biological weapons upon Brazil, the Final Solution to the Inferior Question....

Where's the discord?

Well, if Napoleon53 approves, and other members of the community want to actually make it, I made a quick mockup of WMIT in Hoi4 using vanilla tags/states. The borders are rough, but I think it gives the idea across.
uIzXpdA.jpg
 
Wouldn't India be part of France?
Yes, I just used the default tags without editing the states/tag names/history files so the names don't match. Unless people actually want a WMIT Hoi4 Mod, I don't think I'd make a proper map. Editing the states is easy but time consuming.

Another error would be with Italy and perhaps the Rheinbund, which Adolf I was proclaimed Emperor of. Italy on the 1936 map is NHRE color, so I assume it was annexed into the NHRE. The Rheinbund isn't, but it was stated in the chapter on the NHRE that Italy, Austria, Hungary and the Rheinbund became the NHRE, so it's a puppet/soon-to-be-annexed territory?

Also, it's been bugging me since making the map, and I've been re-reading through WMIT's last thread to try and figure it out, but who owns Italian Africa? Senegal and Kenya/Tanzania were Italian, but Italy became part of the NHRE in 1934 and on the 1936 map they are still Italy-colored.
 
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