How much instability would come of consolidating Further Austria into a land corridor to the Austrian Netherlands?
King Theodore's Corsica
- Thread starter Carp
- Start date
Somewhere between oh God they just eat the emperor and OH God they are sacrificing his children to satan!.
Ask Napoleon how Europe responds to a major power eating her neighbors. Austria will be lucky to take over Venice TTL, let alone big swathes of Germany. The only way it would make sense would be as part of a broader horse-trading deal (the Bavaria-for-Belgium trade or the Partitions of Poland, or OTL Congress of Vienna) negotiated between the great powers.
The Megali idea is always there and if the Greeks didn't fuck up in otl they would had have western Anatolia.
Is also likely that with the amount of setbacks they having the ottomans might actually modernised better than OTL
I mean in this time frame "the Greeks" as a state project bound in 19th century romantic nationalism doesn't really exist and currently in the timeline Greek populations are not readily differentiable from Albanians, Bulgarians, Macedonians, Turks, Aromanians, etc.., etc... as such an exclusive nation-state. Such a state would only be established many years later after this project has succeeded in all those forced population expulsions of Greek Muslims and others and erasures of minority languages and cultures and etc.. and all that gross Balkans ultranationalist stuff.
If because of changes 'now' in the timeline, the Ottoman Empire is never in desperate enough circumstances that it needs to fund the massive expenditures servicing European debts and concessions unevenly industrializing the state with its acute needs for ever more railroad depots and cannon foundries to fight its chronic wars and it doesn't feel the need to do this by liquidating the old provincial elites that had buy-in into the Ottoman administration and trying to construct from the ground-up new model European-style state structures and institutions- that's already a huge motivation for nationalism greatly lessened.
And if instead they can more gradually bring those elites and notables into the project of industrialization and financialization a bit more cooperatively, much as 18th English and Scottish landlords and aristocrats transitioning into capitalism and the new industrialized form of commodity markets, then I think Greek nationalism would subsequently have far less of an dramatic break and be much more tied within the larger overall Ottoman system. However, Greco-Turkish students, sailors, and wage laborers newly alienated from traditional peasant communities, coming together and demanding real enfranchisement under real parliaments and participation in their own civic institutions? That's when things get spicy.
If because of changes 'now' in the timeline, the Ottoman Empire is never in desperate enough circumstances that it needs to fund the massive expenditures servicing European debts and concessions unevenly industrializing the state with its acute needs for ever more railroad depots and cannon foundries to fight its chronic wars and it doesn't feel the need to do this by liquidating the old provincial elites that had buy-in into the Ottoman administration and trying to construct from the ground-up new model European-style state structures and institutions- that's already a huge motivation for nationalism greatly lessened.
And if instead they can more gradually bring those elites and notables into the project of industrialization and financialization a bit more cooperatively, much as 18th English and Scottish landlords and aristocrats transitioning into capitalism and the new industrialized form of commodity markets, then I think Greek nationalism would subsequently have far less of an dramatic break and be much more tied within the larger overall Ottoman system. However, Greco-Turkish students, sailors, and wage laborers newly alienated from traditional peasant communities, coming together and demanding real enfranchisement under real parliaments and participation in their own civic institutions? That's when things get spicy.
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