AHC: Smallest, most desolate rump state possible

So what about:
The Western Zones join the Federal Republic of Germany, the Soviet Zone joins the GDR.
This includes the Zones in Vienna, except for that weird 1. district, where control changed between the allies every month.
The Austrian government recipes there, holds elections and runs the civil life, because the allies can't agree on a different solution.
Yeah, that works! Not exactly desolate now that I think about it, but good enough.

Kaiser Wilhelm II Boards a Zeppelin and flies to Nauru after World War I reconquering the island with his last followers.
The British Empire inflicts a total Embargo end he is never heard from again.
The British will take Nauru before long, so nah.
 
OTL’s Western Sahara might count. The area currently held by the SADR government is relatively big, compared to stuff like Pitcairn or Bouvet, but it’s got the desolate part down. Morocco’s got all the useful bits of the territory they claim, leaving them with a little strip snaking through sand, sand, and yet more sand.
 
OTL’s Western Sahara might count. The area currently held by the SADR government is relatively big, compared to stuff like Pitcairn or Bouvet, but it’s got the desolate part down. Morocco’s got all the useful bits of the territory they claim, leaving them with a little strip snaking through sand, sand, and yet more sand.
Agreed, little population and desolate as hell.
 
Maybe in WW2 the dutch government decides to move to Schiermonnikoog (handwaving how they'd get there and why they decide to go there in the first place), and the Germans think "yeah, whatever", and just leave them be, because they're no danger.

Incendentally in OTL it was the last German holdout in WW2, only to be liberated 11 june 1945, so alternatively Donitz could have moved there (that's a bit more plausible than the dutch government moving there).

More plausible as dutch rump state is Sint Maarten. Since half the island is French, it could be the French rump state too.
 
Maybe in WW2 the dutch government decides to move to Schiermonnikoog (handwaving how they'd get there and why they decide to go there in the first place), and the Germans think "yeah, whatever", and just leave them be, because they're no danger.

Incendentally in OTL it was the last German holdout in WW2, only to be liberated 11 june 1945, so alternatively Donitz could have moved there (that's a bit more plausible than the dutch government moving there).

More plausible as dutch rump state is Sint Maarten. Since half the island is French, it could be the French rump state too.
Hitler will want to be thorough, so he will occupy it after the Fall of France the latest. The WAllies likewise won't just leave this Nazi holdout hang around when it's right there.
 
Hitler will want to be thorough, so he will occupy it after the Fall of France the latest. The WAllies likewise won't just leave this Nazi holdout hang around when it's right there.
True, it's not very plausible.

Sint Maarten is more plausible. As I mentioned, half of the island is Dutch* and half is French. The French part is also part of the EU. Now if you can somehow not only make them rump states of the Netherlands and France and this happens before the dutch part of Sint Maarten became independent in 2010, it's also the rump of the EU.

*albeit a separate country within the Kingdom of the Netherlands
 
True, it's not very plausible.

Sint Maarten is more plausible. As I mentioned, half of the island is Dutch* and half is French. The French part is also part of the EU. Now if you can somehow not only make them rump states of the Netherlands and France and this happens before the dutch part of Sint Maarten became independent in 2010, it's also the rump of the EU.

*albeit a separate country within the Kingdom of the Netherlands
Missed that, sorry. This could go either way, I think. The Carribean is fairly important, so maybe the US would want to occupy the island, especially if the metropoles fall to some hostile government (i.e. fascists). Then again, just as likely they prop it up as some beacon of democracy.
 
Oh, and while it again fails a bit on the "most desolate" bit Vatican city deserves a mention as well. The final loss of the Lazio region meant that in 1870 the Vatican lost 99.997% of its territory.
 

Dageraad

Donor
Oh, and while it again fails a bit on the "most desolate" bit Vatican city deserves a mention as well. The final loss of the Lazio region meant that in 1870 the Vatican lost 99.997% of its territory.
For 4 years Decima (2.2 acres), a small Dutch enclave in Nagasaki was the only place on earth which still flew the Dutch flag. It even fought of a British incursion.
 
Yeah, that works! Not exactly desolate now that I think about it, but good enough.


The British will take Nauru before long, so nah.
They might wait until after his death. That way they never take responsibility for him as it's technically his territory. Otherwise it's awkward having royalty as a prisoner.
You'd have a mix of assassins and rescuers to deal with, demands of correct protocols, where to hold him, which style of iron mask is fashionable etc - just too much to deal with. . Much better to let him live out his days in his own realm and sieze it as war reparations after his death.
 
Oh, and while it again fails a bit on the "most desolate" bit Vatican city deserves a mention as well. The final loss of the Lazio region meant that in 1870 the Vatican lost 99.997% of its territory.
I don't think this applies. The Papal States ceased to exist in any significant way when the Italians took over, and any territory administered by the Holy See wouldn't come to be for another 58(?) years. The only thing keeping the idea alive was a succession of hidebound Popes.

For 4 years Decima (2.2 acres), a small Dutch enclave in Nagasaki was the only place on earth which still flew the Dutch flag. It even fought of a British incursion.
Dejima I'm on the fence about, as although it does apply in most respects, it is also pre-1900, and I'm not sure if it was considered merely extraterritorial, or actual Dutch territory.

They might wait until after his death. That way they never take responsibility for him as it's technically his territory. Otherwise it's awkward having royalty as a prisoner.
You'd have a mix of assassins and rescuers to deal with, demands of correct protocols, where to hold him, which style of iron mask is fashionable etc - just too much to deal with. . Much better to let him live out his days in his own realm and sieze it as war reparations after his death.
Makes sense to a degree, but would they really play the waiting game instead of finishing the job? This is the leader of the country you waged the War to End All Wars against. And anyway, I think economic reasons will win out against political considerations. Gotta get that sweet sweet phosphate.
 
I went back to look over the best suggestions and try to narrow it down a bit. I found that I contradicted myself by saying that I'll allow sovereign entities without territory (ex. Sovereign Military Order of Malta), even though that's not what a rump state is. This is what sleep deprivation does to a mf. Anyway, here are the best suggestions based on slightly revised criteria and rated on territory, population, desolation, and likelihood of survival:

1. Ada Kaleh. Small in territory and population; not really desolate as it is on the Danube in the heart of Europe; could feasibly sustain itself for a long time given proximity to civilization, though is unlikely to survive Romanian aspirations of taking over.

2. Baarle-Hertog. Small in territory and population; not desolate, located in one of the most densely populated parts of Europe; survival depends on Dutch foreign policy (i.e. do they let the Germans through or not).

3. Fernando de Noronha archipelago. Small in territory and population; only somewhat desolate; far enough that a loyalist navy can defend from mainland incursion, close and insignificant enough to be considered core Brazilian territory with no great value to someone else, making invasion unlikely.

4. Napoleonic Elba. Small in territory; sizable in population; not desolate; will survive as long as Napoleon plays nice? Probably not for long then.

5. Kerguelen. Small in territory and population regardless of who sets up shop; literally named Desolation Islands; will probably survive as it's too out of the way for anyone to put in work to get it.

6. Independent Central Vienna. Small in territory; pretty big in population; not desolate; survival basically guaranteed as the Allies and Soviets won't want accept any compromises or concessions.

7. Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic. Pretty big in territory AND population, as it turns out (Wiki says there's at least 600,000? Granted they're scattered, but that's still a lot); pretty damn desolate as it's the Sahara; has survived for the past 45+ years and doesn't seem like it's going anywhere.

8. Saint Martin (Dutch and French halves). Small in territory; sizable in population; not very desolate as the Carribean experiences plenty of shipping and has many little countries; probably survives, but could go either way.

I think the winners are Kerguelen and Fernando de Noronha. Both are small, at least somewhat isolated, and unimportant enough that no one is likely to muscle in.
 

chankljp

Donor
An idea that came from the video game "Ostalgie: The Berlin Wall", one that is highly implausible since even Castro wasn't that crazy and willing to ruin his relations with Germany for very little gain, but theoretically COULD work....

After the fall of the Berlin Wall, have the hardliners of the SED government of East Germany as well as a group of Stasi agents flee/relocate to Ernst Thälmann Island in Cuba (Which was 'ceremonially' gifted to the DDR by Castro back in 1972), in order to avoid having to stand trial in the now unified Germany for the various human rights abuses committed by the East German government while they were in power. Perhaps in exchange for the exiled officials of the rump 'East Germany' gifting the Cuban government with the various stash funds and Swiss bank accounts that the East German government have overseas.

With the Cuban-DDR declaring the Two Plus Four Agreement that allowed the reunification of Germany to be 'illegal', and insisting that the 'legitimate' government of the German Democratic Republic still exist on Ernst Thälmann Island, and the now reunified Germany be considered as 'occupied territory'.

... Of course, this rump Caribbean Germany would have a population of, at most under 500 people, have almost zero international recognition outside of other unrecognised states since no one would want to needlessly ruin their relations with the now reunified Germany and later the entire EU, and would be living off handouts from the Cuban government. At most, it will become a tourist attraction and a curiosity... But it is unlikely that it will last over a generation once the hardliner DDR officials, many of them already just a few years away from death in OTL, started dying off.
 
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An idea that came from the video game "Ostalgie: The Berlin Wall", one that is highly implausible since even Castro wasn't that crazy and willing to ruin his relations with Germany for very little gain, but theoretically COULD work....

After the fall of the Berlin Wall, have the hardliners of the SED government of East Germany as well as a group f Stasi agents flee/relocate to Ernst Thälmann Island in Cuba (Which was 'ceremonially' gifted to the DDR by Castro back in 1972), in order to avoid having to stand trial in the now unified Germany for the various human rights abuses committed by the East German government while they were in power. Perhaps in exchange for the exiled officials of the rump 'East Germany' gifting the Cuban government with the various stash funds and Swiss bank accounts that the East German government have overseas.

With the Cuban-DDR declaring the Two Plus Four Agreement that allowed the reunification of Germany to be 'illegal', and insisting that the 'legitimate' government of the German Democratic Republic still exist on Ernst Thälmann Island, and the now reunified Germany be considered as 'occupied territory'.

... Of course, this rump Caribbean Germany would have a population of, at most under 500 people, have almost zero international recognition outside of other unrecognised states since no one would want to needlessly ruin their relations with the now reunified Germany and later the entire EU, and would be living off handouts from the Cuban government. At most, it will become a tourist attraction and a curiosity... But it is unlikely that it will last over a generation once the hardliner DDR officials, many of them already just a few years away from death in OTL, started dying off.

I was about to suggest Ernst Thälmann Island too.
 
7. Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic. Pretty big in territory AND population, as it turns out (Wiki says there's at least 600,000? Granted they're scattered, but that's still a lot); pretty damn desolate as it's the Sahara; has survived for the past 45+ years and doesn't seem like it's going anywhere.
IIRC, most of the people in West Sahara are Moroccan settlers who live in the Moroccan-occupied areas of the region, so there's that.
 
Another Idea I once had that should fit the description is a rump South Korea after losing the Korean War (no UN troops, or they simply come too late) that only has control of Jeju-Do ( The large Korean Island south of the Peninsula)
 
Edward VIII does not make it out of Paris and the Nazis send him to Jersey or Guernsey and call him reinstated King or something.
 
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