World War III in May 1946

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Hairog

Briefing continued

Major Wilkes will now take over the briefing.
Good morning,
As General Knock said I am Major Wilkes.

The series of plans we will present today were developed to counter a Soviet invasion of Western Europe and The Middle East...Yes General?

... Yes sir we expect the Soviets to attack in the Middle East as well and soon for various reasons which will become apparent.

Yes sir. Thank you sir. May I continue? Thank you sir.

The best and most complete plan we have is a draft of Plan Griddle.

The Soviets hold all the cards right now and we project that they will overrun Western Europe with the exception of England within 60 days given our force levels and logistics capabilities.....

...........If we can please have order in the room. Please can we all calm down and I will expand on our reasoning. Please sit down...............

Thank you. I know you have lots of questions. More than we have answers I'm sure. Gentlemen please calm down.

This is the best and only plan we have currently and I strongly suggest that we hold off all the questions until after the briefing.

As I was saying, we foresee that the Red Army will be able to overrun all of Germany, France and the low countries in 60 days given our military capabilities. Our British friends are in agreement and are preparing their air defences for another Battle of Britain. The situation is very similar to 1940 in the short run. We will be able to slow them down as will their own logistics challenges. Our plan is to add to those challenges but realistically we will not be able to stop them until we gain our strength back and form a coherent defensive line.

For now that is all we can tell you. Everything else would be conjecture. We have to take inventory of our losses and how fast we can reconstitute the greatest fighting force the world has ever seen... that is currently getting it's ass kicked.

Thank you Gentlemen that is all.
 

Urban fox

How is this playing out on the Soviet end? They've had a year to start rebuilding but to be frank much of Russia, Belarus and Ukraine are in ruins and have barely begun to be put back together there was a famine too around time in the war ravaged areas of Ukraine.

Morale could be a problem in a long war sheer war-weariness will degrade even the best army.
 

Hairog

J.D.Ward said:
A small correction here. "Peacenik" only enters the English vocabulary in a world already familiar with "sputnik". The Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary dates it to 1965.
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Good point JD Ward.

So far Urban fox the Soviet moral is sky high as you will see. They believe in Stalin and the Western nations have given Stalin ample ammunition to fire up his people.

After all the US was willing to start WWIII in 1962 over missiles in Cuba. For the Soviets having a B29 base with possible Abombs only minutes away in Western Germany gives Stalin what he needs for now to whip his armies into a frenzy. As long as they are winning and making considerable progress in conquering Europe there should be no moral problems.

Supply wise they are living off the fat of the land by capturing supply depots which are the equivalent of heaven on earth with all the American cigarettes and chocolate you could ever dream of.

The fact that there is famine behind them only spurs them on. The ports on the English Channel are busting at the seams with riches beyond their wildest imaginations.
 

Hairog

Joint Chiefs of Staff Meeting
May 3rd, 1946
Washington, DC
07:30 hours

Be seated gentlemen.

You few have been selected to hear the unvarnished truth about our current situation concerning our current nuclear capabilities. You will be found guilty of treason if any of this information leaves this room. Am I clear?!

Let's begin then.

We currently have 4 Abombs ready for assembly. Under normal circumstances they take 2 days to assemble and they have to be used within 48 hours or they have to be taken apart some components replaced and then put back together again.

The bombs are massive and weight over 10,000 lbs each. Only specially designed B29s can deliver them. The B29s have a range of 3200 miles. They can be escorted up to 2000 miles. We currently have 12 of them.

The Abomb is so big that it can only be loaded on the B29 by placing the bomb in a specially designed pit. Then the bomber has to be towed over this pit and the bomb lifted into the bomber. Currently we have two of these pits. One on Okinawa an one in England.

Hopefully this goes a long way in answering why we just don't bomb Moscow and a dozen or so cities and get this war over with.

1. We only have 4 bombs.
2. Not all of them will work as designed.
3. Not all of them will reach the target.
4. The Soviets have a very good air defense system at levels below 25,000 with a fighter force equal to ours.
5. They have had 2 years to study the B29.
6. It will take time to assemble a large enough raid to test their air defence system.
7. There are very few airfields in Europe designed to use the B29.
8. They have assassinated 80% of our Abomb assembly team members.
9. There was and still probably is a spy in the Abomb program and they have all the information I just told you.

Theoretically we could just fly higher than 32,000, feet the current operational height of their frontline fighters. As previously mentioned they have had access to 3 B29s for 2 years and have certainly tried and in their mind, found a solution to the treat of a nuclear attack. Otherwise they would be foolish to attack now.

We have to determine what that defence is and how to neutralize it.

Conservative estimate is that we will be ready to use our greatest weapons in no less than 6 months. In the meantime we are at an extreme disadvantage in conventional forces.

Basically we have to hang on and hope for the best until then.
 

Hairog

May 6th, 1946 Pentagon, Washington, DC

Hey Smitty what ya got there?

Knock it off Bill. I'm on my way to deliver this pile of stuff to the General himself. And I don't need any grief from you.

Come on Smitty just give me a peek. I won't touch nothing. It's not like it's top secret or anything. Come on just a little look see.

Well I suppose a little look see won't hurt nothin. I'm putting my cushy job on the line here so what you got for me in return for this little lookey here?

Don't be a jerk Smitty just hand it over for a sec. Don't get so uppity and all just because your the Generals gofer doesn't mean nothin.

Well it means I can show this to you or not unless you offer something up in return. One hand washes the other ya know.

Ah man ... how about a few smokes for all your trouble?

Make it a even dozen and you got a one minute peek. Deal?

Oh alright it's a deal.

File



What is that anyway?
I dunno just some map that the General wanted printed up and all colored in.

Pretty nice huh? I think it has something to do with the Reds attack. It's probably for some briefing he's got coming up. See there it's got how many divisions the commies are attacking with I bet.

Man that's a hell of a lot. What's going on now must make the Battle of the Bulge look like a picnic. Damn look at all that red and not much of our stuff. What do you make of this anyway.

Well the boxes with ovals in them are armor units, the ones with Xs are infantry, the ones with little wheels under em are motorized.

Gees...What do the little x's mean over the tops?

I pretty sure that the xx are divisions and the xxx are Corps.

Man that makes it even worse looking for our side. How about those figure 8 ones?

Those are some kind of airplane units.

This is not looking good Smitty.
 

Hairog

D+10

May 12th, 1946
Outside Munster, West Germany
07:46 hours

Jees Mac how are we supposed to stop em here? All the pill boxes and anti tank ditches are facing the wrong way. What are we supposed to do just close the door in their faces? Did you see those tanks they got. Ours are like toys compared to those monsters. You can't count on the flyboys to wack em like when we fought the krauts. Hell all you had to do was shout Tiger and the ground pounders would be all over em. Now we have to wait for hours and even then they don't show up most of the time. They're busy fighting with the commie pilots and not paying attention to what is going on down here in the mud.

Shut up Jess! I got y'all this far now just shut the hell up and pay attention. We've been ordered to make a stand here just to slow em up and to give us time to destroy our depots behind us. We can't move them and we don't want the Reds getting a hold of all them nice US Army c-rations. I know you hate to have a commie chewing on your chipped beef.

Anyway the top brass has scrounged a bunch of planes and plans on surprising old Ivan later today when they try and cross the river. They've been gitten kind of frisky lately and throwing haymakers left and right. We're goin to throw them a few jabs to slow em up and make em at least look through the window before they bust open the door if you catch my drift.

The flyboys will actually be there when we need em for the next couple of days anyway. Get Sparks to call in the mud movers and punch a few holes in those commie tin cans.

Now y'all y'all..That's yous to you Dutch... need to be a part of the jab. For the next few days until they flank us, this town is ours and we do what we have to do to keep it.

If those Jews in Warsaw could hold out for weeks with only rifles we can do it with some 105s and bazookas. Now get your ass out there and find a hole to hide in. We got plenty of ammunition so don't hold back. Use it or lose it. Interlocking fields of fire. You know the drill. Stick em and move then move back and stick em again. The papers are calling it a "fighting retreat". I call it an ass woopin.
 

Whumbly

Astronomo2010 said:
exelent, i hardly can wait to see the A bomb against the soviets. and start also buliding ICBM´s, much more deadlier and impossible to stop.:)
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Problem with that is in term of missiles, the Soviets where ahead IOLT and judging from their new love for things that fly ITTN I think their even further ahead. Even if the Allies use the old V2's they can't carry an atomic warhead on them, the early A-bombs where big and clunkly, so you've got to build a rocket large enough to carry it and that's just the small range ones.
 

Dathi THorfinnsson

Hairog said:
Joint Chiefs of Staff Meeting
May 3rd, 1946
Washington, DC
07:30 hours

Be seated gentlemen.

You few have been selected to hear the unvarnished truth about our current situation concerning our current nuclear capabilities. You will be found guilty of treason if any of this information leaves this room. Am I clear?!

Let's begin then.

We currently have 4 Abombs ready for assembly.
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Say WHAT!?!?

They were producing them at a rate of about 1/month since production started. I see a figure saying
http://library.thinkquest.org/C003973F/Timeline/Atomic%20Bomb%20Chronology%201945-1946.htm said:
[U. S. A.] Stockpile of nuclear weapons: 9 Fat Man bombs. Rate-limiting step is plutonium production.
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Hmm... I thought it was higher than 9 actually.
 

Hairog

Dathi: Two were slated for testing and probably on the way to Okinawa. I figured three were not completed yet. Maybe that's too high but I think 4 usable bombs is in the ball park. At the top end 6.

I'll stick with 4 to make this more interesting.

Actually I'm giving the US the benefit of the doubt on this one. They actually did not have a pit ready or even planned in England. I haven't been able to find out how much of a project this pit was.

They only had a pit in Okinawa and the US. I have not been able to find out where it was located in May 1946.

If anyone has any information on the Abomb pits that were needed to hoist the bombs into the Silver B29s let me know please...especially construction times.
 

Hairog

NATO Formed

AP/UPI/CBS/NBC/ABC
May 13th, 1946
3:34pm London England

In an unprecedented announcement not heard since the start of World War Two the Western nations have formed an alliance called N.A.T.O. which stands for the North Atlantic Treaty Organization. The purpose of this organization is as follows...

"The Parties of NATO agreed that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all. Consequently they agree that the armed attack by the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and it's allies will cause each, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence, to assist the Party or Parties being attacked, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area."

United States, United Kingdom, France, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands, Canada, Portugal, Spain, Italy, Norway, Denmark and Iceland are the initial signatories with Greece and Turkey expressing interest at the highest levels.

It is felt that the unmatched barbarity of the Soviet attacks forced these diverse nations to unite in haste without the usual diplomatic discourse.

NATOs spiritual leader Winston Churchill remarked, "If the Western nations lay down their weapons, the Soviets would occupy all of East, West and Southeast Europe along with the greater part of the world. An iron curtain would fall over this enormous territory controlled by the Soviet Union, behind which nations would be slaughtered (my apologies to Goebbels)."
 

PrairieVoice

Banned
You mention American forces but what about the French and Germans? There will be alot of former Wermacht sitting around waiting to be handed a rifle and a grenade. They know damn well what the Soviets did to there civilians and POW's during the war.

And then theirs the French. They were overrun easily once and wont want it to happen again. Plus the French learned a thing or two about being Resistance fighters.

What are the British doing? Or the Dutch, Danes, and Belgians?

Will Switzerland still stay neutral?
 

Hairog

Good questions Prairie Voice.

The US and the Brits had the brunt of the occupation duties in West Germany. The Brits time is coming.

The French will indeed put up quite a fight but it will probably not turn out for the best. The Resistance will raise its head again never fear.

The Germans who can escape will become like the Poles and Free French and join the fight from England. A number of the German Wonder Weapons will come into play for both sides.

One of the reasons for this war is to obtain both the scientists and the secretes they carry.

The Dutch, Danes, Finns, Belgians and Swedes are pretty well fought out and after token resistance will have to succumb to the Red Hoards for a while anyway. They will again have to settle for dreams liberation. All of their resistance movements will arise as the reality of Soviet occupation sets in and NATO forces counter attack.

Switzerland will attempt to stay nuetral but will Stalin let her capitalist and undeserved treasures sit safe and sound in vaults and deposit boxes? Will Stalin decide that Switzerland's wealth is based on others misery and feel no compunction about ending such a haven for theives, crooks, despots, criminals and mass murderers?
 

stevep

Hairog said:
Good questions Prairie Voice.

The US and the Brits had the brunt of the occupation duties in West Germany. The Brits time is coming.
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Given how exhausted Britain was at the end of the war and the continued burden of empire I can't see the forces in Germany being that strong. Which raises the question of what's happening in other areas, such as the Middle East? Are the Soviets trying to strike towards the gulf? Or pressuring the Turks? Similarly what impact will this crisis have on developments in India? The more extreme nationalists may see it as a way of pushing Britain out earlier, which could prompt even greater chaos. Others may be worried about the potential dangers and seek to make India stronger.

The French will indeed put up quite a fight but it will probably not turn out for the best. The Resistance will raise its head again never fear.
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The problem here could be that much of the WWII resistance was communist and at least some aligned to Moscow. Many could change their stance when they undergo a Soviet occupation but that could get very messy. Also the western allies are unlikely to trust and aid any resistance group which had communist members even if they are now opposed to the Soviets.

The Germans who can escape will become like the Poles and Free French and join the fight from England. A number of the German Wonder Weapons will come into play for both sides.
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I can see a fair number of them escaping if they get the chance but, unless the war is going to last say 3+ years I can't see much scope for German technology as it would need to be developed and the major powers persuaded to use it.

The Dutch, Danes, Finns, Belgians and Swedes are pretty well fought out and after token resistance will have to succumb to the Red Hoards for a while anyway. They will again have to settle for dreams liberation. All of their resistance movements will arise as the reality of Soviet occupation sets in and NATO forces counter attack.
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With most of them I would agree, but what about Sweden? It wasn't at war in WWII, has a fairly large and difficult country to occupy and decent forces. Rather surprised that Stalin seems to be attacking into Scandinavia as well as the main European front. That makes it clear he's seeking to crush everybody, including neutrals, rather than remove any theoretical US threat.

Switzerland will attempt to stay nuetral but will Stalin let her capitalist and undeserved treasures sit safe and sound in vaults and deposit boxes? Will Stalin decide that Switzerland's wealth is based on others misery and feel no compunction about ending such a haven for theives, crooks, despots, criminals and mass murderers?
Click to expand...

You mean will he decide he can make more gain by attacking it or leaving it alone. If he overruns most of the mainland, including France and northern Italy then he can make a lot of demands on the Swiss but economic pressure, especially in terms of food supplies. He would be pretty stupid to seek to storm the Alps, especially while fighting some many other enemies. [But then he is Stalin;)].

Anyway, looking very interesting.

Steve
 

Hairog

Great comments Steve.

We'll have to see how it plays out with yours and others very welcome comments we can hopefully fill the gaps in my knowledge. I know virtually nothing about the political landscape of post war Europe.

At this point virtually nothing will be able to stop the Red Army from taking Western Europe.

The actual US Joint Chiefs of Staff plan for his contingency is very ingenious and I believe very workable. For the first 6 months things will be right on the edge and politics will not have much of an effect. Later on things will change but for right now "might makes right".

The great prize in Sweden is the iron mines up north and to just make sure the Baltic Sea is a Russian lake. They just might stick with political pressure on Norway just to cut down on the coastline they will have to defend. Those ice free ports are very appealing but the Low countries and France have many very nice ports for future endeavors.

Turkey and the Middle East will wait for how as the bulk of the air forces and mobile units are laying waste to Western Europe. Besides who wants to fight in the Mid-East and Turkey in the summer? It can wait for a few months until he makes sure of Europe.

Supply will be a problem and attacking Turkey will be a logistics nightmare so Stalin feels that this can wait until he deals with Western Europe and doesn't lose focus.

Many historians fault Hitler for losing focus a various times during his rein of terror and dividing his forces trying to do too much with not enough resources. Stalin is pretty single minded.
 

Hairog

What we know so far

May, 16, 1946
White House Map Room

Present the Joint Chiefs of Staff and President Truman

Mr. President if we may get started? Thank you Sir.

We have a pretty good handle of the size of the Soviet forces and their expected plan of attack. We acquired some information from a source in Poland. We have no specifics but can speak in overall numbers of divisions. This will make it simpler anyway as the Soviets have a different organizational system. Their armies are not equivalent to our armies etc. We do share a common military unit and that is the division so all our estimates will be giving in divisions.

The initial overall forces we face in Western Europe are 60 well equipped, full strength divisions. Another 25 second line divisions are expected from the satellite countries such as Hungry, Romania, Bulgaria etc. More about them later.

We have reason to believe that 35 divisions are designated for the initial push into the heart of Western Europe initially heading for Paris as their focal point. At strategic times division size units will peel off and invest certain key points such as Brussels, Amsterdam, Antwerp but most of the 35 divisions will continue through the heartland of Germany, the low countries and France. Once Paris is taken they will again spit off and go for Le Havre, Brest etc. and end up at the French/Spanish border.

Another 15 divisions will head towards the Maginot Line Southeast of Luxembourg and head towards Lorraine, Dijon and split for the Lyon and Marcelle while the others go towards Toulouse and the Spanish border.

Another 5 divisions are slated to head towards Bavaria from Czechoslovakia and continue to Strasbourg and at least make a demonstration at the Swiz France border. It appears that Stalin will decide then whether to attack Switzerland or to try to intimidate them.

5 more divisions are going to Copenhagen and from there towards Sweden and Norway. The Finns are expected to fold without a fight.

We estimate they have over 6,000 front line planes in the fight at this point.

Their newly acquired satellite nations are expected to take out Italy and Greece. Romania, Bulgarian units will take on Greece. The Czechoslovakians, Yugoslavians, Hungarians and Austrians will go for Italy. Their initial attack will be with about 25 divisions but they can provide up to 85.

They are backed by around 850 second line aircraft.

The Poles and East Germans will be used for garrison duties and anti resistance work from all reports.

We do not know at this point any of the commanders involved but if history is any indicator it will be a pretty stand up fight with no fancy footwork no matter who is involved. Manuver is not one of the Soviets usual strong points. Normally they pin you down swarm around you and hammer you to death.

Since the Germans had orders to not retreat an inch this worked pretty well against them. We have been hit hard and have had to give up lots of territory but so far we have a coherant defensive line. It's very weak but we are throwing jabs as we back up.
 

PrairieVoice

Banned
How about the far east? The US will have tons of battle hardened marines in and around Japan waiting to get into the fight. Will they go after the Soviets from that direction?

I wouldn't think it would take long to bring Americas fighting forces up to full potential since troops have only just been discharged and would not need to go through retraining. Plus we would have tons of surplus weapons sitting around. Same with Canadian and Australian forces.

Since there is no UBoat threat there would be no need to wait and organize convoys of ships, plus all the liberty ships and other transports have been built and are ready to go, the US should be able to start shipping men and supplies over pretty fast. I'd say within even 30 days reinforcements should start arriving.

Or even sooner.

Imagine the port of New York. A liberty ship bearing troops just decommissioned from Europe is about to come into harbor when they are given orders to immediately turn around and head back. Ten days later they are back in England being reissued weapons and equipment. Three days after that they are back in France.
 
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