Disaster at Leuthen TL - Frederick the Great dies in battle

This needs a map! :D

I'm wondering about the Commonwealth of India. One of the earlier maps showed that it includes all of the former Delhi Sultanate states. There will probably still be religious tensions between Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists. Another point of contention could be the few of the cities controlled by the Portuguese on the coast.

Keep 'em comin'!

PS: Those New England traitors! :p
 
The past few updates have been great! It's pretty fun to read about the collapse of such a large-scale empire; I'm getting the feeling that there's going to be significantly less salmon pink on the map once the civil war concludes.

A couple of typos I noticed in the most recent update:
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Though here overly ambitious Collectivists attempted a coup in the capital, but were ruthlessly surpassed [FONT=&quot]suppressed[/FONT]. Australia as a whole was move more Conservative than the rest of the Empire
[/FONT]
 
Wooh! You didn't forget to include my name after all. I'm quite glad the empire managed to federalise. It's a bit of a holdover from my English father, but I feel quite a bit of nostalgia for the British empire (or the monarchy at least, you won't find a stauncher monarchist anywhere).

In the end, it's probably better that India and Egypt managed to slip away before the federalisation. It stops the empire from being torn apart by various internal forces, and struggling to fight for territory it could never sustainably hold. Their loss created greater cooperation within the remaining empire, and allowed the empire to focus its efforts where it was needed most. And India being united under a local Indian leaderships means there is a much better chance of it remaining stable and moderning into the future, rather than tearing itself apart in a bloody independence war. Though that depends on how 'Indian' the Indian commonwealth is. Is it a simple continuation of the old system of the British elite ruling over the locals (a recipe for disaster), or an inclusive Indian state?

How does Mysore currently feel about the new Indian commonwealth and the federalised British empire? I'd assume it would try to stay allied to both, as both are useful allies and technically still on the same side (though I doubt that will last). It's not obvious which would be the better long term ally for Mysore. The Indian commonwealth is much closer and better at providing land power (and a more immediate threat should the two become enemies). But then the empire is a better international political and naval power (depending on how the civil war pans out), and most of mysore's current threats seem to be colonial and naval in nature, so the empire might be a more useful ally long term.

How do Portugal and Denmark justify their seizing control of what is technically still territory of their British ally? Is Britain 'gifting' it to them officially (as a reward for their help) or allowing them to occupy it to 'look after it' temporarily? I'm assuming Portugal will be going for a land bridge between it's African territories, but other than that I cannot predict what will happen. How is imperial control over the formerly French bits of Africa and the Ivory Coast and Nigeria (or whatever it's called ITTL)?

Overall, I'd say a very interesting update, which presents interesting scenarios to explore that didn't occur OTL, such as whatever ends up happening with the Indian commonwealth, and a somewhat different decolonisation process in British Africa.
 
Great update.

So is New England a republic now?

Thanks. Yes it is, the Federal Republic of New England. Still pro-British and staunchly anti-Collectivist.

I haven't written much about New England recently, will try to rectify that. But its worth pointing out that as an industrial maritime nation like Britain, New England has had serious Collectivist problems. Not as bad as Britain's but to a major degree that is undermining its ability to act. I'll do something about it soon.

I highly suspect the Imperial Federation, should it win, will gradually break up as local concerns become paramount - the former Dominions and Colonies will be worried on mother country dominance now that they've had a taste of power, and Britain itself won't want to be run by its former colonies, however beloved it is of them.

I also suspect the First People's Collective will be split up between New England and Canada and at the Lake of the Woods and Red River of the North so it's an all-river boundary from there to the Missouri River/Hamilton State's western frontier for the Yankees. Meanwhile, the Pembina Region/east Dakotas and westward would go to Canada since the Pembina area naturally looks north to Lake Winnipeg via watersheds (see: the boundaries of Lord Selkirk's Assiniboia). Most interesting of all, if this happens, it only took a a century and a half for New England to get to the Lake compared to 1783 for the USA in reality! :p

Also, I wonder who New England will have as its head of state now? I'm sure the First Minister will remain as merely head of government.

Possibly, once the threats disappear or the world calm's down there may be movements to break off. Australia perhaps. Though the world also may never calm down.

Yes they will have a President, like the OTL French model.

This needs a map! :D

I'm wondering about the Commonwealth of India. One of the earlier maps showed that it includes all of the former Delhi Sultanate states. There will probably still be religious tensions between Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists. Another point of contention could be the few of the cities controlled by the Portuguese on the coast.

Keep 'em comin'!

PS: Those New England traitors! :p

Haha yes it does.

The earlier map did indeed show that. I've actually changed my mind on this. I believe it makes more sense for these states to break off and go their own way rather than be absorbed into the Commonwealth (at least at this stage). So that's a slight retcon.

The past few updates have been great! It's pretty fun to read about the collapse of such a large-scale empire; I'm getting the feeling that there's going to be significantly less salmon pink on the map once the civil war concludes.

A couple of typos I noticed in the most recent update:
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

Thank you very much.

Thanks for pointing those out will change them. That's what I get for posting it after spending all afternoon at the pub..

That looks like a closer alliance with Louisiana is in order to placate Collectivists in Tejas and America.

Oui.

Wooh! You didn't forget to include my name after all. I'm quite glad the empire managed to federalise. It's a bit of a holdover from my English father, but I feel quite a bit of nostalgia for the British empire (or the monarchy at least, you won't find a stauncher monarchist anywhere).

In the end, it's probably better that India and Egypt managed to slip away before the federalisation. It stops the empire from being torn apart by various internal forces, and struggling to fight for territory it could never sustainably hold. Their loss created greater cooperation within the remaining empire, and allowed the empire to focus its efforts where it was needed most. And India being united under a local Indian leaderships means there is a much better chance of it remaining stable and moderning into the future, rather than tearing itself apart in a bloody independence war. Though that depends on how 'Indian' the Indian commonwealth is. Is it a simple continuation of the old system of the British elite ruling over the locals (a recipe for disaster), or an inclusive Indian state?

How does Mysore currently feel about the new Indian commonwealth and the federalised British empire? I'd assume it would try to stay allied to both, as both are useful allies and technically still on the same side (though I doubt that will last). It's not obvious which would be the better long term ally for Mysore. The Indian commonwealth is much closer and better at providing land power (and a more immediate threat should the two become enemies). But then the empire is a better international political and naval power (depending on how the civil war pans out), and most of mysore's current threats seem to be colonial and naval in nature, so the empire might be a more useful ally long term.

How do Portugal and Denmark justify their seizing control of what is technically still territory of their British ally? Is Britain 'gifting' it to them officially (as a reward for their help) or allowing them to occupy it to 'look after it' temporarily? I'm assuming Portugal will be going for a land bridge between it's African territories, but other than that I cannot predict what will happen. How is imperial control over the formerly French bits of Africa and the Ivory Coast and Nigeria (or whatever it's called ITTL)?

Overall, I'd say a very interesting update, which presents interesting scenarios to explore that didn't occur OTL, such as whatever ends up happening with the Indian commonwealth, and a somewhat different decolonisation process in British Africa.

Haha no I didn't. I made a glossary of all the names added and I realised there are a few I missed. So promise kept.

Regarding your points on Egypt and India, yes that is exactly my feeling. It is currently ruled by a mix of Anglo, Indian and Anglo-Indian elite. This is not a democratic state by any means, but it is stable (at least in the Hindu/Sikh areas). There will be political transitions and changes in the coming decades needless to say (for better or worse).

Mysore, more so than its ally Japan, have kept a very close eye on this. If India had fractured, Mysore was prepared to pick off some of the pieces. In the name of regional security of course. For now its focused on its war and expansion in southeast Asia, whilst moving to take over the former British influence in Persia and the Middle East. As well as making moves in Sudan. It is still not ready to confront Britain, but it no longer fears it.

Portugal and Denmark are justifying it is securing regional stability and preventing Collectivism. Britain does not oppose this. Some areas will be returned to Imperial rule OR if the Collectivists win may be kept. Portugal and Denmark will also seek to keep a few areas (Portuguese land bridge indeed). On the coastal areas Imperial rule is still intact(ish), so Nigeria and the OTL Ivory Coast. The interior has been lost however, and they have no desire to try and retake it.
 
Great update!!!!!!!!:D:D:D

I third the call for a map!!!

Edit: What happened to New Zealand ITTL??

Colonised by the Dutch, though not as thoroughly as it was by the British in OTL. Declared independence from the Netherlands at the end of the Great War. Now it is a republic with ties to Australia.
 
I highly suspect the Imperial Federation, should it win, will gradually break up as local concerns become paramount - the former Dominions and Colonies will be worried on mother country dominance now that they've had a taste of power, and Britain itself won't want to be run by its former colonies, however beloved it is of them.

I am not sure why the British would be too bothered by it.
They are going to dominate the IC in any case once the war is over.
More than 2/3 of the IC population lives in Britain.

I also suspect the First People's Collective will be split up between New England and Canada and at the Lake of the Woods and Red River of the North so it's an all-river boundary from there to the Missouri River/Hamilton State's western frontier for the Yankees. Meanwhile, the Pembina Region/east Dakotas and westward would go to Canada since the Pembina area naturally looks north to Lake Winnipeg via watersheds (see: the boundaries of Lord Selkirk's Assiniboia). Most interesting of all, if this happens, it only took a a century and a half for New England to get to the Lake compared to 1783 for the USA in reality! :p

They are lucky that América is busy in Tejas.
Otherwise, it could end up really badly for the North American IC.
 
I'm not sure the Imperial Federation is doomed to dissolution but I am sure it's doomed to unpleasantness. Its centrepiece and the reason for its foundation is a *fascist government that ditched any real democracy when it decided that left-wing people weren't allowed to win elections; the most democratic the Imperial Federation could possibly be is the sort of thing I called 'structured democracy', i.e. there are multiple parties but they're essentially similar and so the public can only vote for a selection of candidates whose views are acceptable to the establishment. It's difficult to see how any unification of the Imperial Federation in sentiment, having to counter separate Canadian, Australian etc nationalism, could be anything other than pro-imperialist, white nationalist pan-Britannic nationalism, such as would make Stormfront cry out in joy. It might not have an African colonial empire any more (I doubt it will be able to hold onto its African colonies during the civil war, given that the local people will resist and other imperial powers will opportunistically take what they can, unless they're randomly infected by Niceness Disease and decide not to kick the British while they're down) but it will probably have the former Indiana; it's hard to see how the Indianans could defeat Canada and Coumbia.

Thus far it looks like the Imperial Federation will be one of the main villains of Disaster at Leuthen's 20th century.
 
Colonised by the Dutch, though not as thoroughly as it was by the British in OTL. Declared independence from the Netherlands at the end of the Great War. Now it is a republic with ties to Australia.

Thank you.

Edit: Just a thought, whichever side wins in Britain would we not see large amounts of emigration from Britain to other nations in the Imperial Federation, given how war torn the country will be.
 
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It might not have an African colonial empire any more (I doubt it will be able to hold onto its African colonies during the civil war, given that the local people will resist and other imperial powers will opportunistically take what they can, unless they're randomly infected by Niceness Disease and decide not to kick the British while they're down) but it will probably have the former Indiana; it's hard to see how the Indianans could defeat Canada and Coumbia.

I doubt that Canada and Columbia are Indiana's main problem after they sent most of their troops to secure the remaining IC.
The main problem of the First People's Collective is that it borders two much more powerful anti-Collectivist nations, New England and Louisiana.
 
I am not sure why the British would be too bothered by it.
They are going to dominate the IC in any case once the war is over.
More than 2/3 of the IC population lives in Britain.



They are lucky that América is busy in Tejas.
Otherwise, it could end up really badly for the North American IC.

1) Ah, that is what I was thinking of. Having taken the initiative I doubt the dominions would like to be outweighed by Britain by default once the dust settles.

2) I rather hope Indiana/FPC survives, actually. Having a viable Amerindian state live into the 20th century in North America is sweet. I just remember OTL, and TTL's Union of the Plains...
 
I'm not sure the Imperial Federation is doomed to dissolution but I am sure it's doomed to unpleasantness. Its centrepiece and the reason for its foundation is a *fascist government that ditched any real democracy when it decided that left-wing people weren't allowed to win elections; the most democratic the Imperial Federation could possibly be is the sort of thing I called 'structured democracy', i.e. there are multiple parties but they're essentially similar and so the public can only vote for a selection of candidates whose views are acceptable to the establishment.

So... just like Collectivist France. Just on the right.

Thus far it looks like the Imperial Federation will be one of the main villains of Disaster at Leuthen's 20th century.

Evil Britain?! That's blasphemy! BLASHEMY I tell you!

1)2) I rather hope Indiana/FPC survives, actually. Having a viable Amerindian state live into the 20th century in North America is sweet. I just remember OTL, and TTL's Union of the Plains...

Indiana? Sure, why not. FPC? NEVER!!1!11! :p
 
To be fair, the names FPC/Indiana may be like the USSR/Russia. Even the US/America to a much lesser extent - everyone still refers to it by the nation name then the full, official name/title.

By that I actually meant that I don't want them to go Collectivist. :D No nomenclature wars here, por favor.
 
With the "loss" of Britain, Denmark seem very isolated suddenly. True Denmark is allied with Austria but there is a long way to Copenhagen from Vienna.

I kinda wanna see a war where Jutland is actually invaded, Denmark have very much seemed to be a sideshow, a war between Denmark and Austria against Prussia, Poland and Sweden could very much see a Danish army trying to occupy Sweden and simultaneously a stand off between the Danish army at Dannevirke (now much more modern than OTL 1864) and the Prussian army... Think Maginot line just with naval support and a much narrower front with water on each side..

Denmark is clearly going into probably the most dangerous time for centuries imo wondering if they can escape whole. Russia seems to be a key, if they join on polish Prussia side, they can take Finland and spell doom for Austria, if they join on Danish Austrian side, they will have a tougher fight, but revenge on the Poles..

How is Finland doing, they should have a respectable armed forces by now i believe, how is the relations with Denmark reliable/annoyed?

also what is Denmark's gains from the British colonies ? Denmark seems to have 2 large colonies in Africa both bordering British colonies.
 
Denmark is clearly going into probably the most dangerous time for centuries imo wondering if they can escape whole. Russia seems to be a key, if they join on polish Prussia side, they can take Finland and spell doom for Austria, if they join on Danish Austrian side, they will have a tougher fight, but revenge on the Poles...

Seeing how Austria-Hungary is allied to Greece, which is friendly with Russia and is hated by Turkey, and Turkey is hated by Russia. And the fact that Ukraine, Belarus and possibly Livonia are much juicier prize than Finland and Karelia, I find Russo-Prusso-Polish alliance unlikely.

Oh, and look at that Constantinople. Just lying there... :D
 
Seeing how Austria-Hungary is allied to Greece, which is friendly with Russia and is hated by Turkey, and Turkey is hated by Russia. And the fact that Ukraine, Belarus and possibly Livonia are much juicier prize than Finland and Karelia, I find Russo-Prusso-Polish alliance unlikely.

Oh, and look at that Constantinople. Just lying there... :D

^ Quite.

Though the Russians have literally no Black Sea Fleet which doesn't help in that regard.
 
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