Remnants of Rome

THE FALL OF THE WEST

In mid 410, Alaric reopened negotiations with Honorius. However Sarus, a fellow Gothic commander who was allied to Honorius, attacked Alaric’s forces, and negotiations promptly failed. Alaric was victorious and Alaric laid siege to Rome a third time. On August 24, 410, Visigoths poured in the city and looted for three days. Honorius was killed. Alaric declared himself the Emperor of the Visigoths, and journeyed south to take ships to Africa.

In Arles, Constantine III, an usurper, was defeated and captured by Constantius III. Soon afterward, Constantius learned the news that Honorius was killed and Rome conquered. Constantius III declared himself the new Emperor. But there was another usurper, down in Hispania, Maximus Tiranus.

Alaric arrived in Carthage in May 411. The Visigothic troops poured into the city. There seemed to be no defenders. Almost everyone was attending the races at the hippodrome. The Visigoths easily took the city. Alaric died after the conquest due to a sudden, severe fever. Ataulf, his brother in law, became the new Emperor of the Visigoths and prepared to invade Corsica and Sardinia (well... arrive and declare it his own. After all, nearly all Roman resistance was gone.) after securing Africa. However what he didn’t know is that the Vandals were marching east through Mauretania.

Maximus Tiranus and Constantius III fought in Tarraco in late June 411. After 12 days of fighting, Constantius III was killed and his army defeated. Maximus Tiranus became the emperor of the Western Roman Empire. But now the only thing that remained of the Western Roman Empire was Hispania--and not even that, because of the Suevi in Gallaecia.

The Visigoths and Ataulf had just reached Leptis Magna when a messenger arrived. Apparently the Vandals were sieging Constantine. Ataulf headed west.

Ataulf reached the city of Constantine on September 25, 412. Coincidentally, Constantine had just surrendered to the sieging Vandals. The Visigoths rushed into the city and fighting occurred in the streets for 2 days. After that the Vandal army routed. The Vandals agreed to recognize Ataulf, Emperor of the Visigoths, as the ruler of Italia and Africa. The Vandals settled in Mauretania.

Meanwhile, Gaul had erupted into chaos and so did Britannia.
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This is an interesting idea. I've wondered about it myself. What if Rome broke up while there was still enough infrastructure both physical, social and intellectual to actually support some sort of states as opposed to what happened where everything disintegrated so badly.

I'm not terribly familiar with the period so I can't say if what you wrote is plausible or not but I'd hope you stick with this in some form.
 
Also, anyone have an idea which tribe is most likely to unify Gaul at this point? The Franks like OTL? Or the Alamanni or Burgundi?
 
The Franks are in the best position, since they've been in Toxandria (roughly Belgium) for over 50 years, since Julian's day. The Burgundians especially may seize a piece though; the floodgates opened back in 408 when Stilicho pulled together all the reserves he could to face Alaric and left the frontiers open.

The Romano-British were pretty well organized, and so was Armorica - not just Brittany, but everything between the Loire and the Seine. I'd anticipate that these regions will do a decent job of establishing successor states; a reversion to "tribal" rule is unlikely. They will probably even recognize the Western Emperor, at least nominally... they're quite aware that long-term, they're at grave risk.

Alaric is Arian... Ambrose and Augustine will be pretty hostile to him. If he's smart, he'll follow a Julian strategy and encourage the pagans (still powerful in Rome proper), Jews and Arians. Divide et impera. If Alaric lasts long term, his Arianism and the lure of easy conquest will draw in the Byzantines... but given that Theodosius II is currently an infant, their lethargy so far is unsurprising. They hardly did much to help Honorius OTL, either.
 
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The Western Roman remnant in Hispania has the advantage of having the prestige of claiming to be the last true Roman state in existence. ATL Iberian Romance languages would retain more features from ancient Latin or at least among the Roman administrative elite running the state with very minimal Germanic influence from the Suevi and perhaps even less from the independent Basque in the north.
 
There was an actual Roman state that survived in Soissons (northern France) for a few years after the fall of Rome. If I wanted a Roman remnant to survive, that's the state I would pick.
 
Anyway, the fate of the Roman Empire in Hispania depends on not being invaded by anyone else.
But I think that if Romans here are more pragmatic, better rulers and at the time don't fall to some kind of civil war or internal problem, they have good possibilities of surviving. Maybe even taking some of Southern France, some Islands and Mauretania.
 
AFTER THE FALL

With the absence of Roman power in Gaul and Britannia, came a plethora of ‘new’ states. A Roman general, named Nepotianus, led several thousand Roman troops and salvaged what remained of Lugdenensis and northern Aquitania. He founded the Kingdom of Aremorica. Meanwhile, barbarians flooded into Gaul. Clodio, a Frankish chief, invaded most of Belgica and Germania Inferior and became the first king of the Franks. Gundahar, a Burgundian chief, conquered the rest of Belgica and Germania Superior. Priarius II formed the Kingdom of the Alemanni consisting of parts of Lugdunensis, eastern Aquitania, and eastern Narbonensis.

Though Aremorica was founded by a Roman, the peninsula of Aremorica itself was settled by a significant amount of Brythons. Of course, the rest of Aremorica was nearly homogenously ‘Roman’. And vice versa, The Kingdom of the Franks, the Kingdom of Burgundia, and the Kingdom of the Alemanni had predominantly Roman populations, and Franks, Burgundians, and Alemanes were simply the ruling class.

The Suevi, Vandalic Kingdom, and Visigothic Empire also had predominantly Roman populations. The Romans were treated well, and actually preferred being under ‘barbarian’ rule because of lower taxes.

Maximus Tiranus and Nepotianus would have liked to call themselves rulers of Aquitania and southern Gaul, but in reality they had no control of the territory. Aquitania and Narbonensis’s main cities, Burdigala, Elusa, and Tolosa, were mainly self reliant, though, and had been for many years.

In Britannia, various Romans and Brythons created many tiny kingdoms and chiefdoms. Some of these kings claimed to be the rightful Roman Emperors.

In 413, Maximus Tiranus (called Flavius Maximus Tiranus after his ascension to the status of Emperor) established several legions and appointed generals for them. He stationed 3 of them of them in forts in the Pyrenees, 4 of them in forts in Septimania and 2 of them in forts near the Suevi. In 414, he founded the city of Tiranamaxima northwest of Toledo, and made it the new capital. Throughout the next few years he also commisioned the construction of new aqueducts and roads, mainly near the new capital, and the repair of existing ones that were damaged by the Vandals as they travelled to Mauretania.

In 416, Ataulf, Emperor of the Visigoths, died. He converted to Catholicism on his deathbed. Sigeric succeeded to the throne. Sigeric appointed many Arians, pagans, and Jews to important positions. However, it would have been wise for him to convert to and propagate Catholicism. In the east, Catholic Theodosius II eyed Italy and Africa, planning to regain them as part of his Eastern Roman Empire, using religious reasons as a cause for war.

But to the east, Sassanid Persia was scarier than ever...

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Wouldn't the Suevi do better than this? Iirc they controlled about two-thirds of Spain until the Visigoths moved in and elbowed them into the NW corner.
 
Wouldn't the Suevi do better than this? Iirc they controlled about two-thirds of Spain until the Visigoths moved in and elbowed them into the NW corner.
At their founding in 410 they only consisted of a bit more than Galicia (basically what they are on the map right now). They haven't expanded into this Roman Empire because this Roman Empire actually can project power in Iberia.
 
Maybe if the Huns fall we can see them migrate to an area out of the migration route where they can preserve their language? Like Romania, or Pannonia, or Poland
 
The Iberian Romans should have Septimania....
Not necessarily. The Roman Empire just fell and the barbarians are going crazy, it'd be wise for him to use the Pyrenees as a barrier. But then again, like many leaders and indeed Roman Emperors, Maximus may want Septimania just to have more land.

Maybe if the Huns fall we can see them migrate to an area out of the migration route where they can preserve their language? Like Romania, or Pannonia, or Poland

Perhaps. But when they fall the language will probably just die shortly afterward like OTL. Perhaps a successor kingdom is established and Hunnic remains the language.
 
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Not necessarily. The Roman Empire just fell and the barbarians are going crazy, it'd be wise for him to use the Pyrenees as a barrier. But then again, like many leaders and indeed Roman Emperors, Maximus may want Septimania just to have more land.
True enough, but looking at it geographically it makes a great deal of sense to seize Septimania and it's relatively defensible. The Pyrenees you'll note, fall off sharply before the coast so it's not really a defensible barrier in the east.
 
True enough, but looking at it geographically it makes a great deal of sense to seize Septimania and it's relatively defensible. The Pyrenees you'll note, fall off sharply before the coast so it's not really a defensible barrier in the east.

Ah, I did not know that. Well I suppose I'll fix the maps. Maximus should've had Septimania in the beginning.
 
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Ah, I did not know that. Well I suppose I'll fix the maps. Maximus should've had Septimania in the beginning.
Well I guess it's not out of the question, but Iberia+Septimania makes more defense sense geographically I think than the traditional border and Roussillon was a source of real conflict for many years.
 
What's the area in between the Western Roman Empire and Armorica belong to? Another Hispano or Gallo-Roman state or it's just contested land?
 
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