The Union Forever: A TL

[Mac Gregor]

Originally Posted by Van555

How are labor unions doing in this timeline?

are they stronger?

is there any universal healthcare and welfare state?

These are really good questions and the TL has been largely silent on these issues. What are y'all's thoughts?

[metastasis_d]

I can't see universal health care quite yet, but perhaps it could be a point for the united(ish) Americas to build on?

[Mac Gregor]

Here is a rough map of the governments of the TL's nations. Republics are in blue. Monarchies are in purple. Colonies are shaded the same as that of their master. The year is 1950.

[FleetMac]

That's still a ton of monarchists and/or colonies out there, but then again it IS 1950....in any event, keep up the good work!

[Ares96]

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Here is a rough map of the governments of the TL's nations. Republics are in blue. Monarchies are in purple. Colonies are shaded the same as that of their master. The year is 1950.

Who are the Kings of Bohemia, Slovenia, Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary and Macedonia?

Also, however did Italy and Egypt become republics?

[Iserlohn]

Originally Posted by Ares96

Who are the Kings of Bohemia, Slovenia, Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary and Macedonia?

Also, however did Italy and Egypt become republics?

More interesting is the question: Who is king of Liberia?

[Mac Gregor]

Originally Posted by Ares96

Who are the Kings of Bohemia, Slovenia, Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary and Macedonia?

Also, however did Italy and Egypt become republics?

Originally Posted by Iserlohn

More interesting is the question: Who is king of Liberia?

Liberia is a mistake. I'll fix it.

Italy became a Republic when the monarchy collapsed during the Great War.

Egypt was declared a republic when it declared its independence from Britian in the early 1940's.

As for , Slovenia, Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary and Macedonia I will have to get back to you. Any ideas or should these be republics?

[Mac Gregor]

Hey everybody. Can someone please volunteer to make a detailed map of the TL's postwar Europe. I simply do no possess the skills.

[Ares96]

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Liberia is a mistake. I'll fix it.

Too bad. I was hoping it'd be King Cheeseman III.

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Italy became a Republic when the monarchy during the Great War.

When the monarchy what?

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Egypt was declared a republic when it declared its independence from Britian in the early 1940's.

Why didn't they just restore a King from the Muhammad Ali dynasty?

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

As for , Slovenia, Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary and Macedonia I will have to get back to you. Any ideas or should these be republics?

Hungary and Bohemia could probably be ruled by Habsburgs, but the others would have a hard time stomaching it. I'd not be surprised if some of them were republics, or possibly had local nobles (as in Serbia and Montenegro IOTL) or foreign princes (as in Romania and Bulgaria IOTL) accept the crown. Why does Macedonia exist, anyway? It was considered part of Serbia or Bulgaria, depending on who you asked, up until the communist period. Was it some kind of compromise settlement after TTL's Balkan War that brought it into existence? Or was that region freed with Russian aid? If the latter, I'd imagine it'd be part of Bulgaria, along with Pirot and West Thrace.

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Hey everybody. Can someone please volunteer to make a detailed map of the TL's postwar Europe. I simply do no possess the skills.

I could try, some time. Have you considered simply updating the Worlda map? Both the basemap and the colour scheme are very aged.

[Lalli]

I think that Macedonia could be part of Serbia or Bulgaria and Croatia, Slovenia, Hungary, Slovakia and Czech could be republics. But if they are monarchies what families could rule these? I think that many countries don't accept the Hapsburgs.

[Ares96]

Originally Posted by Lalli

I think that Macedonia could be part of Serbia or Bulgaria and Croatia, Slovenia, Hungary, Slovakia and Czech could be republics. But if they are monarchies what families could rule these? I think that many countries don't accept the Hapsburgs.

I think the Hungarians and the Czech might accept Habsburg rulers, since they were favoured by the Austrians post-1848.

[Mac Gregor]

Originally Posted by Lalli

I think that Macedonia could be part of Serbia or Bulgaria and Croatia, Slovenia, Hungary, Slovakia and Czech could be republics. But if they are monarchies what families could rule these? I think that many countries don't accept the Hapsburgs.

Originally Posted by Ares96

I think the Hungarians and the Czech might accept Habsburg rulers, since they were favoured by the Austrians post-1848.

Yeah, I leaning towards making Macedonia become part of the Kingdom of Serbia. My original thinking was that Croatia, Slovenia, Hungary, Slovakia and Czech would be monarchies because they are sandwiched between Germany and Russia which are monarchies albeit consititional ones. What if a friendly Hapsburg was placed on the Hungarian throne, and Hohenzollern princes or dukes on the thrones of Bohemia and Slovakia. Would the Czechs and Slovaks accept this? I think there is a good chance that Croatia and Slovenia become republics due to thier proximity to the Republic of Italy and thier lack of a native nobility. Y'all's thoughts?

[metastasis_d]

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Yeah, I leaning towards making Macedonia become part of the Kingdom of Serbia. My original thinking was that Croatia, Slovenia, Hungary, Slovakia and Czech would be monarchies because they are sandwiched between Germany and Russia which are monarchies albeit consititional ones. What if a friendly Hapsburg was placed on the Hungarian throne, and Hohenzollern princes or dukes on the thrones of Bohemia and Slovakia. Would the Czechs and Slovaks accept this? I think there is a good chance that Croatia and Slovenia become republics due to thier proximity to the Republic of Italy and thier lack of a native nobility. Y'all's thoughts?

What about a united set of confederated monarchies/republics kind of like the Malaysian government? Maybe with a council like what Switzerland has, made up of elected representatives in Croatia and Slovenia, with a hereditary representative for the Serbian, Hungarian, Czech and Macedonia kingdoms? With that you could mix and match monarchies with republics, and pick where the seat of government is.

[Ares96]

Originally Posted by metastasis_d

What about a united set of confederated monarchies/republics kind of like the Malaysian government? Maybe with a council like what Switzerland has, made up of elected representatives in Croatia and Slovenia, with a hereditary representative for the Serbian, Hungarian, Czech and Macedonia kingdoms? With that you could mix and match monarchies with republics, and pick where the seat of government is.

Certainly is interesting, but I doubt that so many Balkan nationalities (and Hungary and Czechia, too) would want to give up their sovereignty to a federation. I think they'd be separate.

[Ares96]

Originally Posted by Mac Gregor

Here is a rough map of the governments of the TL's nations. Republics are in blue. Monarchies are in purple. Colonies are shaded the same as that of their master. The year is 1950.

I also spot a Communist state (presumably) in the Mascarenes, and an anarchy (I don't know?) in Severnaya Zemlya.

[Mac Gregor]

Originally Posted by metastasis_d

What about a united set of confederated monarchies/republics kind of like the Malaysian government? Maybe with a council like what Switzerland has, made up of elected representatives in Croatia and Slovenia, with a hereditary representative for the Serbian, Hungarian, Czech and Macedonia kingdoms? With that you could mix and match monarchies with republics, and pick where the seat of government is.

That would be a very cool setup but it strikes me as being to far fetched. I don't know why those different nationalities would want to be yoked together espeically if they have different government types.

[metastasis_d]

Very true, the ethnic/national identities would in all likelihood prevent them from cooperating well.

I don't know what you oughta do with the Balkans.

[History_Pintobean]

How are labor unions doing in this timeline

historically since the late 1700's and early 1800's once labor rights started becoming an issue in American politics, trade unions were first and foremost illegal to form on account of the fact that they allegedly represented a conspiracy to stop working, against the employer and his/her interests.

Once labor unions were finally made legal later on, the issue shifted to labor union strikes and their legality, as well as concerted efforts by employers to union bust and generally stop the spread of unionism to the workplace.

After the fall of the Paris Commune of 1871, a VERY important event for the world, Labor Unionism shifted more towards the left, while most were more conservative, but nonetheless anarchists, and especially communists formed their own parties and/or trade unions.

I highly doubt that labor unionism would be "better" in The Union Forever, unless that is what you are going for, and there are a bevy of ways to achieve such a scenario.

Anyways, great point of divergence and ideas! I hope to see more.

[nlucasm]

Hello MacGregor:

a couple ideas about the end of the war:

~ Chile don't want territories
~ Ecuador/Peru territories dispute will be sumbited to a neutral arbitration
(No territorial ambitions by the winners)
~ surrender of the militar and politic leadership of Bolivia and Peru to the FA (you can have TTL Alt-Nüremberg) - blame them and no the counties
~ free elections under international supervision and subscription for the new goverments of the Charter of the Free Americas
~ severe delimitation of Bolivia and Peru armed forces.
~ No or very small reparation to Chile and Bolivia

(the best way for Chile to have a secure north border is with prosper and democretics neighbors)


another idea: have you an TTL equivalent to the Statue of Liberty?
why don't have outside the FA (don't remember how you call it in the 2011 part) headquarters in Havana big statue offered by the Chilean people to the people of the free Americas?

again, thanks for your work, for making it the place were TTL Free Americas were born (it's easy to have an evil Chile who screw his neighbors) and for the victory in the war

[Mac Gregor]

Originally Posted by nlucasm

Hello MacGregor:

a couple ideas about the end of the war:

~ Chile don't want territories
~ Ecuador/Peru territories dispute will be sumbited to a neutral arbitration
(No territorial ambitions by the winners)
~ surrender of the militar and politic leadership of Bolivia and Peru to the FA (you can have TTL Alt-Nüremberg) - blame them and no the counties
~ free elections under international supervision and subscription for the new goverments of the Charter of the Free Americas
~ severe delimitation of Bolivia and Peru armed forces.
~ No or very small reparation to Chile and Bolivia

(the best way for Chile to have a secure north border is with prosper and democretics neighbors)


another idea: have you an TTL equivalent to the Statue of Liberty?
why don't have outside the FA (don't remember how you call it in the 2011 part) headquarters in Havana big statue offered by the Chilean people to the people of the free Americas?

again, thanks for your work, for making it the place were TTL Free Americas were born (it's easy to have an evil Chile who screw his neighbors) and for the victory in the war

Good ideas, I think you will find some of them in the final peace settlement. I also like the idea of Chile donating a statue at for the Free Americas headquarters in Havanna. Cheers!