Texas...under the Union Jack.

Here's a thought......Texas becomes an independent state in 1836. This fledging Republic with Legations in both London and Paris, as well as Washington has mounting debts of over $10,000,000. Instead of looking towards the USA and accepting the annexation of 1845 and the American offer of taking on these debts .....looked towards Britain and accepted Britain's (and France's) offer to guarantee Texas' borders with the USA thus preserving it's integrity as an independent state; and, in the process becomes a market for british goods and capital.

Now, I know much British investment went into the USA during the 19th Century, but you could never say the USA was part of this informal empire concept. The mid-19th Century saw the growth of Britain's 'informal empire' with British investment streaming across the world to places not directly under British rule. Argentina, Greece, Egypt (before it became a possession) Chile, Peru, Brazil, Portugal, Mexico, the eastern Meditterranean, Spain, Siam and China were all part of Britain's 'informal empire' based on the merits of Free Trade and Investment. Britain invested heavily in all these areas in railways, mining, shipping, machinery, floating Governmental loans, underwriting insurance and developing agriculture and industry. Apparently, only one sixth of British credit abroad went into the Empire between 1815-80, the rest....went everywhere else.Texas was seen by British businessman and investors as a new market.....a prime candidate for this growth of investment abroad, another way in which those chaps in the City of London could make lots more pots of cash. Britain did make overtures towards the Texans in regards to loans and investment but, the Texans, by and large, resisted and threw in their lot with the US.

But what would the world be like with an independent Texas heavily supported by Britain, her biggest creditor....a Texas under British influence, politically, financially and economically. What would the United States have become and how would it have affected the American Civil War, if at all.
 
Part of the appeal of joining the Union, as I understand it, is that the vast majority of 'Texicans' were Americans, and as such they wanted to live under their birth flag.
 
I've speculated on this a few times. It's no secret that Texas started to court both Britain and France after the US rejected their first annexation offer.

You'd have to have the US formally reject the annexation proposal in 1844 to begin with, not really hard considering the state of the Union at the time. Convincing Britain that Texas is worth investing in, is more difficult. At the time, it presents more problems than profit. Not to mention the slavery issue would alienate some of Britain's society.

As for an independent Texas and the Civil War? First of all, I believe it would occur earlier. An independent Texas pretty much stops the westward expansion of slavery in the United States and the uneven Senate will come to bear much sooner. Mid-1850's I'd say.

A smaller South would pretty much mean a quicker northern victory. Three years I'd say, though this brief period of time would be a godsend for Texas in terms of trade. Informally selling Southern Cotton to Europe, while running guns to the rebels, they'd stand to make a huge profit as the middleman, especially if Britain's keeping any US threats at bay.
 
I've speculated on this a few times. It's no secret that Texas started to court both Britain and France after the US rejected their first annexation offer.

You'd have to have the US formally reject the annexation proposal in 1844 to begin with, not really hard considering the state of the Union at the time. Convincing Britain that Texas is worth investing in, is more difficult. At the time, it presents more problems than profit. Not to mention the slavery issue would alienate some of Britain's society.

As for an independent Texas and the Civil War? First of all, I believe it would occur earlier. An independent Texas pretty much stops the westward expansion of slavery in the United States and the uneven Senate will come to bear much sooner. Mid-1850's I'd say.

A smaller South would pretty much mean a quicker northern victory. Three years I'd say, though this brief period of time would be a godsend for Texas in terms of trade. Informally selling Southern Cotton to Europe, while running guns to the rebels, they'd stand to make a huge profit as the middleman, especially if Britain's keeping any US threats at bay.

I read about Britain's informal empire in an economic history of the Empire some years ago while at University. British incursions into Texas interested me the most because of it's ramifications on the course of development of the United States and perhaps the Civil War. Perhaps, if a Texan Republic succeeded in remaining neutral during the Civil War, as you say, they could do rather well out of it from an economic perspective. With respect, I don't know a great deal in regard to Texan history, but have been finding reading concerning the Legations most interesting.

In regard to the attractivness of Texas as a market for the British investor, as far as I am aware Britain was willing to invest and saw Texas as a potential market. Britain in those days never missed a chance in prising open a market for British goods; hence their support for South American independence from Spain and Portugal some decades earlier. Equally, Britain was willing to invest in the most unlikely of places where they saw potential, in Argentina and Peru, Britain almost single handedly developed the mining industry through providing loans and expertise. I'm sure Britain's willingless to mediate in discussion over Texas' borders was a sign that the British saw Texas as one of these 'areas of potential'
 
On the other hand Britain quite often was reluctant to take on new territory where it could farm the running off to a friendly power. Colonies cost after all
 
I'm not talking about colonies so much, or Britain maintaining a presence in Texas or colouring Texas pink on the world map. I'm really referring to the 'informal empire'. It's true Britain did have a reluctance in taking on new territories, as Uganda's history within the Empire is a good example. In contrast, the informal empire was an empire of pure commerce, Britain's 'sphere of influence', which existed alongside the formal one. Potentially,Texas could have been quite feasibly part of that, considering British commercial intentions in the area and it's relations with the Texan Republic.
 
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IMHO the informal Empire is why I believe the British Empire to be one of the most successful in history, even today Britain is still one of the largest investors.
 
Huston would have a fantastic cricket ground.

Yes indeed, I'm sure they would; and perhaps would still beat England. No, hang on....England have just won the Ashes....I'm doing them a diservice. Apologies to all those Cricket fans out there!
 
Yes indeed, I'm sure they would; and perhaps would still beat England. No, hang on....England have just won the Ashes....I'm doing them a diservice. Apologies to all those Cricket fans out there!

Mmm. maybe not cricket but a sport like rugby or soccer could become much more popular in an independent Texas. IOTL they were spread across the globe due to Britain's presence everywhere.
 

Dure

Banned
Cricket was fantastically popular in the states in OTL interest only waned when the British decided the USA was not allowed to play international cricket with Empire nations.

Unlikely but completely true.
 

Faraday Cage

So a British backed independent Texas would probably never see cricket fade in popularity, as ostensibly as part of the informal empire and maybe the commonwealth equivalent later on they would be included in the international cricket organization?
 
Maybe if things would've worked out, we could have been looking forward to a England v Texas Test Match at Lord's this summer...and not the usual round of 'leather on willow' against India, Australia or Pakistan. However, I don't think any nations of the informal empire are now cricketing nations. All first rate cricket playing nations were once Imperial possessions. Having said that, Rugby, another 'great British pastime' was exported to Argentina, which was part of the informal empire. The Argentine national team...the 'Pumas' are a very good Rugby team competing against the best in the world. Maybe we could've have seen Texas indulging in a bit of 'rugger'.....
 
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I've seen cricket played here in Austin. Though, I think even our baseball's too long!

Houston, who did want annexation, alternated Presidencies with Lamar, who didn't. Maybe if Houston got sick or died, you could find a scenario to keep us in.

I think an independent Texas would see overlapping influence between the US, UK, and even France somewhat, with US influence rising as its economy grew to rival the UK's.

Road and rail would be behindhand of OTL, though. OTOH, we wouldn't have the usual Southern post-reconstruction butchery of our constitution that we have OTL, because we woul've been unoccupied. On the third hand, we certainly would've stayed slave alot longer than to OTL's Juneteenth.
 

Highlander

Banned
What do you guess would happen in Europe in this theoretical timeline?

I've speculated on this a few times. It's no secret that Texas started to court both Britain and France after the US rejected their first annexation offer.

You'd have to have the US formally reject the annexation proposal in 1844 to begin with, not really hard considering the state of the Union at the time. Convincing Britain that Texas is worth investing in, is more difficult. At the time, it presents more problems than profit. Not to mention the slavery issue would alienate some of Britain's society.

As for an independent Texas and the Civil War? First of all, I believe it would occur earlier. An independent Texas pretty much stops the westward expansion of slavery in the United States and the uneven Senate will come to bear much sooner. Mid-1850's I'd say.

A smaller South would pretty much mean a quicker northern victory. Three years I'd say, though this brief period of time would be a godsend for Texas in terms of trade. Informally selling Southern Cotton to Europe, while running guns to the rebels, they'd stand to make a huge profit as the middleman, especially if Britain's keeping any US threats at bay.
 
Mmm. maybe not cricket but a sport like rugby or soccer could become much more popular in an independent Texas. IOTL they were spread across the globe due to Britain's presence everywhere.

Hmmm... Friday Night Lights is about high school rugby... that would be fun... :D
 
Yes indeed, I'm sure they would; and perhaps would still beat England. No, hang on....England have just won the Ashes....I'm doing them a diservice. Apologies to all those Cricket fans out there!

I salivate at the alternate possibility of Nolan Ryan, Ernie Banks, Roger Clemens, and Frank Robinson competing for being the greatest cricket player in world history. Texas loves its sports and you would be unleashing a monster the likes of which the empire has ever seen.

Our rugby team is a historical who’s who of football all stars and would surely be among the elite, if not the best…
Earl Campbell, Ricky Williams, Tommy Nobis, Vince Young, Cedric Benson, Bryan Orakpo, Derrick Johnson, Roy Williams, Quentin Jammer, John KImbraugh, John David Crow, Dat Nguyen, Aaron Glenn, Yale Lary, Sammy Baugh, LaDanian Tomlinson, Davey O’Brien, Doak Walker, Andre Ware, Dave Klingler, Zach Thomas, Michael Crabtree, Graham Harrell, Wes Welker, Drew Brees, Erick Dickerson, Priest Holmes, and Adrian Peterson just to name a few.
 
I salivate at the alternate possibility of Nolan Ryan, Ernie Banks, Roger Clemens, and Frank Robinson competing for being the greatest cricket player in world history. Texas loves its sports and you would be unleashing a monster the likes of which the empire has ever seen.

Our rugby team is a historical who’s who of football all stars and would surely be among the elite, if not the best…
Earl Campbell, Ricky Williams, Tommy Nobis, Vince Young, Cedric Benson, Bryan Orakpo, Derrick Johnson, Roy Williams, Quentin Jammer, John KImbraugh, John David Crow, Dat Nguyen, Aaron Glenn, Yale Lary, Sammy Baugh, LaDanian Tomlinson, Davey O’Brien, Doak Walker, Andre Ware, Dave Klingler, Zach Thomas, Michael Crabtree, Graham Harrell, Wes Welker, Drew Brees, Erick Dickerson, Priest Holmes, and Adrian Peterson just to name a few.

Hmmmm.......it would be interesting to see a Texan side in either Cricket or Rugby. The level of enthusiasm in which Americans in general show in their chosen sports, I'm sure would add another dimension to either sport. I've checked out some of the chaps you mentioned above and they seem quite prolific in their sports.

It would be interesting to see the likes of Nolan Ryan et al coming up against Cricketers the likes of Ian Botham, Len Hutton, Allen Lamb, Darren Gough and the great W.G. Grace (England), Imran Khan (Pakistan) Merv Hughes and Shane Warne (Australia) Kapil Dev (India) and a whole host of others from Sri Lanka, Zimbabwe, New Zealand, West Indies, and South Africa. Similarly, for Rugby, England, Ireland, France, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa all have good teams.

So, if you every do want to leave the Union and fancy joining the Commonwealth at any point....just pop down to Marlborough House in London and we'll sign you up and we'll head down to Lord's for a game...it's not far. You'll have to be quick though, Sudan, Algeria, Rwanda and Madagascar might be ahead of you in the queue.
 
Cricket isn't a popular or national sport in Canada right? So I'm not sure why it would be in a British aligned Texas. Unless you could reverse Dure's point about that being the fault of the British not allowing American participation in international fixtures.
 
Im interested in what a pro-British Texas would mean in terms of South America. Surely Mexico or an independent Texas would make a tilt at dominating its neighbour economically or militarily considering their history. Would Texas evolve into a kind of southern Canada? What would be these two nations relationship look like?
 
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