Commonwealth of America

I was imagining a TL where the American Founding Fathers reached an agreement with the British government. They agreed that the Thirteen Colonies would become a semi-independent state responsible for its own domestic policy and taxation. This new nation must accept the British monarch as head of state, but is run in practice by a semi-Westminster system headed by a Prime Minister.
Liberal and Conservative parties form, but have different platforms than in Britain.
The Liberals are pro-centralization and want to build up industry, while the Conservatives believe the individual states should wield greater power and pull support from the old planter families of the South.

I don't know how they come to such a resolution yet, but I have an idea of what takes place afterwards.
The Louisiana Territory is added to the Colonies' holdings after Napoleon is defeated, and in the 1830s, Upper Canada joins the young nation. A decade later, a series of rebellions break out in the South due to the push in Parliament to abolish slavery.
They gained full independence in the 1820s.

How would this change American culture and history?
 
Apart from the full independence part, this is singularly similar to North America as envisioned by Dreyfus and Turtledove in The Two Georges. I'd suggest grabbing a copy of that novel and take it from there.
 
I'd imagine that one of the biggest changes would be to how Manifest Destiny would play out, assuming that it happened, if slavery actually ended in the 1820s that would put it well before the annexation of the otl Southwest US. In ttl I'd imagine that those territories would either stay Mexican or go independent under the either a Hispanic population or a pro-slavery filibusterer. Also Britain would probably never bother colonizing Australia or New Zealand.
 
I'd imagine that one of the biggest changes would be to how Manifest Destiny would play out, assuming that it happened, if slavery actually ended in the 1820s that would put it well before the annexation of the otl Southwest US. In ttl I'd imagine that those territories would either stay Mexican or go independent under the either a Hispanic population or a pro-slavery filibusterer. Also Britain would probably never bother colonizing Australia or New Zealand.
Cool. Who else might grab Australia and New Zealand then? The Dutch? (Might overstretch them a little...)
No Manifest Destiny, the prairies stay remotely Hispanic / independent, earlier abolition of slavery, means a more industrial US.
Perhaps even one with a seriously organised labour movement and its own Labour Party later on?
What about expansion Northwestwards? Alaska stays Russian? The vast woodlands, would the Commonwealth venture there? And how intensively?
 
Cool. Who else might grab Australia and New Zealand then? The Dutch? (Might overstretch them a little...)
No Manifest Destiny, the prairies stay remotely Hispanic / independent, earlier abolition of slavery, means a more industrial US.
Perhaps even one with a seriously organised labour movement and its own Labour Party later on?
What about expansion Northwestwards? Alaska stays Russian? The vast woodlands, would the Commonwealth venture there? And how intensively?

Well, I think the Commonwealth gains full by independence by the mid-1800s, and does end up buying Alaska. Also, Texas declares independence, and Mexico keeps Arizona and Colorado.
 
Apart from the full independence part, this is singularly similar to North America as envisioned by Dreyfus and Turtledove in The Two Georges. I'd suggest grabbing a copy of that novel and take it from there.

Really? That's odd, because I've never read Two Georges.
Well, in my TL, North America is not all Westminster-style in its government. It still has states, and the Senate still serves the same purpose as in OTL.
Also, Quebec and Texas are independent countries.
 
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Georges still has individual states also. On the other hand, the Senate isn't mentioned at all. Also, Quebec and Texas (the latter renamed) is part of the North American Union, which encompasses all of what we know now as the US plus Canada minus Alaska and (I think) Hawaii.
 
Georges still has individual states also. On the other hand, the Senate isn't mentioned at all. Also, Quebec and Texas (the latter renamed) is part of the North American Union, which encompasses all of what we know now as the US plus Canada minus Alaska and (I think) Hawaii.

I was just looking at a map for the Two Georges TL. That's one hell of a Britwank!

But in my TL, the Commonwealth of North America is not part of the British Empire, it is a sovereign federation with close cultural and political ties to Britain.
 
In my TL, there is distinct lack of Manifest Destiny.
Texas is a sovereign state, but Mexico still controls California, Arizona, Nevada, New Mexico, Utah, and Colorado.
 
Why would the thirteen colonies form a country when thete were 17 British colonies on mainland North America? Anyway there are loads of threads on this. Unless you have a specific question I'd recommend using the search function.
 
Why would the thirteen colonies form a country when thete were 17 British colonies on mainland North America? Anyway there are loads of threads on this. Unless you have a specific question I'd recommend using the search function.

Actually, I wanted to refine and discuss my own specific TL.

And on the subject of the 17 colonies: the other four colonies did not want to be part of this country, especially Lower Canada (now Quebec).
 
And just to mention, the Commonwealth contributed troops to the British army and navy during the Napoleonic Wars, and because of this, Britain let them claim the Louisiana Territory after Napoleon's defeat.
Also, the Honourable Sir Andrew Jackson fought alongside the Duke of Wellington during the Peninsular Campaign.
 
It's very, very unlikely that TTL's Commonwealth doesn't end up with California, at least. OTL, both the British and Americans wanted it, and they'll both be applying pressure ITTL. Manifest Destiny will still be a thing, indeed it might accelerated by no War of 1812 or Revolution. If the Napoleonic Wars play out the same, I could see the British+Americans seizing a whole lot of both Spain's and France's colonial Empire, including the American Southwest, Florida, Louisiana, California, even Northern Mexico. The only real limit is how far their logistics allow them to go...
 
I was imagining a TL where the American Founding Fathers reached an agreement with the British government. They agreed that the Thirteen Colonies would become a semi-independent state responsible for its own domestic policy and taxation. This new nation must accept the British monarch as head of state, but is run in practice by a semi-Westminster system headed by a Prime Minister.
Liberal and Conservative parties form, but have different platforms than in Britain.
The Liberals are pro-centralization and want to build up industry, while the Conservatives believe the individual states should wield greater power and pull support from the old planter families of the South.

I don't know how they come to such a resolution yet, but I have an idea of what takes place afterwards.
The Louisiana Territory is added to the Colonies' holdings after Napoleon is defeated, and in the 1830s, Upper Canada joins the young nation. A decade later, a series of rebellions break out in the South due to the push in Parliament to abolish slavery.
They gained full independence in the 1820s.

How would this change American culture and history?

Hey there! This is an interesting TL idea, but don't you mean the 1840s instead of 1820s, for the abolition of slavery, and the secession of the South?
 
Manifest Destiny legitimised Western settlement, it didn't cause it. A British America would still be settling empty Mexican land, just with a different rationale. They certainly has their own equivalents: just look to British Israelism and the rhetoric of Kipling and Rhodes.

Why would the Brits give independence to a place that will soon have a larger population than them as a single nation? They will want to divide and rule. If there is an overarching loose structure they will stay within it.

You also need to wonder what the plan for Southern independence would be. An export economy going to war with the country that you sell all your exports to is a good way to collapse your economy even in a winning scenario.
 
Manifest Destiny legitimised Western settlement, it didn't cause it. A British America would still be settling empty Mexican land, just with a different rationale. They certainly has their own equivalents: just look to British Israelism and the rhetoric of Kipling and Rhodes.

Why would the Brits give independence to a place that will soon have a larger population than them as a single nation? They will want to divide and rule. If there is an overarching loose structure they will stay within it.

You also need to wonder what the plan for Southern independence would be. An export economy going to war with the country that you sell all your exports to is a good way to collapse your economy even in a winning scenario.

Well, the Southerners didn't have a plan for independence. They weren't fighting a war so much as instigating a series of riots and isolated uprisings.
 
And just to mention, the Commonwealth contributed troops to the British army and navy during the Napoleonic Wars, and because of this, Britain let them claim the Louisiana Territory after Napoleon's defeat.
Also, the Honourable Sir Andrew Jackson fought alongside the Duke of Wellington during the Peninsular Campaign.
Even if the POD were before the incident where a British officer viciously slashed at an adolescent Andrew Jackson for not shining his boots, I can't imagine the British would tolerate having a colonial lawyer or tradesman of extremely humble origins and no distinguished family nor lineage being a general officer in the company of the likes of Arthur Wellesly.
 
Even if the POD were before the incident where a British officer viciously slashed at an adolescent Andrew Jackson for not shining his boots, I can't imagine the British would tolerate having a colonial lawyer or tradesman of extremely humble origins and no distinguished family nor lineage being a general officer in the company of the likes of Arthur Wellesly.

Well, I phrased that wrong. Jackson was a Lt.-Colonel in the Colonial Corps in the British Army. The American officers in the Colonial Corps were more merit-oriented in who they promoted, much to the chagrin of their British colleagues.
Several British officers filed reports against Jackson for not showing 'the proper deference'.
 
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